Mill Motors

[husky]

Anyone using a more industrial type motor similar to this:
https://www.allamericanaleworks.com/shop/180-rpm-power-grinder-grain-mill-motor/

I was originally looking for a pulley set for a 3 phase motor I have but decided against it due to higher side loads on the mill so I'm back to looking for an inline option with coupler. Ideally want an industrial 3 phase motor so I can put on a VSD and geared as per attached. Anyone know where they can be found in OZ?

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Motor is easy: this one is 3 phase .55 kW (3/4 hp) ~ $AUD160 from RS. It's 4 pole and no gearbox so it will run at 1500 rpm.

Geared motors as per your link are available but much more expensive, I haven't found anything under $400 and since I need three drive motors for the mill I'm building I can't afford that. I could run a single .75 kW motor (the big brother of the one illustrated is $210) but I'd spend as much again on the drive system and I like the idea of the roller sets being modular.

I'm probably going to go with DC scooter motors and fab up pulleys to get them to the right speed. BTW DC speed control is much easier and cheaper than AC speed control, all you need is a big mosfet, an astable timer circuit (can be built using a 555) and a capacitor.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Giggity giggity. Get yourselves a can of 'toughen up' gentlemen.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Pretty hard to hand crank a 6 roller mill: I only have two arms.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

and two legs . Think laterally.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

You forgot the drives for the feed roller and two sets of shakers, I'm still two limbs short.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Use your legs to drive more than one thing.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Or use some DC motors.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

soft. Surely you have some bicycle parts laying around?

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Yes, but strangely enough, I use them to make bicycles.

The other fly in the ointment is that I am anticipating installing a total of about 1.05 kW (1.4 HP) : 3 x 250W for the rollers, 3 x 100W for the feed and shakers. Whilst I can still (just) generate that much power on a bike I can't do it for long enough to mill the required amount of malt.

FWIW, I have built a cycle powered generator, the idea being that I can power the TV whilst watching the TdF. So far it just powers some 12 volt lights as I don't have a high enough quality inverter for the TV.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Great potential going to waste there. ... At the very least you are using a bicycle powered dynamo to charge your soft battery powered equipment?

edit: Just saw your amended post , that's more like it!! Whack that power in some batteries and power your mill.

 

[Tony121]

Ideally want an industrial 3 phase motor so I can put on a VSD and geared as per attached. Anyone know where they can be found in OZ?

There are single phase VSD's available, I'll see if I can dig up some info.

 

[husky]

Motor is easy: this one is 3 phase .55 kW (3/4 hp) ~ $AUD160 from RS. It's 4 pole and no gearbox so it will run at 1500 rpm.

Geared motors as per your link are available but much more expensive, I haven't found anything under $400 and since I need three drive motors for the mill I'm building I can't afford that. I could run a single .75 kW motor (the big brother of the one illustrated is $210) but I'd spend as much again on the drive system and I like the idea of the roller sets being modular.

I'm probably going to go with DC scooter motors and fab up pulleys to get them to the right speed. BTW DC speed control is much easier and cheaper than AC speed control, all you need is a big mosfet, an astable timer circuit (can be built using a 555) and a capacitor.

Thanks LC, I have plenty of suitable 3 phase motors as this was my original direction using pulleys but I'm now thinking geared drive. I notice some mill manufacturers offer a pulley version with bigger shafts and better bushes to deal with the higher side loads so thinking no pulleys for my standard mill. Where have you seen one for $400? got a link as that sounds alright.
I did consider DC as I realise it can be easier but I already have AC infrastructure set up as in a VSD and wiring etc. Out of interest what parts are required for the DC? Got links for them as I'm not as familiar with DC.

 

[husky]

There are single phase VSD's available, I'll see if I can dig up some info.

Thanks mate but its more a geared motor question than a VSD question. I have plenty of motors around both 1 and 3 phase but they are all either 1450 or 2900rpm and I want a geared one to somewhere between 150 - 500rpm that I can them put on a VSD. I haven't heard great things about the single phase VSD's so I want a 3 phase. Also I have a few 3 phase VSD's on hand ready to go.
My other option is looking for a worm drive as used on most conveyor systems but they all seem to be geared really low. I have one on my current mill and even when running that at 120hz it takes 30 mins to mill 5kg as it's so slow. I want to be able to mill 100kg or so in 30 minutes.

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Where have you seen one for $400? got a link as that sounds alright.

Again RS have a couple, like this

I did consider DC as I realise it can be easier but I already have AC infrastructure set up as in a VSD and wiring etc. Out of interest what parts are required for the DC? Got links for them as I'm not as familiar with DC.

The basic circuit is an astable timer with variable mark to space ratio (mark = on, space = off, this is also known as pulse width modulation: relative pulse width = mark / (mark + space).This is used to control a bloody great MOSFET acting as a switch and the result is smoothed through a capacitor.

If the mark to space ratio is say 1:1 (eg relative pulse width is 50%) the smoothed result is half the input voltage. DC motors have linear speed / voltage curves*, so if you control the supply voltage you control the speed.

It's a very common circuit so you can buy them prebuilt from Ebay for under $10. Note I haven't used this particular one, it may be crap for all I know.

* strictly only true if torque demand is invariant with speed which is rarely the case.

 

[n87]

for a pulley setup, instead of putting a pulley straignt on the mill shaft, why dont you put a spider(? Called a cush drive in motorcycles)) in and connect it to a shaft that is supported on both sides?

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

The big name in 3 phase AC Gearmotors is SEW Eurodrive. A quick Ebay search turned up this:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/SEW-Euro...098591?hash=item1a3332851f:g:qDEAAOSw0cZZlLrJ

I think the output is about 200 RPM at 50 Hz

 

[Tony121]

Thanks mate but its more a geared motor question than a VSD question. I have plenty of motors around both 1 and 3 phase but they are all either 1450 or 2900rpm and I want a geared one to somewhere between 150 - 500rpm that I can them put on a VSD. I haven't heard great things about the single phase VSD's so I want a 3 phase. Also I have a few 3 phase VSD's on hand ready to go.
My other option is looking for a worm drive as used on most conveyor systems but they all seem to be geared really low. I have one on my current mill and even when running that at 120hz it takes 30 mins to mill 5kg as it's so slow. I want to be able to mill 100kg or so in 30 minutes.

No worries, was just a thought for another option

 

[FarsideOfCrazy]

There's ac geared motors at
https://www.motiondynamics.com.au/ac-gearmotors-110v-415v/
Not sure if they're what your after.

 

[Tony121]

https://www.bonfiglioli.com.au/en-au/industrial/products/gearmotors-gearboxes/

These guys seem to have a good range and pricing is fairly competitive.

Edit: Obviously need to go through their distributors and pricing based on account structure.

Edit 2: And when I say competitive pricing I mean more of for the commercial industry, won't get out of it for less than $400-500 to put it into perspective.