VIC-Xmas 2016 Case-Swap Recipe (Cocko's place)

[technobabble66]

Update time!

Discovered (i.e.: read the last bit of the recipe properly) that the correct temp for fermentation is more like 25°C rather than the 18-19°C i originally thought - and needed to maintain to contain the overflowing krausen
So ~2/3rds of the way through the fermentation i started ramping the temp a degree per day up to ~24°C yesterday.
Also did the syrup additions in 2 lots. The first was ~2/3rds through the expected fermentation, SG ~1.030. The 2nd was today, when the SG~1.018.
I increased the syrup addition from 1.14kg total to 1.5kg total (so 2x 750g additions), to compensate for what seems to be a slightly low OG (1.069 down from the expected 1.076) - should add an extra 4 points.

Ideally i would've added the 2 additions a little earlier, say ~40% remaining attenuation rather than 30% for the first one; and the 2nd addition a day earlier to be more like 30% remaining attenuation. These additions were delayed as i wasn't sure if the first one would cause another krause explosion. In hindsight, this wouldn't have been a problem.
Also, when i repeat this i'd start the fermentation ~4°C higher and maintain that, as it's expected to improve the flavour/aroma profile. I guess i'll wait and see as to whether my lower fermentation temps has any significant impact.

Finally, on further research, i also realised that the D2 we're using is a bit lighter in colour compared to the CSI D-180 that the recipe is designed for. I'm inclined to think (/hope!) that this won't have a large detrimental effect on the flavour/aroma, largely because the D2 is from one of the main candy syrup suppliers in Belgium so it's of the highest quality & i'm assuming it'll have all the depth and complexity that we want. The only real difference is our clone might be a little lighter in colour. Also, assuming Westvleteren use D2 or something like it, i can only guess they use a little Spec B or more D2 to achieve the colour of the original Westy 12. Another option to compensate might be to use a little extra D2 for priming - it's effectivelyan extra 100-200g into the recipe.

Hydro sample smelling and tasting fantastic!

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Nice work techno, thanks for the update. Key information for those slackers in the group (I'm lookin` at myself in the mirror).

The good news for most of us with this being potentially different to the original Westy 12 is we've never tried one, seen one or will likely have one in the near future haha! I however, do pray every night that one will end up in the International Beer Collector monthly 6-pack.

I shall adapt your advise for higher fermentation temp and had planned on using 2x D2 containers for ease also. For adding did you dilute with 50% water and boiled for 15 mins, cooled then added/stirred as per instructions on the website?

 

[technobabble66]

No worries! Yeah, it's not like we have a yardstick to compare with, hey?!

For adding did you dilute with 50% water and boiled for 15 mins, cooled then added/stirred as per instructions on the website?

Yep, did that. Well, i probably added a little less water and boiled for 5-10 mins.


... And if you get one through the IBC monthly pack, i'll probably be visiting shortly afterwards

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

You wouldn't be able to make it over fast enough!!! :chug:

 

[technobabble66]

Update:
one day later, down to SG=1.014, while at 25°C.
Pretty impressive - down 10 points in 1 day, even when it's already at ~9-9.5% alc.

Tastes even better today!
Easily the best Westy 12 i've ever had*
(holy cow, there's a bit of an alcohol kick to it!)




Sample size of 1

 

[technobabble66]

another 2 days have passed, now down to SG=1.010, temp held at ~26°C.

Hydro sample tastes a little like someone's put beer in my scotch. Sort of in a good way, but the alcohol is definitely not getting hidden in this one. Nice and smooth though. It does make me wonder what this would be like with some oak chips or a month in a barrel .... but i think i'll leave that to RIS-Man. :lol:

 

[technobabble66]

OK, 5 days later, still sitting at SG=1.010, temp held at 26°C for the first 3 days. Decided to bottle soon, so i've allowed it to free fall down to 18°C, which it hit last night.
I think i'll try for 2.4 vols CO2, and use the D2 for priming.

FWIW, i estimated the conversion of grams of Dex required to Prime to grams of Candi Syrup, to be a factor of 1.2727 to multiply the estimated Dex amount.

What volsCO2 have everyone else primed to?

I generally err on the side of underpriming rather than over, and i'm mindful of my FG being ~5 points higher than that reported by Wiggdude.


PS: the extra few days in the FV after hitting FG seems to have cleaned it up very well. Quite a dramatic change, actually - a nice plummy/cherry element starting to come through, i think. Tasting very very promising!

 

[TheWiggman]

Sounds like that infection streak has come to an end and what better time?
Strange you would have a different FG. Others have reported 1.006 and 7, I could have possibly under-read the FG like I have a habit of over-reading the OG. Yours is in the ballpark though so if it tastes clean, I reckon bottle it. 1.010 is a good finish, I can't imagine this is a beer you want to be dry.

 

[manticle]

FYI TB - starting such a big beer at 25 rather than 18 then letting rise later, probably would have made that alc hit a lot rougher. Happy accident on your part.

 

[malt junkie]

Tasted a 330ml bottle, now after 10 days in bottle yes I knew it was still way young and a little under on carbonation.
Findings were probably on par with where the beer is at, though still produced a tinny tight head, huge raisin and plumb notes quite overwhelming really, hops are firmly there. Like I said come August (comp season) this will be awesome!

