New Oxygenation Method

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

The easiest and cheapest way of adding a timer is to use a mains timer; this one is $5.50.

I could easily add a timer to the controller but then I'd need an interface (HMI) so the user could control it. That blows the cost out completely.

I also looked at controlling it via phone app but that looks to be about $10k in development expenses. I can't see that flying either.

 

[malt junkie]

Making the thing foolproof has been surprisingly expensive.

So glad your designing specifically for me!
Does the main stem need to be glass, I like robustness, and for most things near my beer stainless. Also would mean the device could be welded into a stainless fermenter.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

It has to be an insulator, which stainless isn't.

I would also strongly advise against leaving the device in place. You couldn't weld it in place anyway as the two electrodes need to be isolated.

I tried a tougher plastic tube but the thermal expansion makes heat sterilisation problematic. In the end I decided that the obvious fagility of glass will encourage people to handle it carefully. This will hopefully help protect the platinum coating on the anode which is the weakest point (and also the most expensive).

 

[malt junkie]

Damn!!! Do you know how many glass Hydrometers I've been through! For some reason just because they are so fragile, they have this innate gravitation to falling from great heights. I was barred from buying hydrometers for a year at one point.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

It's not that bad.

The glass is lab grade borosilicate tube 1.5mm wall thickness, plus it is bonded to the stainless central conductor with high grade epoxy. Don't go playing sword fights with it, otherwise you'll be OK.

 

[FarsideOfCrazy]

Just a thought LC, not sure how many you're likely to sell but is worth trying to sell then through LHBS's? How many is too many to sell through an online site?

 

[malt junkie]

I think you'll find our yanky friends will go nuts for these, probably easier for LC to bulk ship to retailers there.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

So glad your designing specifically for me!
Does the main stem need to be glass, I like robustness, and for most things near my beer stainless. Also would mean the device could be welded into a stainless fermenter.

It has to be an insulator, which stainless isn't.

Actually, thinking about it, I could make the main stem stainless, sleeve the inner conductor and cast silicone seals into the ends. If you want to try this configuration I have the materials on hand.

 

[malt junkie]

Actually, thinking about it, I could make the main stem stainless, sleeve the inner conductor and cast silicone seals into the ends. If you want to try this configuration I have the materials on hand.

I'm looking at the KK kegmenter, and already have the thermowell to be welded to the lid, I don't think it would be a simple task to build this device to withstand 30 PSIG. My original thought was maintaining the sealed integrity of the fermenter and have this also mounted in the triclove lid, with sealed transfers. If the entire length of the tube were silicone filled, and the upper anode(?) were fixed (obviously specific to the fermenter) it may well hold pressure, but I'm no engineer.

Perhaps at this point pressure fermentation is just an added complication to a well thought out simple device.

ED: There are presently around 4 different common pressure fermenters used here, then Sankes in the states and varrious size unitanks from SS brewtech, and Spike brewing. A simple molded rod specific to each (obviously a premium product) with the top being male thread where the cables exits, it would then be a matter for the brewer to add the socket to their setup. Hell KK could just add it to the current lid molding of the fermentasuarus.

Another thought is HDPE injection, but perhaps a year or 2 after initial launch.

 

[pcqypcqy]

Depending on where your final retail price comes in, the price point sounds like it'll be competitive with a half decent oxygen bottle set up.

I'm currently looking at going the O2 cylinder from bunnings, so that's a $200 deposit tied up on top of the costs of the wand, stones and regulator. So say you're talking $40 for wand and stone, $75 for a halfway decent regulator, $69 for the bunnings d-size cylinder (and ignoring the deposit, I'm looking at $185 right there.

The brewman kit is $175 but that doesn't even include the wand I don't believe, looks like it's a neat $200 with the wand.

So anything that comes in around the $200 mark will be competitive, and as someone mentioned earlier avoids the need to store oxygen.

 

[malt junkie]

Excuse my rudimentary drawings

 

[malt junkie]

So my thoughts were SS tube with slip fittings (elbows and tees) and threaded bulkhead/ screw to welded fitting type setup with all peices welded or silver soldered. HDPE filling just cause it's harder wearing will hold the bottom probe firmly in place. Lets face it, breaking this would probably require you beating some poor home invader to death with it.

Ok so my first drawing specifically for the fermentasuarus as it has a reinforced section near the based for an optional bulkhead racking arm.
Second drawing for instalation from the top of any vessel, obviously differing lengths would be required to suit.

HDPE injection is actually quite easy, with your skills and equipment you'd probably build one (plastics injector) in a few hrs.

Thoughts?

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

So my thoughts were SS tube with slip fittings (elbows and tees) and threaded bulkhead/ screw to welded fitting type setup with all peices welded or silver soldered. HDPE filling just cause it's harder wearing will hold the bottom probe firmly in place. Lets face it, breaking this would probably require you beating some poor home invader to death with it.

Ok so my first drawing specifically for the fermentasuarus as it has a reinforced section near the based for an optional bulkhead racking arm.
Second drawing for instalation from the top of any vessel, obviously differing lengths would be required to suit.

HDPE injection is actually quite easy, with your skills and equipment you'd probably build one (plastics injector) in a few hrs.

Thoughts?

Nice idea but I'm avoiding the use of low temperature materials so I'd probably fill it with two part silicone.

The other difficulty is the electrical connection to the anode. No conductive material that is at anode potential can be exposed to the working fluid other than the platinum surface of the anode itself. If this is allowed to happen all hell breaks loose.

BTW for a while I ran a section of a food factory which used several twin screw APV extruders, so I'm moderately familiar with the technology.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

BTW 2cranky has just pointed out that this won't fit a wide mouth drum type fermenter without it being modified. Easiest mod I can see is to cut a 50mm hole in the fermenter lid and fit a silicone wine bung.

I'm going to try getting hold of one of those lids and see what I can come up with.

 

[n87]

BTW 2cranky has just pointed out that this won't fit a wide mouth drum type fermenter without it being modified. Easiest mod I can see is to cut a 50mm hole in the fermenter lid and fit a silicone wine bung.

Glad wrap

I will add that if selling to the states, consider if it fits through a narrow necked carboy

 

[malt junkie]

Would an etching on the top probe be possible (to show liquid level) for the completely clueless? or an SS float (isolated with silicone) that way the device will work at it's optimum even when blind filling even though your timing maybe be slightly short or long.

ED: ignore me how could I forget wort gravity.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Stainless

Stainless version is now a goer.

I used a bit of Torlon (polyamide/imide) that I happened to have lying around to form the end piece, future versions I'll probably use PEEK.

 

[malt junkie]

Nice idea but I'm avoiding the use of low temperature materials so I'd probably fill it with two part silicone.

The other difficulty is the electrical connection to the anode. No conductive material that is at anode potential can be exposed to the working fluid other than the platinum surface of the anode itself. If this is allowed to happen all hell breaks loose.

BTW for a while I ran a section of a food factory which used several twin screw APV extruders, so I'm moderately familiar with the technology.

Does this mean those with stainless fermenters should NOT have the probe resting on the bottom?

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Yes, there will be a small plastic cap that fits over the end of the anode to prevent contact with a stainless fermenter. It also serves to protect the platinum from the stainless: platinum is a bit harder than gold but much softer than steel.

 

[peteru]

BTW: @Lyrebird_Cycles, clicking on the pictures leads to a Flickr page that informs me that the photos are private and can not be viewed. Would be nice to get a better look at a hi-res picture.