GUTEN

[lespaul]

Yeh scorching before the boil.
I didn't have the top plate on this brew incase it was too fine and I had to stir it. Think this could have also caused the grain to get below the malt pipe? Maybe because the top plate wasn't there the bottom plate wasn't stabilised?

 

[Neil Buttriss]

How fast is the pump set, you say it doesn't get into the overflow but what is your grain bill total, do you use both the pipes. If the pipes are well above the mash then it won't overflow but if you run your pump to fast then all or most of the wort is above your mash so theres not enough in the bottom of the kettle. I use the lifting pins as a guide I get the pump going slowly then adjust it until the level remains about 5 mm below the top of the pins, the way I see it is if I do this then my flow rate is the same top and below, I usually either hit my targets or am more efficient than my target.

 

[altone]

How fast is the pump set, you say it doesn't get into the overflow but what is your grain bill total, do you use both the pipes. If the pipes are well above the mash then it won't overflow but if you run your pump to fast then all or most of the wort is above your mash so theres not enough in the bottom of the kettle. I use the lifting pins as a guide I get the pump going slowly then adjust it until the level remains about 5 mm below the top of the pins, the way I see it is if I do this then my flow rate is the same top and below, I usually either hit my targets or am more efficient than my target.

Exactly how I do it too. Yes it's possible there's insufficient in the base and that could cause the scorching.
Also the fine mill would make it easier for grain to slip past the baseplate and loose overflow pipe.
@lespaul Did you taste the wort before dumping it? Just because you've got scorch marks doesn't mean the brew is a write off.

 

[wide eyed and legless]

I have found with a fair bit of corn in the grain bill the bottom will scorch during the mash, I would suggest it does with a large grain bill too, even with an even flow going through the return pipe. Twice now I have emptied the wort, cleaned the scorch off the bottom put the wort back into the kettle and proceed to boil, easy to tell if the bottom is scorched by the strength of the boil.

 

[goatchop41]

I'll check when I get home. I have the bump facing up.
How loose should the pipe be screwed into the bottom plate? I had it a tiny bit loose so if I moved it, it wouldn't move the bottom plate and let any grain slip by.
Only other thing is I stirred the grain after mashing in and scraped the bottom plate. Not sure if that could affect it.

Should be tight. If your bottom plate fits properly, then a little movement of the overflow pipe shouldn't move the plate.

Have a good look at the fit of your bottom plate on the bottom of the malt pipe. If the plate is a bit bent, or the lip on the bottom of the malt pipe isn't uniform, then that is likely your issue

 

[lespaul]

Thanks for all the responses.
Grain bill was 9.6kg and 30lt water. I adjusted the flow so that the water level sits just below the return pipe (maybe 3cm) and is stable. I use both pipes.
Does look like there is a gap in the bottom of the malt pipe. It's not big but moving it around it doesn't feel like it wants to sit properly. Might be the culprit!
Other than that I've got no idea?
Maybe too high power setting for the mash? 2800w. I suppose I could just ramp it up slowly with ~1500w and once the malts out or its running clear increase it.

 

[altone]

Thanks for all the responses.
Grain bill was 9.6kg and 30lt water. I adjusted the flow so that the water level sits just below the return pipe (maybe 3cm) and is stable. I use both pipes.
Does look like there is a gap in the bottom of the malt pipe. It's not big but moving it around it doesn't feel like it wants to sit properly. Might be the culprit!
Other than that I've got no idea?
Maybe too high power setting for the mash? 2800w. I suppose I could just ramp it up slowly with ~1500w and once the malts out or its running clear increase it.

The screen and pipe should sit tight so maybe that's it.
Like I think I said earlier I only use full wattage to heat the water to mash temp and later bring to the boil (A 1 minute step to hit temp)
Other than that I set to 1800w for no reason other than avoiding scorching etc.
In my 40l unit 1800w is also enough to maintain a decent rolling boil, if yours is a 50l which it sounds like, you'd need to raise it a fair bit higher.

Hope you get it sorted quickly as it's a great bit of kit.

 

[krz]

Thanks for all the responses.
Grain bill was 9.6kg and 30lt water. I adjusted the flow so that the water level sits just below the return pipe (maybe 3cm) and is stable. I use both pipes.
Does look like there is a gap in the bottom of the malt pipe. It's not big but moving it around it doesn't feel like it wants to sit properly. Might be the culprit!
Other than that I've got no idea?
Maybe too high power setting for the mash? 2800w. I suppose I could just ramp it up slowly with ~1500w and once the malts out or its running clear increase it.

Like altone said, I usually bring my 50L Guten to mash temp using 3000W, then I mash at 1800W, then bring to the boil using 3000W and boil at 2200W.
No significant scorching.

 

[goatchop41]

Thanks for all the responses.
Grain bill was 9.6kg and 30lt water. I adjusted the flow so that the water level sits just below the return pipe (maybe 3cm) and is stable. I use both pipes.
Does look like there is a gap in the bottom of the malt pipe. It's not big but moving it around it doesn't feel like it wants to sit properly. Might be the culprit!
Other than that I've got no idea?

You'll need to work out whether it is the screen that is bent, or if the lip that it sits on that is bent. You may be able to bend either back in to shape (or better than what it is right now)

 

[lespaul]

Hrm... I'd say for the money I spent I'm going to get kegking to fix the problem

 

[malt and barley blues]

May be a stupid question but you are using the white cap when doughing in?

 

[goatchop41]

May be a stupid question but you are using the white cap when doughing in?

Yes. I have seen others use a piece of silicone tube or the bazooka instead though

 

[devoutharpist]

out of interest, what negative side effects does a scorch during the mash have? I had some scorching after my last brew, could have happened through the mash as i had the power up relatively high

 

[wide eyed and legless]

No effect whatsoever, just a bit of sugar loss, can happen during mash and boil. Nothing to worry about.

 

[altone]

out of interest, what negative side effects does a scorch during the mash have? I had some scorching after my last brew, could have happened through the mash as i had the power up relatively high

Like WEAL said unless it's massive black run-dry type scorching in which case your wort might get a nasty bitter taste.
If it tastes alright - no foul.

 

[wide eyed and legless]

I have thought about making up some cutting paste and getting a mirror finish on the bottom of the Guten that should stop any sugar getting a grip, been busy lately, so still just thinking about it.

 

[lespaul]

May be a stupid question but you are using the white cap when doughing in?

Yeh, been using the white cap for dough in.
So is the top filter plate a necessity or even desirable?

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Yeh, been using the white cap for dough in.
So is the top filter plate a necessity or even desirable?

I don't use mine, but in saying that I have the handle holes completely blocked, I find the grain bed floats around more not being compressed between two plates.

 

[goatchop41]

So is the top filter plate a necessity or even desirable?

It can stop the recirc arm from boring a hole in the grain bed whilst it's flowing (that's if you're not attaching silicone tubing from the arm to the grain bed), but it is especially useful when sparging, as it ensures that the sparge water spreads evenly over the bed

 

[devoutharpist]

Brewing a barleywine in the Guten this weekend. 9.5kg of grain (plus some rice hulls), what could possibly go wrong.............