Chinese Hop Bulk Buy Fallout

[Adamt]

To keep discussion out of the Bulk Buys and Hop of the Week threads, which are for the purchasing and reviews of the hops respectively, this thread is created for (relatively) free discussion of the burning issues being brought up in the other threads (that don't belong there).

I have received "approval" for this thread, of course, keep it within the forum rules!

 

[peted27]

To keep discussion out of the Bulk Buys and Hop of the Week threads, which are for the purchasing and reviews of the hops respectively, this thread is created for (relatively) free discussion of the burning issues being brought up in the other threads (that don't belong there).

I have received "approval" for this thread, of course, keep it within the forum rules!

ive got some burning issues, but i might have to see a doctor for mine

 

[.DJ.]

although there has been some banter about these hops "quality", we should all remember the original bulk buy offer...

BUYER BEWARE -

Please read carefully and understand fully both the risks and benefits of this exercise. While many of us have done our best in checking the company to ensure you get these hops, No-one has done this before. Scammer are very good at deceiving people and while on all accounts this looks like a good deal, that also what scammers are good at also. For all we know this could be a con-job. So we might not get any hops at all. Equally we cant guarantee the quality of the hops if they do arrive. China is the third largest producers of hops in the world, BUT that doesn't mean the quality is great.

 

[Steve]

It was a gamble for not much money (me personally that is) that unfortunately didnt work out. I was happy to take the gamble for the cost and am equally happy to give them away or chuck them in the compost.
Cheers
Steve

 

[.DJ.]

although there has been some banter about these hops "quality", we should all remember the original bulk buy offer...

BUYER BEWARE -

Please read carefully and understand fully both the risks and benefits of this exercise. While many of us have done our best in checking the company to ensure you get these hops, No-one has done this before. Scammer are very good at deceiving people and while on all accounts this looks like a good deal, that also what scammers are good at also. For all we know this could be a con-job. So we might not get any hops at all. Equally we cant guarantee the quality of the hops if they do arrive. China is the third largest producers of hops in the world, BUT that doesn't mean the quality is great.

to add to my OP....

I guess peoples issue was the constant spruiking of how good these hops were which raised their expectations...

 

[benno1973]

Absolutely. The initial bulk buy was set up correctly, with buyers being warned that the quality of the hops was not guaranteed. I had no beef with the bulk buy up until the hops arrived, where the constant spruiking of the 'increased quality' of these hops by GLS seemed to fly in the face of all reviews on AHB. In addition, he implied that the problem wasn't with the quality of the hops but instead with the brewer, as though these hops were some sort of test of a brewers skill (despite the fact that we can achieve consistent quality results with other hops).

Not all the hops stink - I think the Cascade is alright - but horses for courses, they aren't hops I'd use for aroma. I'm sick of Graham and his attitude towards his fellow brewers. He just seems like a child who craves attention.

 

[cdbrown]

I'm sick of Graham and his attitude towards his fellow brewers. He just seems like a child who craves attention.

If you read his posts I'd say that he doesn't class us as fellow brewers.....

 

[benno1973]

If you read his posts I'd say that he doesn't class us as fellow brewers.....

The fact that he makes a distinction between a 'craftbrewer' and a 'homebrewer' (and classes himself as the former) goes to highlight this...

 

[Goofinder]

I'm glad I didn't waste any money on buying craploads of hops that I wouldn't have used based on the majority of the feedback here.

However, the threads before, during and after the bulk buy have provided some entertaining reading.

 

[Adamt]

One thing that plagued my mind a little when it was developing, was "why were the orders in 1kg lots?"

I understand that at the start, 1kg was chosen because of the low price and wanting to make a minimum order... but as far as I recall the "minimum order" was absolutely and utterly exceeded.

Considering the unknown nature of the hops (for which, to my understanding a "free sample" was REFUSED), why was the buy amounts still at 1kg and not much smaller (500g, 250g per person)?

 

[cdbrown]

Because the chinese suppliers wanted to offload all the crap hops from previous seasons that the major breweries (who send their own inspectors if you didn't know) didn't purchase.

 

[Adamt]

Well, that would explain the (reported) lack of aroma, flavour and powdery state of the hops.

