Fermzilla

[Nullnvoid]

He is his own doctor but we were not in a hurry to have him review something that was still having tweaks done to it. Unlike David Heath who "reviewed - if you can call it that" our products that we asked him not to review we find the Doc is a man of his word. No doubt he will do it when he is good and ready.

He is painful to watch, he better not be a doctor

 

[Nullnvoid]

Can't wait for one of the KK employees to find the latest explosion on Facebook and put a picture up here.

 

[Fro-Daddy]

I just saw it, pretty impressive!

 

[Nullnvoid]

I just saw it, pretty impressive!

Sure was!

 

[malt and barley blues]

I just saw it, pretty impressive!

User error, as BB would say.

 

[donald_trub]

I just saw it, pretty impressive!

Not excusing KL at all... if it says it can handle 34 PSI, then it should... but why on earth does this guy need 20 PSI to simply transfer his beer? That seems like madness to me. Secondly, that banana peel he's created looks way more than 20 PSI!

 

[Fro-Daddy]

Secondly, that banana peel he's created looks way more than 20 PSI!

How the entire lid is separate confuses me, I'm thinking there was a lot more pressure as well.

Are there any videos of pressure testing any of the PET units until failure?

 

[CKK]

Not excusing KL at all... if it says it can handle 34 PSI, then it should... but why on earth does this guy need 20 PSI to simply transfer his beer? That seems like madness to me. Secondly, that banana peel he's created looks way more than 20 PSI!

You are right that to transfer beer one does not need a lot. However I can always see the scenario where a bit of trub or something clogs the line and you and I both know the first reaction will be to turn the pressure up. Where the neck joins the tank is a very important part of the structure and the manufacturing process where the PET is reheated leaves those stress cracks which indicate that this area is very vulnerable. For a tank like this to blow before the PRV activates to release the pressure is a design fault and a manufacturing fault.

 

[Meddo]

The PRVs used in these vessels release gas quite slowly through a small orifice - depending on the pressure level it's certainly conceivable that the PRV might not be able to release pressure quickly enough to prevent damage.

Not commenting on specific models or incidents, just a general observation.

 

[wide eyed and legless]

Could be the stress fractures around the male threading on the....... beat me to it.

 

[CKK]

The PRVs used in these vessels release gas quite slowly through a small orifice - depending on the pressure level it's certainly conceivable that the PRV might not be able to release pressure quickly enough to prevent damage.

Not commenting on specific models or incidents, just a general observation.

Let me run a test on this and I will let you know how that goes. We have never had one of ours fall apart like this. In fact during the high pressure Destructive testing on our 60 litre units the neck ring cracked before the vessel and that was over 5 bar.

 

[donald_trub]

We have never had one of ours fall apart like this.

You've also never had a customer base anywhere near as large as Kegland's. We're talking giant multiples the size of yours here. They are dominating the market and have a massive amount of people brand new to brewing getting into pressure fermenting when they should probably stick to buckets for a while.

and you and I both know the first reaction will be to turn the pressure up

Maybe that's your first reaction but I would connect the gas to the floating dip tube and blow it back through the other way.

It's clear as day that we're not looking at 20 PSI here, so stop talking about design flaws in other people's products and focus on yourselves.

 

[CKK]

You've also never had a customer base anywhere near as large as Kegland's. We're talking giant multiples the size of yours here. They are dominating the market and have a massive amount of people brand new to brewing getting into pressure fermenting when they should probably stick to buckets for a while.



Maybe that's your first reaction but I would connect the gas to the floating dip tube and blow it back through the other way.

It's clear as day that we're not looking at 20 PSI here, so stop talking about design flaws in other people's products and focus on yourselves.

That is just conjecture on your part unless you have some figures to prove it. Our products have actually been selling much longer in any case. On what basis is it not 20 psi? Plenty of people in Europe seeing catastrophic failures with even less presssure. Trust me that reheating PET is not a good way to have strength in the end product. That is not arguable.

Not sure what makes you an authority on who is allowed to pressure brew or not. If its not fit for a beginner then it should at least carry plenty of warnings about this would you not agree?

 

[Meddo]

Also regarding pressures used for transfer, I regularly pressurise the vessel to 2 bar to transfer carbonated beer via a filter to the receiving keg. I carbonate at around 0.8 bar while cold conditioning (I like many of my beers on the spritzy side), then set the high side pressure to 2 bar and the pressure relief on the receiving keg to 1.4-1.6 bar. This allows enough pressure differential across the filter that it doesn't take all day to transfer, but the receiving vessel is still pressurised well above the carbonation level of the beer to prevent breakout. Could probably use somewhat lower pressures but they're round numbers, easy to see on the gauge, and the three settings should be outside the margins of error on the gauges so as not to overlap unintentionally.

 

[donald_trub]

Our products have actually been selling much longer in any case.

That's right, back from when Kee designed the original Fermentasaurus.

On what basis is it not 20 psi?

Because it's exploded with nuclear force. Anyone can see that isn't 20 PSI and if you can't, maybe it's time to pack up shop because clearly you have no idea.

I never said I was an authority on who is allowed to do what, but merely providing an explanation that there are a tonne of people buying Kegland stuff. There are plenty of warnings on these devices already so I'm not sure what you're talking about there.