Next bottle will be July, I expect this will be fairly well carbed by then and some of those big flavour notes to have melded and smoothed.

Thanks TB and all your brewday minions, another amazing brew gents!

 

[technobabble66]

FYI TB - starting such a big beer at 25 rather than 18 then letting rise later, probably would have made that alc hit a lot rougher. Happy accident on your part.

Yeah, I was sure the best idea (& advice) was to start this at 18 for a few days then raise it, as it seems to be the best option generally for bigger Belgians. So I was a bit surprised when I reread the csi recipe & hbt (?) clone thread that they suggested to start so high. Made me concerned that I'd be missing out on some awesomeness.
A teeny sample on bottling suggests otherwise. And yes, it's definitely a clean smooth alcoholic element, not a rough barnyard experience. So maybe a result of starting at 18 (?)

 

[technobabble66]

Tasted a 330ml bottle, now after 10 days in bottle yes I knew it was still way young and a little under on carbonation....

Lol, bottles a beer to age for 6-12 months, tries it after 10 days [emoji1]
Exactly what I'll be doing [emoji6]
Feck it, I've got 67 stubbies, so testing one each month isn't a biggie.
Great early tasting notes, & as you said, seems v promising for how it will age.

As for the thanks, it's appreciated(!), but I recall you were doing a fair bit of work on the day [emoji6] along with many others, so definitely a group effort shared by all. It's simply (very!) pleasing to see all of the hard work sloooooowly coming together to produce what hopefully will be a great & memorable beer for all of us, by all of us.
[emoji482][emoji41]

 

[technobabble66]

Sounds like that infection streak has come to an end and what better time?
Strange you would have a different FG. Others have reported 1.006 and 7, I could have possibly under-read the FG like I have a habit of over-reading the OG. Yours is in the ballpark though so if it tastes clean, I reckon bottle it. 1.010 is a good finish, I can't imagine this is a beer you want to be dry.

Yep. Halle ******* lujah!!! Hosanna in the highest!!
4 beers in now and no sign of infection. Much relieved!

And yes, I'm concerned I'm 5-6 points over where others have finished at. I hoping my brilliant skillz at minimizing yeast health [emoji17] has enabled it to *complete* its attenuation at the lower end of its range, have a tiny bit more oomph to do the secondary fermentation to prime it, then conk out.
I've had an issue with bigger beers or lower attenuating yeasts (eg: 1469) gradually over carbing over long time periods, so we'll see how it goes. I'd guess the first 12 months will be fine but it might get interesting after that.
I went with bottling immediately as the last big beer I did that under attenuated, the wee heavy done with WLP-028, I left sit for 3-4 weeks to try to knock off the last 3-4 points. It didn't attenuate any further then got an infection starting at the top.
So given the Westy12 dropped fairly quickly and consistently to 1.010 then flatlined, & it's a point or 2 under the estimated FG, I'm preferring/hoping to believe it's hit its FG.

And therefore my awesome brewing skillz have successfully overcome adversity & you bozos who have foolishly optimized your yeast health have cocked it up. [emoji15][emoji1]
**** brewing skillz FTW!!
... Or I now have 67 glass grenades sitting in my spare room. [emoji51]

So yeah, in summary, an oxygen set is going to be the next brewery upgrade [emoji57]

 

[VP Brewing]

This is mine bottled 2-1-17. Man this is taking ages to carb up but it's getting there. Just used carb drops which have never failed me. Last try was 4 weeks ago when baby VP arrived and it has improved heaps in carb and smoothness since then.

Edit: might add this was after a bit of a swirl to get some foam happening.

 

[TheWiggman]

**** man, had no idea. Congratulations, can't wait for the midyear swap to see how much you've matured and to hear all your spew and sleep deprivation stories.

 

[VP Brewing]

Cheers wiggman. Warm spew running down your back at 3 in the morning is one of life's pleasures. Little dude is going well.

 

[mofox1]

Ha! Check back in 4 months... you ain't going to know your own name. 'though truth be told I had a horrible nightmare of a first born, bless his wee black heart.

 

[technobabble66]

10 days in the bottle, so of course I had to try a bottle. MJ can't have all the fun!

Eddie betts in the background. Another Dark Strong champion (though not Belgian) [emoji1]

Similarly to MJ, already shaping up after a tiny bit of time in the bottle. Definitely looking forward to trying it at 3 months, let alone 6 & 12.
Nice subtle caramel element and a slight candy-like element that I find most Belgian strongs seem to have; I assume both of these will develop significantly over time. A noticeable earthy element I've found in other beers bittered with Magnum, so I'm guessing it's from that, and hopefully it'll mellow out a little more into the background to get the right balance (pretty sure it will).

Very promising! [emoji4]

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

^^ Stu's version tasted magnificent the other night.

I've now pitched mine onto a WLP530 yeast cake, O2 the wort and it's sitting at 19.5C (fridge will bring down to 19C). I measured the OG and got 1.073. Tasted the wort also and wow, huge bitterness that melds lovely with the sugaz. Can't wait for this one to be in the bottles!!!

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

So this bad boy fired up to continuously bubbling the blow off water within 8 hrs!! Checked this morning and it was violently bubbling the blow off, had no time to do anything before work so I think I'm set for coming home to a bit of a mess [emoji51]