Chinese Hop Bulk Buy Fallout

[MVZOOM]

So I watched this affair from afar - no doubt I have missed a bunch of detail through the process and am a little ignorant, due to the complex nature of the issue(s) at hand. Would someone mind - please - summarising what's gone wrong here?

As I see it:

1) Bloke goes out on a limb and creates the Bulk Buy
2) No-one really understands the quality of the product
3) Bloke disclaims (2) through the course of the transaction
4) Hops get delivered and the quality isn't the same as 'normal' hops ~$90 per kg
5) Folks are pissed off

Fill me in, 'cause as it sits and I see it, no-one knew how the hops would be, and folks took a punt on the quality. I've organised a couple of bulk buys in the past and it's a bit painful sometimes - ie.. people using different scales and getting 11kg of grain instead of 12.5kg etc.

But in this instance, people walked into the transaction 'buyer aware'. So what's the problem? Again, genuine question, I am ignorant, can someone enlighten me?

Cheers -Mike

 

[bum]

You missed 4.5) Bloke is a cockhead (causing 5)

 

[brettprevans]

As I understand it. The fallout arose from a proposed 2nd bulk buy and it was still being touted as top quality hops even though all reports had been to contrary. Anyone who thought the quality was poor was told buy the person that they were just crap brewers.
That's how I understand it.
Edit: oh and that all the hops fell out of the bags they were packed in... Hence bulk buy fallout haha boom tish

 

[bum]

That's the same way I've perceived it.

 

[manticle]

So I watched this affair from afar - no doubt I have missed a bunch of detail through the process and am a little ignorant, due to the complex nature of the issue(s) at hand. Would someone mind - please - summarising what's gone wrong here?

As I see it:

1) Bloke goes out on a limb and creates the Bulk Buy
2) No-one really understands the quality of the product
3) Bloke disclaims (2) through the course of the transaction
4) Hops get delivered and the quality isn't the same as 'normal' hops ~$90 per kg
5) Folks are pissed off

Fill me in, 'cause as it sits and I see it, no-one knew how the hops would be, and folks took a punt on the quality. I've organised a couple of bulk buys in the past and it's a bit painful sometimes - ie.. people using different scales and getting 11kg of grain instead of 12.5kg etc.

But in this instance, people walked into the transaction 'buyer aware'. So what's the problem? Again, genuine question, I am ignorant, can someone enlighten me?

Cheers -Mike

You may have missed the bit where a lot of buyers gave feedback on the hops (which was asked for by CB/GS) without blaming CB/GS.

The reaction to that was basically "I have been talking to some special people but I can't tell you who they are and we all reckon it's not the hops but the brewers who are crap, see ya next time I want to do a buy"

There were a lot of people who were supportive and anti naysayer (including myself despite not being involved) but the reaction from GS to genuine feedback (I repeat - prompted from GS in the first place)sucked arse. Much of it was deleted from here in case you struggle to find it.

The effort he went to and the risks he took were fantastic and I couldn't say a bad word about them. The response he had to his fellow brewers left a lot to be desired.

 

[MVZOOM]

Wow, ok, yeah - I get it now.

To be honest, his initial posts on the subject kind of indicated that he's a bit of a nob - plus having the most complicated BB setup I've ever seen. Thanks for filling me in!

Cheers - Mike

 

[samhighley]

his initial posts on the subject kind of indicated that he's a bit of a nob

This was why I never contemplated getting involved.

 

[Mantis]

This was why I never contemplated getting involved.

+1

Plus I tuned into his radio show and well, that did it for me. Cockhead

 

[samhighley]

Plus I tuned into his radio show and well, that did it for me. Cockhead

Haha, I did exactly the same thing, with exactly the same result.

 

[Bribie G]

For those who actually bought the hops:

Did two very similar UK best bitters with 50g Chinese Cluster 90 mins and a different UK hop 10 mins.

The first one had a harsh bitterness much as reported, especially re the Marco Polo which I didn't buy, and I thought "oh no, here we go". Actually it smoothed out a bit over the life of the keg. I had used 20g Challenger for 10 mins and no chilled. This point is interesting because when brew #2 was ready, it didn't have that harsh twang and it was a quite acceptable best bitter from the keg. I'd done about 8 extra bottles as well and on cracking one yesterday - the keg ran out last week - there wasn't anything 'off' in the flavour and bitterness was not OTT for a 50g addition. The finishing hop for #2 was Northdown which itself has a hefty 8.5% AA. I'd put the twang in #1 down to the Challenger.

Also the use of the Challenger as a late hop in my current Burton Pale seems to have left a bit of a twang as well, I won't be using that hop for a late addition from now on. Anyway my experience with the Cluster has prompted me to use 50g of it today in my Oatmeal Invalid Stout.

I'll bring bottles of #1, #2 and my Beijing Belgian (C Saaz + Styrians) to BABBs on Thursday so anyone there is welcome to a taste. Also my all C Saaz lager which is lacking aroma but, with a touch of Hersbrucker in the finish would make a most acceptable house lager and quaffer. There is a very slight 'vegetal' flavour to it and I'll be getting opinions about whether thats from the hops or maybe from DMS which I understand can be accentuated by no chilling.

:icon_cheers:

 

[browndog]

For those who actually bought the hops:

Did two very similar UK best bitters with 50g Chinese Cluster 90 mins and a different UK hop 10 mins.

The first one had a harsh bitterness much as reported, especially re the Marco Polo which I didn't buy, and I thought "oh no, here we go". Actually it smoothed out a bit over the life of the keg. I had used 20g Challenger for 10 mins and no chilled. This point is interesting because when brew #2 was ready, it didn't have that harsh twang and it was a quite acceptable best bitter from the keg. I'd done about 8 extra bottles as well and on cracking one yesterday - the keg ran out last week - there wasn't anything 'off' in the flavour and bitterness was not OTT for a 50g addition. The finishing hop for #2 was Northdown which itself has a hefty 8.5% AA. I'd put the twang in #1 down to the Challenger.

Also the use of the Challenger as a late hop in my current Burton Pale seems to have left a bit of a twang as well, I won't be using that hop for a late addition from now on. Anyway my experience with the Cluster has prompted me to use 50g of it today in my Oatmeal Invalid Stout.

I'll bring bottles of #1, #2 and my Beijing Belgian (C Saaz + Styrians) to BABBs on Thursday so anyone there is welcome to a taste. Also my all C Saaz lager which is lacking aroma but, with a touch of Hersbrucker in the finish would make a most acceptable house lager and quaffer. There is a very slight 'vegetal' flavour to it and I'll be getting opinions about whether thats from the hops or maybe from DMS which I understand can be accentuated by no chilling.

:icon_cheers:

Looking forward to trying them Michael, I've dumped my C cascade, but have a kilo of Marco Polo and am pondering how to use it.


cheers

Browndog