Is All Grain Worth It?

[McCraggen]

G'day again i have been pondering to myself, is all grain a significant taste improvement over kit/partials?

Im sure it is better no question, but is the extra time/effort/expense worth it? What is the differnece from using for instance crystal grains/dry malts to starting from grain and mashing, apart from technique?

Cheers n Beers.

 

[quantocks]

if you use the search you'll find these threads are made all the time.

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=19326

that's one to start off. Kits vs AG.

 

[muckey]

as Quantocks posted, have a read through some of the previous threads and discussions.

The only we to really answer that for each individual (and is what made me make the jump to all grain) was to actually taste it. Try and get along to a brewday at someones house and see how it works and taste the results from a previous batch and make your own mind up.

Now, have to go and get ready for mashout.....................

 

[DiscoStu]

As someone who made the jump from K&K only 4 months ago I believe it was definately worth it. Not only from a taste perspective but also the freedom AG gives you to brew whatever style you want. .

Creating your own beer from scratch I have found to be very rewarding. Sure it takes a bit longer and you have to spend a few $$$ to get setup, but IMHO worth every cent.

 

[brendo]

+1 for checking out someone else going through the process - helps to demistify it a bit and give you a feel as to whether it is for you.

If you fill out you location details, you might find yourself getting an offer for a helping hand.

Brendo

 

[peas_and_corn]

Go AG if you can. The hike in quality is one thing, but you also control everything, from ingredients to mash temp to anything else you can think of. It's the best way to go.

 

[MarkBastard]

I've only tasted krams all grain beer but I would rather drink it than any commercial beer and it craps all over kit and kilos.

So yeah I reckon its worth it, if you have the time etc.

But then there's people out there that are happy to drink VB their whole life so it's really a personal thing. Try and watch the process somewhere and taste some beers as well and work it out for yourself.

 

[buttersd70]

This question gets asked about once a month.....
There are 4 main considerations.

• Taste
• time
• consumables cost
• equipment cost

My opinion on these factors are;

• taste, AG wins hands down (although there are some horrible AG's out there, just as there are some horrible kits. But if I gave my full attention to a kit, and made it with tweaks to the absolute best of my ability, it wouldn't stand up to even my most mediocre grain effort. A good partial mash recipe with ~35% or more base grain is a differant issue...in the hands of a good brewer, it can stand up to AG. Just 2c.)
• time, Kits win hands down in the short term. They're quick to make....but in the long term, it evens out more. AG takes (usually, but depending on style), less time after fermentation before it can be drunk at its best.
• Consumables...ie cost of grain/hops vs cost of kits/adjuncts...if its a straight kit and kilo, no tweaks, then kits will possibly come out in front. Any tweaking on the kits...and it puts AG in front.
• equipment costs....these can be ridiculously high, or ridiculously low (my entire AG rig, with the exception of my mill (which is a luxury, not a necessity) came in <$100, as an extreme example). Or somewhere in between. But it is a once off cost for a peice of equipment that will either last you years; or can be on-sold if you decide to upgrade. Either way, bling doesn't make good beer.

2c

 

[Bribie G]

It also depends on what style of beer you like. I love UK bitters and have never made a satisfactory partial or kit in that style yet so I've gone AG for that beer. On the other hand I like a lighter flavoured lager and don't mind an ice cold Melbourne Bitter or Bavaria (Holland). I regularly make a partial with a very light kit such as a Coopers original Lager, some hop additions, a kilo and a bit of a pale malt such as Galaxy, and dex, and ferment it using a clean fermenting yeast such as Nottingham. It turns out yummy and hits the spot. I don't think an AG version would be quite to my taste as I'm aiming more for Australian commercial rather than Czech Pilsener or a German Lager.

Disclaimer: I hate VB with a passion, but IMHO Melb. is about the best drop that CUB put out, it's what Carlton Draught should have been if they hadn't stuffed the recipe in the latest relaunching of the product.

Nowadays I do a full AG mash and a very hoppy boil and split the wort between four 5L cubes and use a cube in each partial so putting a brew down takes about ten minutes, seriously: pour the wort, mix the can, tip the dex, pitch the yeast. Seal up and forget for a few days.

However as stated above by other posters it depends what you like personally. I wouldn't even attempt to do any more UK style partials.

 

[seemax]

No doubt AG produces in general better tasting beer than K&K. Partials are almost as much work as AG so I haven't really bothered, I guess it does require smaller kettles, etc.

For me it's all about variety. I have done some decent extract beers, but you're really limited to light/amber/dark/wheat as your base, and light isn't really light compared to Pils malt. I enjoy spending time formulating recipes and experimenting with various grains to get a feel for their contribution to flavour and balance. I find the AG process relaxing and enjoyable.

As for setup costs, I have spent $30 on 35L kettle, old esky from family, $30 in taps, fittings, braid and some hoses. You don't need a brand new shiny stainless pot and decked out mash tun to make good beer (not to say it's not nice!).

