Different wort aeration kits

[Zorco]

Time of Useful Consciousness

This is the time available to an aircrew member to recognize they are suffering from hypoxia and to take appropriate action (put on an oxygen mask and/or descend the aircraft below 10,000 feet).

The Time of Useful Consciousness is a function of altitude. At 20,000 feet, an average individual will have 5 to 12 minutes. At 25,000 feet, this time is reduced to 3 to 5 minutes. At 30,000 feet only 1 to 2 minutes are available. By 40,000 feet, the average individual will have only 9 to 15 seconds (basically this represents the oxygen that was in their system before the exposure to 40,000 feet).

I find this effect of humans fascinating.

http://m.wimp.com/hypoxia-when-the-brain-is-deprived-of-adequate-oxygen-supply/

 

[jphowman]

The oxygen is given off could be collected in a bag.
The oxygen on planes is chemicaly produced.

You might be thinking of KO2

It's the stuff found in self rescuers that need to be worn when going into an underground mine.
Apparently the reaction in quite exothermic, and have been known to get hot enough to burn people while they are in use.

Probably still more expensive than bottled O2 though

 

[manticle]

I want to see someone separate oxygen from hydrogen peroxide, created by adding sodium percarbonate to hot water and collect that oxygen in a bag, stick a hose on the bag and then float the bag in some water to oxygenate some wort.
Post pics or a youtube video and if you can, try and measure with a DO meter too.

 

[mofox1]

I want to see someone separate oxygen from hydrogen peroxide, created by adding sodium percarbonate to hot water and collect that oxygen in a bag, stick a hose on the bag and then float the bag in some water to oxygenate some wort.
Post pics or a youtube video and if you can, try and measure with a DO meter too.

I'm generally just amused when people light their farts. ^That seems like a whole lotta effort.

 

[TheWiggman]

Came in here to read up on the wort aeration kits thread. Have been given a bum steer. Abandoning.

 

[wynnum1]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ValuJet_Flight_592



Investigation
The NTSB investigation[1] eventually determined that the fire that downed Flight 592 began in a cargo compartment below the passenger cabin. The cargo compartment was a Class D design, in which fire suppression is accomplished by sealing off the hold from outside air. Any fire in such an airtight compartment would quickly exhaust all available oxygen and then burn itself out. As the fire suppression is accomplished without any intervention by the crew, such holds are not equipped with smoke detectors. However, the NTSB determined that just before takeoff, over 100[14] expired chemical oxygen generators were placed in the cargo compartment in five boxes marked COMAT (company material) by ValuJet's maintenance contractor, SabreTech, in contravention of FAA regulations forbidding the transport of hazardous materials in aircraft cargo holds. Failure to cover the generators' firing pins with the prescribed plastic caps made an accidental activation much more likely. The investigation revealed that rather than covering the firing pins, the SabreTech workers simply duct-taped the cords around the cans, or cut them, and used tape to stick the ends down. The cylindrical, tennis-ball-can-sized generators also may have been loaded on board in the mistaken belief that they were just empty canisters, thus being certified as safe to transport in an aircraft cargo compartment. SabreTech employees indicated on the cargo manifest that the "oxy canisters" were "empty" instead of being expired oxygen generators. ValuJet employees interpreted this to mean they were empty oxygen canisters, when in fact they were neither simple oxygen canisters, nor empty.[15] A worker then loosely packed the oxygen canisters in several cardboard boxes with a layer of bubble wrap.
Chemical oxygen generators, when activated, produce oxygen for passengers if the plane suffers an decompression. As a byproduct of the exothermic chemical reaction, they also produce a great quantity of heat. These two factors together were sufficient not only to start an accidental fire, but also to produce enough oxygen to keep the fire burning. The fire risk was made much worse by the presence of combustible aircraft wheels in the hold. Two main tires (one not mounted) and a nose tire and wheel were also included in the list of material shipped as COMAT. NTSB investigators theorized that when the plane experienced a slight jolt while taxiing on the runway, an oxygen generator activated, producing oxygen and heat. Over time, as the DC-9 was taxiing to its takeoff position, the surface of the activated generator got hotter and hotter. Soon, the heat ignited the cardboard box and bubble wrap, allowing the fire to start.
Laboratory testing showed that canisters of the same type could heat nearby materials up to 500 °F (260 °C), enough to ignite a smoldering fire. The oxygen from the generators fed the resulting fire in the cargo hold without any need for outside air, defeating the airtight fire suppression design.

 

[manticle]

Ctrl c is strong with this one.

 

[gap]

Yes, the post has punctuation marks.

 

[MastersBrewery]

So safe to say chemically oxygenating wort on an airbourne aircraft is ill advised.
Good to know. Wasn't on my list of brewing must dos, think I'll play it safe and continue to brew on terraferma.

 

[Mardoo]

Can this conversation find somewhere else to live?

 

[Zorco]

I think it has been an excellent evolution/excursion from the original topic.

The caliber of the AHB community is impressive.

So, this is a different wort aeration solution.

I was at a roadside giveaway and the property rep had a huge O2 cylinder inside (like chest high). So I was interested and took the cylinder home. Upon setting it up with not much experience - savvy enough to tie it up and be highly respectful of compressed fluids - I test opened the valve (no stem or reg) and there was gas inside still.

Beauty. Free O2. But I have just put on a birthday party for my son, ordered kegs with Yob et.al. and I don't have funds for the regulator setup yet.

But since I wanted to oxygenate my wort for the first time, I found a 1/2" BSP fitting with compression to beerline on the other end then teflon taped the beheezus out of it and installed.

Choke flow (and a good valve) means I can deliver O2 at a sensible rate.

I'm not that pleased with my risk taking but on the same hand, it feels sound. I've ordered an O2 reg kit for next month's pay and all will be good from now on.

