My Rogers Clone Recipe Tastes Great

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Colour was spot on for me, hops were slightly lacking, but ever so slight. technobabble tasted it side by side with me, he had some suggestions on the grist to replace the vienna with more pale base and add some munich if I recall correctly?

 

[manticle]

67 is definitely too mid range. Bite the bullet and just go straight for 70 (or 55 for 5, 70 for 30, 72 for 10 then 78 for mashout for 10).

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Yeah I need to change single items so I can gauge the results properly. Thanks for the tip manticle next go will keep all things equal and change the mash to your suggested schedule!

 

[Nizmoose]

yeah just realised your crystal was 120 and mine was 60L so I'll change that up and that should fix the colour, as manticle suggested The higher mash is what I'll do to save the body. This is going to be my new recipe:

39% Pale Malt (maybe a percentage of that munich)
39% Vienna Malt
8.6% Crystal 120L
8.6% Pale Wheat
2.1% Midnight Wheat

14g or 15AAU of EKG @ 60 minutes
5g or 0.3 g/L of Galaxy @ 10 minutes (6 AAU)
5g or 0.3 g/L of Cascade @ 10 minutes (3 AAU)

For the mash 54C/10mins 70C/30mins 72C/10mins 78C/10mins

Fermented with Nottingham at 18C

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

I subbed 120L on cos on brew day i realised i didnt have 60L, lol turned out good it seems!

 

[manticle]

Time of mash is as important as temp nizmoose. Drop the main mash to 30. You won't regret it.

 

[Nizmoose]

Time of mash is as important as temp nizmoose. Drop the main mash to 30. You won't regret it.

Cheers for this manticle, I thought about a 30 minute which is what I did for the first version but then couldnt think of a reason to not extend it for the sake of knowing conversion is definitely complete, is the reason for shortening the rest to make sure no beta chops up some of the longer chain stuff (obviously 70 is denaturing beta but not instantly) and therefore drying the beer out more than I want?

I subbed 120L on cos on brew day i realised i didnt have 60L, lol turned out good it seems!

haha lucky! Yours would definitely have benefitted from it, I'll get a photo of mine and put it up here at some stage but its definitely too light

 

[manticle]

Pretty much. Alpha works quickly, beta slower and at the higher temp, beta is getting even less encouragement.

Full conversion just means no starch. Don't think of this as maximising maltose yield - that isn't the point and you have no pressing need to do so.

Alpha chops starch into shorter chains, beta chops them further. Those longer chains result in mouthfeel so give beta no/less chance.

 

[technobabble66]

Colour was spot on for me, hops were slightly lacking, but ever so slight. technobabble tasted it side by side with me, he had some suggestions on the grist to replace the vienna with more pale base and add some munich if I recall correctly?

Yep. I'm keen to see how this goes.

All i remember from the side-by-side was there seemed to be a malt element i associate with Munich. Not sure what you'd sacrifice to get it - i can't remember anything else of the comparison other than the Munich thing.

With the Mash Schedule, Why not do 55/71/78 for 5/30/2 to simplify it?

...
Just checked your recipe on Post #60.
I'm partly guessing as i can't remember exactly the taste comparison... But, a couple of ideas spring to mind:
1) Maybe replace just the Pale Ale malt with the Munich, or equal amounts of Pale & Vienna replaced with Munich. I'd be tempted to err towards keeping the vienna as it should add a little more toastiness.
2) Maybe halve the Carapils and replace that half with Med Crystal - add a little more middle-caramel flavour, seems to be bang on for Roger's, to me.
3) Maybe replace the Midnight Wheat with Choc Malt - add a little more roasty-toastiness rather than more smooth burntness


Merely suggestions, esp #2 & 3. Otherwise, i was v impressed with your attempt, DJ. Pretty damn close!

 

[Nizmoose]

1) Maybe replace just the Pale Ale malt with the Munich, or equal amounts of Pale & Vienna replaced with Munich. I'd be tempted to err towards keeping the vienna as it should add a little more toastiness.
2) Maybe halve the Carapils and replace that half with Med Crystal - add a little more middle-caramel flavour, seems to be bang on for Roger's, to me.
3) Maybe replace the Midnight Wheat with Choc Malt - add a little more roasty-toastiness rather than more smooth burntness


Merely suggestions, esp #2 & 3. Otherwise, i was v impressed with your attempt, DJ. Pretty damn close!

