Polyclar Users

[Online Brewing Supplies]

A quick note :Issinglass will remove yeast and chill haze as well! The thing is you must chill your beer till you get chill haze first , then the issinglass can bind it up in its matrix along with the yeast. You must mix issinglass very well before adding to the chilled beer. I have only ever used PVPP as an experiment .Cant say I need it as I dont expect my beer to be around that long.
GB

 

[BjornJ]

Thanks guys,
will then try both by the sound of it.
I have started thinking it's because of using isinglass that my east sediment is always "fluffy" in the bottle and never settles down hard so will either try polyclar alone and the combo on different beers or just use less isinglass than I have before.

Bjorn

 

[buttersd70]

Thanks guys,
will then try both by the sound of it.
I have started thinking it's because of using isinglass that my east sediment is always "fluffy" in the bottle and never settles down hard so will either try polyclar alone and the combo on different beers or just use less isinglass than I have before.

Bjorn

fluffy sediment sounds like the dose is too high.

 

[muckey]

A quick note :Issinglass will remove yeast and chill haze as well! The thing is you must chill your beer till you get chill haze first ,

have to agree with this. I believe fining and clearing works much more efficiently and quicker no matter if you use isinglass or gelatin + PVPP

The fact that the long haze molecule has formed makes it easier to bond with whatever clearing agent and then drop out of solution.

as an aside, I'm assuming you've obviously used isinglass GB. How long does it normally take to clear using this method?

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

have to agree with this. I believe fining and clearing works much more efficiently and quicker no matter if you use isinglass or gelatin + PVPP

The fact that the long haze molecule has formed makes it easier to bond with whatever clearing agent and then drop out of solution.

as an aside, I'm assuming you've obviously used isinglass GB. How long does it normally take to clear using this method?

I have a cool room (stock ) so I am not in a rush to get the beer out.I usually leave it for at least a day to settle.My method is to transfer to a keg , chill the crap out of it add the issinglass and shake like shite. Issingass needs to come in contact to remove yeast and haze, simply pouring it in wont work.Another system that worked well in the past was to put the whole fermenter in the cool room add the issinglass and stir like hell. After a day or two I could see right to the bottom of the fermenter, crystal clear. Issinglass can be tricky to get the addition amount just right , like as butters mentioned you can get it fluffy, this is a problem in a keg but not so much in the fermenter.I would recommend doing trial runs on the beer with differing amounts of issinglass first before dosing.there is a good amount of info on the net about these trial runs.
GB

 

[Katherine]

I have a cool room (stock ) so I am not in a rush to get the beer out.I usually leave it for at least a day to settle.My method is to transfer to a keg , chill the crap out of it add the issinglass and shake like shite. Issingass needs to come in contact to remove yeast and haze, simply pouring it in wont work.Another system that worked well in the past was to put the whole fermenter in the cool room add the issinglass and stir like hell. After a day or two I could see right to the bottom of the fermenter, crystal clear. Issinglass can be tricky to get the addition amount just right , like as butters mentioned you can get it fluffy, this is a problem in a keg but not so much in the fermenter.I would recommend doing trial runs on the beer with differing amounts of issinglass first before dosing.there is a good amount of info on the net about these trial runs.
GB

Isnt Issinglass a bladder of a fish? you dont eat meat?

 

[Online Brewing Supplies]

Isnt Issinglass a bladder of a fish? you dont eat meat?

And I dont drink Issinglass either . :lol: Well if I do, I dont want to know about it.
GB

 

[BjornJ]

My method is to transfer to a keg , chill the crap out of it add the issinglass and shake like shite. Issingass needs to come in contact to remove yeast and haze, simply pouring it in wont work.Another system that worked well in the past was to put the whole fermenter in the cool room add the issinglass and stir like hell. After a day or two I could see right to the bottom of the fermenter, crystal clear.

Is that true? Never thought of that, I just thought I should pour it carefully in the secondary/cube so it would make a "slimey" surface layer before sinking and dragging stuff with it down to the bottom.
I thought I had read that somewhere, to just let it settle on top but it does seem to make sense to shake it around, though.

Hmm, the more I try to learn here, the more new questions pop up!
Even for things I thought I had figured out by now :huh:

Bjorn

 

[gibbocore]

I don't use issinglass, i have to keep my beers Vegan.

 

[Katherine]

I don't use issinglass, i have to keep my beers Vegan.

you eat meat?

