Low effort bottle sanitation technique

[jbaker9]

I have been following a bottle cleaning / sanitation method for the last few years detailed by Charlie Papazian :

- Quick bottle rinse in water to remove beer residue
- Overnight soak in bleach solution 60ml/20l
- Empty but don't rinse bottle
- Cap with a piece of foil until ready to use
- On bottling day rinse with hot tap water

His argument is that hot water from a tank will be sanitary for bottling purposes. I was satisfied with this and have used it for many batches with no sign of infection.

This method is a big time saver - bottles go into the bucket after drinking until bucket is full then all capped with foil in one hit and stored.

I am now in a house with gas hot water. As it is on demand the water does not have the time at high temp. My feeling is that it will be fine but some reassurance would be great.

Cheers
James

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Bleach is fairly nasty stuff, personally i wouldn't choose to use it to clean something I'm going to be drinking out of.

If you must continue to use it be sure not just to 'rinse with hot tap water' .. At least fully triple flush each bottle full to the brim with water.

 

[JDW81]

I use starsan

 

[wobbly]

Depending on your hot water set up your hot water circuit may have a tempering valve that will control the outlet water to 45C which is unlikely to be hot enough to sanitise. You want at least 65C and hold the bottle at that temperature for about a minute or there abouts. Also if your hot water circuit doesn't have a tempering valve and is being supplied direct from an instant hot water system then these are generally set at 65C max measured at the heater so quite a bit colder at the tap.

My process which has been without issue is.

• All my bottled beers are fully carbonated from a WilliamsWarn so no sediment
• After poring the beer into a glass quick rinse of the bottle with cold water
• When the meal dishes are being done further rinse/wash the bottle with hot/warm detergent water (before dishes) and then a further rinse with cold water and store in a closed top cardboard box no caps/lids
• On bottling day place all bottles upside down on the racks in the dishwasher and run on the "hot" (70C) cycle allow to cool and bottle

Wobbly

 

[Danscraftbeer]

There are (growths) that can handle the heat and (grow) inside hot water service units.
It seems a little backyarder cowboy faith coming from Charlie. No disrespect intended but not a good enough technique for me considering a cold rinse with Star San or equivalent is well proven.

 

[Danscraftbeer]

Just to add to that I heard an expert talk about someone's idea of just drinking hot tap water to sooth a sour throat can possibly contract legionnaires disease from the growth in a hot water service. I cant confirm facts on that though.

Oh, and you must use a bottle brush! I learnt that in my early days when I started seeing a faint level line residue inside the bottle neck that wont be removed from just rinsing.

Sorry, I really cant give reassurance for low effort sanitation techniques. Other than expensive machine equipment that's needed in larger quantity or commercial efforts.

 

[jbaker9]

Thanks for the replys. Since moving I've been finishing with a stars an rinse, which I'll continue.

I looked on the Internet about legionaries from water system, it can grow in warm environments up to 50C. If the water system meets Australian standards the actual system will be >60c and it can't grow - thus was definitely the case on my old house.

I haven't ever perceived any off flavour from bleach after rinsing it. A benefit of the bleach is that it gets rid of any marks.

 

[Danscraftbeer]

Bleach can be ok for glass when used carefully. Count out PET bottles though.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

No need to use both bleach and starsan. If you insist on using bleach make sure to triple rinse the bleach out of the bottle prior to filling. I.e 1/330 x 1/330 x 1/330 mL leaves 2/5 of f-all hypochlorite left in the bottle.
Just giving it a single rinse and swish is not really enough.

 

[homebrewkid]

Farrrrrrrk me you guys waste a lot of time, rinse the bottles with my homemade bottle rinser only takes a few seconds then stack them into milk crates upside down.
On bottling day use the bottle pump on the tree with your chosen sanatiser, it couldn't be easier or quicker.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Better still.. Just keg it

 

[Mattrox]

Better still.. Just keg it

No worries, I'll just keg up my Pale on the weekend into my imaginary keg. I'll imagine force carbing it with the "rock and roll" technique using my imaginary 6kg CO2 cylinder. Then I'll pop it in my imaginary kegerator with the imaginary flooded font.

Then I'll be rid of all my bottling woes.

 

[Killer Brew]

My routine is to triple rinse after I pour the last glass (only about 100ml of water each time), onto the draining tree at end of the night, when there are enough on the tree I fill a box face down. On bottling day they get a starsan spray. Occasionally I see one with a residue build up and bring out the brush and the vanish powder.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

No worries, I'll just keg up my Pale on the weekend into my imaginary keg. I'll imagine force carbing it with the "rock and roll" technique using my imaginary 6kg CO2 cylinder. Then I'll pop it in my imaginary kegerator with the imaginary flooded font.
Then I'll be rid of all my bottling woes.

Imaginary set and forget is better

I am still bottling from time to time as are most, thanks for sharing your technique, personally I would not prefer to use bleach. But thanks for sharing, happy brewing.

PS. You can start out kegging with a Soda Stream bottle and some second hand gear. No need for all the fancy. Best of luck.

 

[pcqypcqy]

My routine is to triple rinse after I pour the last glass (only about 100ml of water each time), onto the draining tree at end of the night, when there are enough on the tree I fill a box face down. On bottling day they get a starsan spray. Occasionally I see one with a residue build up and bring out the brush and the vanish powder.

+ 1.

I do a keg each batch and half a dozen bottles. I rinse them out as soon as I've poured them into a glass, 3 goes with cold water is usually enough, so they're clean and free of residue. When bottling, I just use about 100ml of starsan that I shake up and transfer from bottle to bottle. Haven't had any issues with this method.

 

[RobW]

I believe Legionella can survive temperatures in excess of 50oC if there is a biofilm present.
That said domestic hot water services are a rare source of infection, it's more likely to be cooling towers and other sources of aerosols.

I clean my swingtop bottles with sodium percarbonate, rinse with water and then a Starsan rinse (just enough to coat the inside surface).
Leave the Starsan in and drain at bottling time.

 

[TheWiggman]

Bleach is fairly nasty stuff, personally i wouldn't choose to use it to clean something I'm going to be drinking out of.

I've used bleach for years. Nasty stuff if you drink it, but very easy to rinse off with hot water. PERFECT for glass and I use it mainly for no-scrub cleaning of my yeast flask. Not ideal for HDPE.
I clean bottles with the dishwashing and a bottle cleaner, rinse following a clean, then use sanitiser at bottling.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Triple rinsing is good.

Chlorine does nasty stuff to good and bad bugs. Your stomach has (should have) lots of good bugs, try not to add chlorine too it unless necessary. Yes I'm aware tap water has chlorine in it, but that should be taken care of in the wort boil.

 

[Radshoes]

No worries, I'll just keg up my Pale on the weekend into my imaginary keg. I'll imagine force carbing it with the "rock and roll" technique using my imaginary 6kg CO2 cylinder. Then I'll pop it in my imaginary kegerator with the imaginary flooded font.

Then I'll be rid of all my bottling woes.

careful not to imaginary overcarb it mate

 

[Mattrox]

I actually enjoy bottling. The 4yo loves dropping carb drops in the bottle. This in itself stopped me wanting to bulk prime. She gets the bottles and lines them up. Even had a crack at the bottling wand.

I have no real driving need to go to kegging.

If the dishwasher is empty, I run the bottles through on "pots and pans" cycle with sodium perc in the detergent holder.

Does a really good job. If the dish washer isn't free I fill a tub with very hot water, fill with bottles and soak with sodium perc. I try to make sure the dishwasher is free on bottling day though.