Not sure if there are risks I've overlooked so happy for feedback.

Cheers

 

[Chridech]

Out of interest, as I don't have a flow meter on my oxygen bottle, what does 1L/min look like on the surface of your wort? I turn the oxygen on enough that it is just breaking the surface with bubbles. Would this be close to what your flow rate gives?

Oxygenating today's brew. 1L/min using a medical oxygen reg. and a 2 micron scintered stone. Here's what it looks like. Bubbles break the surface and mound up by approx 2cm in a 5cm radius. Good layer of foam across the whole wort after a minute.

https://vimeo.com/168523215

 

[danestead]

Oxygenating today's brew. 1L/min using a medical oxygen reg. and a 2 micron scintered stone. Here's what it looks like. Bubbles break the surface and mound up by approx 2cm in a 5cm radius. Good layer of foam across the whole wort after a minute.

https://vimeo.com/168523215

Cool, cheers. I think I aerate slightly less than that.

 

[GalBrew]

I think it has been an excellent evolution/excursion from the original topic.

The caliber of the AHB community is impressive.

So, this is a different wort aeration solution.

I was at a roadside giveaway and the property rep had a huge O2 cylinder inside (like chest high). So I was interested and took the cylinder home. Upon setting it up with not much experience - savvy enough to tie it up and be highly respectful of compressed fluids - I test opened the valve (no stem or reg) and there was gas inside still.

Beauty. Free O2. But I have just put on a birthday party for my son, ordered kegs with Yob et.al. and I don't have funds for the regulator setup yet.

But since I wanted to oxygenate my wort for the first time, I found a 1/2" BSP fitting with compression to beerline on the other end then teflon taped the beheezus out of it and installed.

Choke flow (and a good valve) means I can deliver O2 at a sensible rate.

I'm not that pleased with my risk taking but on the same hand, it feels sound. I've ordered an O2 reg kit for next month's pay and all will be good from now on.

Not sure if there are risks I've overlooked so happy for feedback.

Cheers

I wouldn't be doing that. I would only use proper oxygen rated equipment with oxygen, it's not the safest stuff.

 

[wynnum1]

"huge O2 cylinder " Even if the tank is out of date would think that using as a air tank and decanting oxygen from oxygen cylinder through regulator would be safe as would be fraction of its original rating .

 

[Crusty]

For those of you that have the Brewman wort oxygenation setup, does the regulator allow you to set a certain flow indicated by the gauge or is the gauge simply to show you how much gas you have left in the cylinder.
I'm looking into oxygen at the moment but the simple regulator that screws onto a Bernzomatic cylinder might be adequate unless the Brewman setup has some advantages. The Bernzomatic cylinders are easily obtainable just up the road from me so it's easier to get if I run out.
Who has what & why did you go that way?

edit: 2 or 0.5 micron stone?

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

To economise o2 usage, is it our objective to just purge the headspace of our fermentation vessel with o2 and allow the diffusion gradient to do its thing?

IMO that's a less than ideal way to go, greatly increases the chances of involvement from acetic acid bugs which love to form a film on top of the medium. Also as soon as fermentation does start it will rapidly purge the headspace so you'll never know how much you got.

If we have a headspace of, say, 50% the volume of our wort, is that sufficient to strengthen yeast count/viability? More/less?

If you mean that the headspace is 100% oxygen no, oxygen has a density of 1.55 g /l at STP so 0.5 litres O2 per litre of wort is almost 0.8 g/l, about 100 times what you want. (See below).
.

What is our target dissolved oxygen percentage?

Generally 8-10 mg O2 / litre wort for standard beers, you'll need more for things like Belgian strong ales fermented with Wyeast 1388.
1 mg / l = 1 ppm = 0.0001%

Edit: I read the tip at the bottom of Bribie's post. I'm not sure that I understand the correlation of time to ppm yet.

From the above: if you know your O2 flow rate in litres per minute (and if you don't you can measure it, see here): Multiply the flow rate in l / min by 1.55 to give mg / min. Divide that figure into the volume of wort and multiply by the required oxygenation level, the result is the required flow time.

The problem with the above is that it assumes that all the oxygen added goes into solution, if you are oxygenating in line that's probably close to the truth but if you are oxygenating in tank it isn't.

Experience shows that you need around 2 metres of column height for 100% absorption and that's with the finest pore sizes available, with standard pore sizes like 0.5um it's more like 4 metres. Obviously you;re not going to get that in a cube so you have to guesstimate the wastage level.

Just to be clear: many O2 flow meters are calibrated for a delivery pressure, it's marked on the flow meter: IIRC BOC ones are at 4 Bar gauge. This means they'll deliver a different quantity if run at a different pressure*.This doesn't apply to medical types, they are pressure compensated.


* For fun and games, the calculation for compensation is actual flow = metered flow x (delivery pressure + 1 bar) / (calibration pressure + 1 bar)

 

[Zorco]

I am absolutely grateful for the thoroughness of your answers and generosity to share.

I have more question but will reflect on the details of your info for a while first.

 

[Bribie G]

The Brewman's regulator is really just the equivalent of the "red wedge" dial on your CO2 regulator without the other "keg side" dial. So it's really there to show you if there's any oxygen left in the cylinder.
I just open the tap a crack and oxygenate for a minute using a flow that just about breaks the surface of the wort without massive foaming as I stir the tube around.
Probably not quite as much as the video posted earlier.

I believe another sponsor has a reg without a dial and you just do it "by eye" when oxygenating... cheaper setup.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

There's a mistake in the above: the density of oxygen is incorrect, it's around 1.45 g/l not 1.55 as stated.

Sorry for the error, I was working from memory and didn't check.