These are good suggestions, whilst trying to nut my above new recipe out I really thought about doing away with all the pale and just replacing it with munich. It sure is tempting, hey even if DJ does one I'll do the other and send you a bottle or three so you can see what was better then you can chuck the results up here and we'll have a solid recipe.

 

[technobabble66]

Hard to tell if that'd end up being too much Munich/maltiness or just enough. Might be fairly intense with the Base being made up entirely of Vienna & Munich. However, i reckon it'd be awesome also!

I'm more than happy to try some tasters and offer my opinion!

(In fact, i was kinda hoping DJ would be onto the next batch so i could invite myself around to try it... h34r: )

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Haha I better get drinking, still got half a keg left of the first attempt! I keep gravitating towards the 2x 6.4% IPAs in preference

 

[chrisluki]

My batch is fermenting away as we speak. Hit the OG spot on, colour is lighter than Rogers but my little bottle O caramel will fix that!

 

[technobabble66]

Hey DJ,

Had a spare second to throw this together as per my guesstimated tweaks to your recipe:

Ramjet Ale
24L
OG=1.039
FG=1.013
IBU=24.0
EBC=32
alc=3.8%

1.4kg (34%) MO (TFFM)
1.4kg (34%) Vienna (Wey)
0.4kg (10%) Munich 2 (Wey)
0.4kg (10%) Wheat
0.2kg (5%) CaraPils
0.2kg (5%) Med Crystal (Simpsons)
0.1kg (2.5%) Choc (Simpsons)

8g (0.3g/L) EKG (4.5%) @ FWH
10g (0.4g/L) EKG (4.5%) @ 20mins
15g (0.6g/L) Cascade (7.8%) @ 20mins
10g (0.4g/L) Galaxy (13.4%) @ 20mins
20g (0.8g/L) each of Cascade & Galaxy dry hop

(** 20mins additions are to be cube-hopped - should capture more of the hops elements)

Mash: 55/70/72/78 for 5/30/20/2
(as per manticle's suggestion. Might go with 55/71/78 for 5/30/2 for simplicity, or just 70/78 for 30/2)

plus some brewing salts, nutrients, etc.
yeast = US05, American Ale, 1272, etc.
---------------------------------------

Whatcha think?

 

[chrisluki]

Bottled my beer last night.

I had to add so much of that caramel extract but got nowhere near the colour change i expected with it. The beer is probably half as dark as i had hoped.

Ah well, as long as it tastes good, i will be happy!

 

[Nizmoose]

Yeah the colour seems to be really hard to achieve, can't remember if it's been suggested yet but I'm thinking a bit of midnight wheat to add colour but no flavour?

 

[paulyman]

What about subbing some of the Gladfield malts for crystal, shepherds delight and red back are supposed to give a red colour.

 

[mofox1]

What about subbing some of the Gladfield malts for crystal, shepherds delight and red back are supposed to give a red colour.

I'd be careful trying to do colour adjustments by subbing base with crystal. Especially Gladdy's Shep Delight - reportedly very strong even in small amounts.

Much better to go Nizmoose's suggestion and use small amounts of roasted grain/malt.

Midnight Wheat & Carafa Special will work well w/o contributing much roasty flavour. Roasted barley will also work if you don't have the others, but (somewhat counter-intuitively) choc malts will do a similar colour adjustment but contribute a lot more flavour.

 

[paulyman]

I'd be careful trying to do colour adjustments by subbing base with crystal. Especially Gladdy's Shep Delight - reportedly very strong even in small amounts.

Much better to go Nizmoose's suggestion and use small amounts of roasted grain/malt.

Midnight Wheat & Carafa Special will work well w/o contributing much roasty flavour. Roasted barley will also work if you don't have the others, but (somewhat counter-intuitively) choc malts will do a similar colour adjustment but contribute a lot more flavour.

Sounds fair enough to me, I haven't used it yet.

I will be trying one of the recipes above over spring/summer, might try and get a double batch in.

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

This is colour comparison of mine with midnight wheat used (recipe from previous post). Mine left commercial right.