That is just conjecture on your part unless you have some figures to prove it.

Let's see... Google search analytics is showing double the search volume for Kegland compared to Keg King. Kegland's Facebook group is 10.6 times larger than your Facebook group. The numbers look even more grim if we count in the other Kegland focused groups such as the Brewzilla and Fermzilla groups (and of course factor in any associated KK groups). They have a tonne of fans out there and you're completely delusional if you think you're coming anywhere near that market share. They're currently the most innovative company in homebrewing, perhaps on a global scale. Funnily enough that innovation all started back from Kee worked for KK.

The fact is they have droves of beginner brewers coming to them and picking up these products that are slightly more advanced and require an understanding of physics that most don't have.

 

[CKK]

That's right, back from when Kee designed the original Fermentasaurus.


Because it's exploded with nuclear force. Anyone can see that isn't 20 PSI and if you can't, maybe it's time to pack up shop because clearly you have no idea.

I never said I was an authority on who is allowed to do what, but merely providing an explanation that there are a tonne of people buying Kegland stuff. There are plenty of warnings on these devices already so I'm not sure what you're talking about there.



Let's see... Google search analytics is showing double the search volume for Kegland compared to Keg King. Kegland's Facebook group is 10.6 times larger than your Facebook group. The numbers look even more grim if we count in the other Kegland focused groups such as the Brewzilla and Fermzilla groups (and of course factor in any associated KK groups). They have a tonne of fans out there and you're completely delusional if you think you're coming anywhere near that market share. They're currently the most innovative company in homebrewing, perhaps on a global scale. Funnily enough that innovation all started back from Kee worked for KK.

The fact is they have droves of beginner brewers coming to them and picking up these products that are slightly more advanced and require an understanding of physics that most don't have.

Nuclear force has not been required to blow them from any other pictures people have published so I am quite happy to accept the 20psi as I think most others are.

Now just go to the Kegland thread and see all the goings on about fake reviews etc. Even their use of www.kegking.cn shows how dodgy such approaches are. I remember how our kegs were made out to be bad and it was not even our keg. Same with taps - fake corrosion pics. They even still use our trademarks to try and drive website traffic to them. Maybe you think that is innovative?

With all your inside knowledge its obvious you have a fairly close association with Kee and Kegland so objectivity is most likely out the window. Tons of fans really? Tons of pissed of FZ customers who have lost a lot of beer and their faith in PET vessels. Guess it depends from where you sit as to what you see or want to see.

 

[CKK]

Also regarding pressures used for transfer, I regularly pressurise the vessel to 2 bar to transfer carbonated beer via a filter to the receiving keg. I carbonate at around 0.8 bar while cold conditioning (I like many of my beers on the spritzy side), then set the high side pressure to 2 bar and the pressure relief on the receiving keg to 1.4-1.6 bar. This allows enough pressure differential across the filter that it doesn't take all day to transfer, but the receiving vessel is still pressurised well above the carbonation level of the beer to prevent breakout. Could probably use somewhat lower pressures but they're round numbers, easy to see on the gauge, and the three settings should be outside the margins of error on the gauges so as not to overlap unintentionally.

Well that would be about 29 psi Meddo which I think the tank should easily handle. Sounds an ok way to do it from where I stand.

 

[Meddo]

Well that would be about 29 psi Meddo which I think the tank should easily handle. Sounds an ok way to do it from where I stand.

Yeah it's will within rated working pressure, just addressing the scepticism about why someone would use that sort of pressure. Just because YOU don't do something (the generic "you", not you Will) doesn't mean someone else doesn't have a good reason to do so.

 

[donald_trub]

With all your inside knowledge its obvious you have a fairly close association with Kee and Kegland

If you actually checked the other thread you'd realise I was the one who raised the fake reviews and have been very critical of them throughout that whole thread. Just as I'm doing to you here. The difference is Kegland don't seem to argue with their customer base like this.

It's not our problem you didn't protect your trademarks globally, so stop mentioning it. Take them to court if you think you have a legal standing. I'm guessing you don't have a case which is why you spend your time bitching about it here instead.

ons of fans really?

Yes, like I said. More than 10 times the fans that KegKing have. They are doing a lot of things right.

 

[malt and barley blues]

You've also never had a customer base anywhere near as large as Kegland's. We're talking giant multiples the size of yours here. They are dominating the market and have a massive amount of people brand new to brewing getting into pressure fermenting when they should probably stick to buckets for a while.

Quite common for companies to have what is known as 'initial momentum' the hardest part is keeping it.

That's right, back from when Kee designed the original Fermentasaurus.

Because it's exploded with nuclear force.

The fact is they have droves of beginner brewers coming to them and picking up these products that are slightly more advanced and require an understanding of physics that most don't have.

Sorry to disappoint you Kee didn't come up with the idea of conical plastic fermenters that was Fastferment.

The FermZilla is fitted with a safety PRV 34 PSI so should be able to withstand a far greater pressure than the 34 PSI, with so many fermenter bodies tearing apart, (one was at 10 PSI) there is a problem, and a brewer with a Masters in Physics will be at just as much risk.. I know a lot of pics posted are the collection bottles with the valve closed but there have been quite a few where the fermenter body has ripped apart.