 

[gibbocore]

you eat meat?

heaps of my mates don't

don't ask.
the perils of punk rock.

 

[buttersd70]

In cask beers, the isinglass is added, the bung put in, then the cask is rolled down the line, then rolled into the truck, then rolled to get off the truck, then rolled down into the cellar....
All that rolling and shaking, lets the isinglass impact with the yeast, and then lets the larger yeast flocs impact with each other, causing even larger flocs, which, due to gravity, sink like a stone....

I read an article once (can't remember where), where an Engilsh cellarman was talking about clearing the casks, and rousing it to promote flocculation...he reckoned that third rouse was the charm.

 

[muckanic]

I had a conversation with Ross about using polyclar in combination with geletine/issinglass. Given that the two products are opposite charges, I didn't want to cancel the effectiveness of one out with the other.

The main point is that you want to have some seperation in time, and allow the first product to work prior to adding the other. Ross advised that it's best to do your fining first, and then do the polyclar. The main reason for it being that the pvpp works better the clearer (from yeast) the beer is.

It's a bit of a technical point, but all this stuff about finings carrying electrical charges is strictly incorrect. The molecule has to be neutral in order to stand alone. Having said that, molecules can have localised charge distributions that are responsible for things like hydrogen bonding.

My $0.02 worth is that gelatine is theoretically a bit much of a blunt instrument that potentially can take out more than you want it to (as in stripping body). The nice part about PVPP is its specificity. I can't see the point of using both. Isinglass will specifically take out yeast, but I tend to think that what a lot of people think is yeast haze often isn't.

 

[Mitcho89]

Hey guys,

I was just reading this post about shaking instead of stirring......yes I can see that you would introduce oxygen into the solution even if it's just a little bit but I have a carbonator cap (coke bottle thread with a ball lock male fitting). I could stick in the solution, squeeze out all the oxygen through the valve, then put in a few psi of CO2 and be able to shake the sh!t out of it?

Would this work? I hope so because it would be much easier then stirring for up to an hour.....

Cheers!

 

[argon]

Hey guys,

I was just reading this post about shaking instead of stirring......yes I can see that you would introduce oxygen into the solution even if it's just a little bit but I have a carbonator cap (coke bottle thread with a ball lock male fitting). I could stick in the solution, squeeze out all the oxygen through the valve, then put in a few psi of CO2 and be able to shake the sh!t out of it?

Would this work? I hope so because it would be much easier then stirring for up to an hour.....

Cheers!

There's other threads about polyclar and the method of additions. Personally I've found it works just fine adding it dry straight into primary.

 

[edddy57]

I put in a small jar of boiled water with minimal head space (still hot) and then shake for 45 mins. Usually carry around while I do other things. I find that boiled H2o has little oxygen and the shaking in the initial phase while hot allows you to unscrew the jar slightly to release any air that might be in there. Never had a problem with oxidisation

Have had crystal clear lighter coloured beers. These I usually gelatin first and leave 5 days chilled; but have found the slightly darker beers like an ESB where I tend to use a high floc yeast dont seem to clear the haze as well just using the polyclar (even though I chill for a few days first). So was interested in the comment that the polyclar works better if the yeast has substantially settled out first. Could that be a factor?
eddy

 

[Mikedub]

last couple of times I've added polyclar (disolved in boiling water) I find clumps of it floating on the wort the next day, should it all drop through or is this normal?

 

[Steve@PMF82]

last couple of times I've added polyclar (disolved in boiling water) I find clumps of it floating on the wort the next day, should it all drop through or is this normal?

No not normal for me.
How long did you agitate it for?
I find half hour of constant rolling and swirling in a glass jar works very well, i use a sanitised brew paddle thing to very gently move the top of the wort for a few seconds just before tipping in and it distributes very evenly.

 

[argon]

I've never noted it clumping. But saying that i usually put the polyclar in with boiling water in a jar then on the stir plate for at least half an hour. Seems to be well hydrated by then.

Also when adding the hot fluid to the cold beer the hot portion tends to dissipate very evenly accross the surface of the beer before dorpping through the beer and doing it's thing.

 

[Mikedub]

How long did you agitate it for?

after about about 5 min of shaking I got bored and figured 'its plastic, it shouldn't be absorbing at all' so i threw it in, the clumps are gritty, that why I think its the polyclar,
further reading of another polyclar thread since has me thinking more jiggy jiggy needed
cheers