 

[jonocarroll]

One thing that plagued my mind a little when it was developing, was "why were the orders in 1kg lots?"

I understand that at the start, 1kg was chosen because of the low price and wanting to make a minimum order... but as far as I recall the "minimum order" was absolutely and utterly exceeded.

Considering the unknown nature of the hops (for which, to my understanding a "free sample" was REFUSED), why was the buy amounts still at 1kg and not much smaller (500g, 250g per person)?

This may stir up a bit of trouble, but maybe for good reason. I've followed the threads for sheer amusement, and have avoided posting unnecessarily.

This isn't an accusation of wrong doing, just a genuine query... Apologies if it is a null point.

The paperwork for the costs of shipping were made public and accounted for, but what about the original prices? Did anyone see an invoice for the actual base price of the hops? Is it out of the question to propose that the actual price of the hops was perhaps a $ or two less than that quoted on here? Yes, this would imply that someone along the line pulled a profit (in no way illegally necessarily), and would explain a lot of the spruiking/large size orders/motivation.

h34r: h34r: h34r: h34r:

 

[bum]

Considering the unknown nature of the hops (for which, to my understanding a "free sample" was REFUSED), why was the buy amounts still at 1kg and not much smaller (500g, 250g per person)?

Good luck finding the volunteers to do 4 times the work for the same volume. 1kg seems reasonable to me considering the size of the task.

 

[Adamt]

Good luck finding the volunteers to do 4 times the work for the same volume. 1kg seems reasonable to me considering the size of the task.

Why would it have been 4 times the work? It would be the same number of orders (plus a few more people who didn't want to shell out for a full kg, myself included), except you'd be weighing out less each time.

1kg is ridiculous considering the amounts being thrown away and the unknown quality of the hops.

EDIT: Considering there was promise of more bulk buys, there would have been very little reason to order a full kg if it was possible to only order a smaller amount.

 

[raven19]

I got a few $$ packed in with my hops in the original bulk buy. A nice and unexpected suprise.

Have only used some Marco Polo for bittering hops in a Dr S LL so far, tasting fine it is too!

 

[benno1973]

I got a few $$ packed in with my hops in the original bulk buy. A nice and unexpected suprise.

Have only used some Marco Polo for bittering hops in a Dr S LL so far, tasting fine it is too!

Pffttt... Raven, this is the bitching and moaning thread! You're totally off-topic. Mods - please delete this constructive post

 

[bum]

Why would it have been 4 times the work? It would be the same number of orders (plus a few more people who didn't want to shell out for a full kg, myself included), except you'd be weighing out less each time.

When setting up the buy there was an overall minimum order set. If that amount was ordered but needed to be split into 250g packs instead of 1kg packs it is clearly more work. No sense in saying "But it's the same total volume - how can it be more work?". It is clearly more work.

Yes, I understand that you're saying that once the buy went bigger than that minimum there was no need to maintain such a large minimum per person but how do you change that rule? Offer everyone the chance to buy more practical amounts and have that minimum order fall through? Or alienate the people who got in first by offering a better deal to the Johnny-come-latelies? And keeping track of wildly varying order sizes would be a logistical nightmare (which I'm sure it was even with the standardised 1kg package size).

 

[jonocarroll]

I got a few $ packed in with my hops in the original bulk buy. A nice and unexpected suprise.

It is my understanding that the unexpected surprise did not arrive for everyone... h34r:

 

[Fourstar]

Im going to stay away from the banter and monkey poo throwing until i get to taste my hops for myself. I must say the aromas coming from the saaz during the boils (yeas, 2 batches) where dismal but slightly floral, cascade was grassy and marco polo smelt typically american. Thats all i really have to offer at this stage.

I have a feeling this is all becoming very much 'lord of the flies' because a few brewers have discounted them its infecting the rest of us. Ive kept my expectation of the quality and or aroma/flavour profiles of this hops rather low since day one. Consequently, if the beers i end up with exceed this expectation i guess ive won. After all, i spent $55~ bucks on 3KG of hops. if i only use them each once @ 100g a batch im infront on costs compared to our local hop prices.

Put it this way, at $2~ per/100g compared to up to $15 per/100g for US hops, you cant expect ground breaking results can you.