BUT my problem is time! It took me 4 hours last night to go from mash in to no chill cube in the fridge. I could have done a K&K in 20mins including cleaning up! With full time work, house, wife, kids, etc it's a challende. So now I brew less often but make the exact beers I like to drink and share amongst friends.

 

[mckenry]

G'day again i have been pondering to myself, is all grain a significant taste improvement over kit/partials?

Im sure it is better no question, but is the extra time/effort/expense worth it? What is the differnece from using for instance crystal grains/dry malts to starting from grain and mashing, apart from technique?

Cheers n Beers.

Hey McCraggen,
Sure is worth it. Major investment is your time. Especially early on. If you want a substantial jump in quality, buy a Fresh Wort Kit (FWK) They are as close as you'll get to AG and so quick and simple. I still do them now and then, especially when trying a new yeast. Dont want to waste a whole brew day on something I may not like.
PLUS - every FWK container (15L - but possibly a bit bigger) can be used for secondary fermenters. Sometimes I will make a 23L batch of beer and split it between two FWK containers and pitch different yeasts in each. Gives an excellent side by side test.
Sorry to get a bit :icon_offtopic: but do get a FWK and see for yourself the giant leap from concentrated cans to fresh wort.
Its a nice easy way to move into better tasting beers.

mckenry

 

[PostModern]

The question comes down to do you want to make acceptable tasking alcoholic beverages or are you on a quest for your perfect beer? In my experience, either method can get to to the former, but only AG will take you to the latter.

 

[bradsbrew]

YES IT IS!!!!

 

[peas_and_corn]

All grain beer, nom nom nom

 

[buttersd70]

Sorry to get a bit :icon_offtopic: but do get a FWK and see for yourself the giant leap from concentrated cans to fresh wort.

Excellent suggestion, particularly if you get one in a style that you've already brewed with a kit...then you have a comparison of similar type of beer done both ways. The difference will then stand out by a mile.

 

[BoilerBoy]

"Is it worth it?"

AG is sometimes expensive to set up, time consuming and definitely not convenient - particularly if you have a family.

That said, neither is the time and big "$$" people fork out annually on Football season tickets, golf memberships, speed boats, ski trips whatever tickles your fancy!

It all depends on you and what you want out of brewing?
You can see the obsession here on this site, because in the end for AG brewers its all about the "taste" and perfecting a certain style, otherwise why all the effort?

Also, IMHO there are certain styles that can never be nailed properly except through AG, pilsner/lager as an example.

First time I ever heard about mashing I was some what intimidated and "gob smacked" as its a bit of a shock from the simplicity of kit brewing, and your question "Is it worth it?" was asked by myself and most AG brewers. however, within 12 months from my 1st K&K I was "taste driven" to AG brewing.

If you have Tasted decent AG beer, then you know how good it can be, the decision of "is it worth it?* isn't really the question, for me personally to make anything less isn't worth it.

Cheers,
BB

 

[raven19]

This question gets asked about once a month.....
There are 4 main considerations.

• Taste
• time
• consumables cost
• equipment cost

Butters is on the money here IMO also.

If you can afford a little more time, then no doubt AG is the way to go.

YES IT IS!!!!

+1

Try the FWK indeed, by then you shall be 3/4 the way down the slippery slope and be AG'ing it in no time!

4 days till my first AG... cant wait!

 

[Gavo]

Is it worth it? Well I just tasted my first AG yesterday, it was a 15 lt no chill done on the kitchen stove top, I was great and yes the result was worth it.

Equipment As others have said you don't need all of the bling equipment to make AG but you do need more than doing just a kit. I will be doing no-chill so my equipment will consist of a 20 lt ferementor style HLT, 60 lt kettle, esky mash tun, and a four ring burner, the rest is other equipment normally required for brewing.

Time is an issue, but I have worked my AG and my Partials around my regular evenings eg. Mash in - help get dinner ready, Sparge - eat dinner with family, Start boil - Kids in the bath, continue boil - kids to bed, finish boil and clean up. It is not all time that needs constant undivided attention but regular checking of the process.

Cost, well it is a little more than a supermarket kit but a premium beer is much more expensive than XXXX gold.

Taste AG or even a partial of 30% to 50% is far far better than a kit.

I never saw myself doing partails or AG six months ago but I have just slowly built my kit up and very soon will be doing mostly AG and probably keep doing some partials. When thinking of the next brew a kit never even comes into consideration.

When I got back into brewing I did it because it was cheap, I now do it as an interest/hobby/obsession. Cost does come into it but not as much. Ingredients for a brew are still cheaper than a slab of beer.

Cheers
Gavo

 

[McCraggen]

So heres my next obvious and probably over-asked question, what sort of equipment do you blokes prefer and wheres the best place to get it?

I watched some youtube vids, but they were all yankie, thought the eskie mash tun looked like a good idea.

Cheers.

 

[Wardhog]

So heres my next obvious and probably over-asked question, what sort of equipment do you blokes prefer and wheres the best place to get it?

Half the fun of AG is building the equipment yourself.