Dano's All Grain Feral Hop Hog Clone

[mattyg8]

Hey, decided to give this a go as my first foray into AG and BIAB. Thought I'd try to replicate the hops used by Feral. Like to get your thoughts:

Wort volume: 26.5L
Fermenter volume: 22L

20g Centennial @ 60

10g Amarillo @ 15
10g Cascade @ 15
10g Centennial @ 15

10g Amarillo @ 10
10g Cascade @ 10
10g Centennial @ 10

10g Amarillo @ 5
10g Cascade @ 5
10g Centennial @ 5

20g Amarillo @ Flameout
20g Cascade @ Flameout
20g Centennial @ Flameout

20g Amarillo @ Dry hop
20g Cascade @ Dry hop
20g Centennial @ Dry hop

IBUs ~ 47

Too crazy? Too symmetrical?

Hey how did this go? Im planning on doing my second BIAB soon and would like to try a Feral Hop hog clone

 

[brettski]

Hey how did this go? Im planning on doing my second BIAB soon and would like to try a Feral Hop hog clone

Hey,
How did it go, well okay I guess...
Definitely very fruity and similar to the real deal. The catch is, this was the first batch I did with no chill. I wasn't aware at the time, but this isn't necessarily the best idea in such a hoppy beer as there is a lot of hop material exposed too long in the scolding hot environment of the cube. A lot of hop particles and yeast seemed to still be in suspension after the two weeks of fermentation.
The final product came out too bitter and murky, I'm just getting around to drinking them now after letting them mellow out. Until I get an immersion chiller, I've been brewing low IBU stouts and brown ales.

TL;DR: I think this is a good recipe, just don't be no chillin' with so much hops

 

[danestead]

Hey,
How did it go, well okay I guess...
Definitely very fruity and similar to the real deal. The catch is, this was the first batch I did with no chill. I wasn't aware at the time, but this isn't necessarily the best idea in such a hoppy beer as there is a lot of hop material exposed too long in the scolding hot environment of the cube. A lot of hop particles and yeast seemed to still be in suspension after the two weeks of fermentation.
The final product came out too bitter and murky, I'm just getting around to drinking them now after letting them mellow out. Until I get an immersion chiller, I've been brewing low IBU stouts and brown ales.

TL;DR: I think this is a good recipe, just don't be no chillin' with so much hops

It's good to see that you can see some positives in your brew. Best of luck for next time.

Did you do a whirlpool for 10 or 15 mins after flame out before draining the wort into your no chill vessel? That should solve the issue of trub making it to the fermenter. I don't no chill so am not sure if people still whirlpool or not but I know that on my system, the wort will still be at 95 degrees after a 10 min whirlpool so I can't see any issues with the sanitation side of things draining it in at that temp.

I've just entered a Comet hop version of my latest recipe into the Perth Royal Beer Show. I entered it as an APA as it will be about 6 months old by the time it is judged in July so the aroma and bitterness would have faded a bit I think. Fingers crossed for that. I'm also only a couple of months off brewing another version using the same hops as you did to enter in the WASABC comp. later in the year. Fingers crossed for improved scores over last year

 

[brettski]

It's good to see that you can see some positives in your brew. Best of luck for next time.

Did you do a whirlpool for 10 or 15 mins after flame out before draining the wort into your no chill vessel? That should solve the issue of trub making it to the fermenter. I don't no chill so am not sure if people still whirlpool or not but I know that on my system, the wort will still be at 95 degrees after a 10 min whirlpool so I can't see any issues with the sanitation side of things draining it in at that temp.

I've just entered a Comet hop version of my latest recipe into the Perth Royal Beer Show. I entered it as an APA as it will be about 6 months old by the time it is judged in July so the aroma and bitterness would have faded a bit I think. Fingers crossed for that. I'm also only a couple of months off brewing another version using the same hops as you did to enter in the WASABC comp. later in the year. Fingers crossed for improved scores over last year

If my memory serves me, I did do a 10 minute flameout but no whirlpool. I've got a thermowell in my brewpot and it makes it really hard to whirlpool.
Next time, changes I'll make will be:

- Immersion chiller
- Irish moss
- Longer wait before bottling after batch priming

 

[mattyg8]

So whats a good hop schedule for this regarding no chill and whirlpool

 

[danestead]

So whats a good hop schedule for this regarding no chill and whirlpool

I don't no chill but to get your bitterness right you will need to take into consideration whether you are letting you wort chill to ambient out in the open, whether you are putting it in a fridge or whether you are throwing it in a pool.

As for the later additions, if I were to no chill I'd be putting the 15min addition in at flameout, the whirlpool addition as a hop tea into the fermenter at fermenting time or skipping that step and obviously still using the dry addition dry.

I think there is an extract hop hog thread doing the rounds which no chills. That may give you a better idea.

 

[mattyg8]

Ill have to check it out

 

[Tobes15]

Dano,
tried your recipe 3 and really happy with it even though I stuffed some things up. My mash temps were very sloppy and I overshot the diacety rest to 28C.
Anyway, in comparing my brew after 3 weeks in bottle to the real thing:
mine was a darker reddish colour - not unhappy about this
my head is very fluffy - protein? - have since bought a plate chiller and a pump so I can do a proper whirlpool
my aroma is a bit flat in comparison
the real Hop Hog has a finer bead (bubbles)
However I cant tell the diff in the taste

All in all, your recipe is brilliant. Thanks heaps. Doing another soon.
Tobes

 

[danestead]

Dano,
tried your recipe 3 and really happy with it even though I stuffed some things up. My mash temps were very sloppy and I overshot the diacety rest to 28C.
Anyway, in comparing my brew after 3 weeks in bottle to the real thing:
mine was a darker reddish colour - not unhappy about this
my head is very fluffy - protein? - have since bought a plate chiller and a pump so I can do a proper whirlpool
my aroma is a bit flat in comparison
the real Hop Hog has a finer bead (bubbles)
However I cant tell the diff in the taste

All in all, your recipe is brilliant. Thanks heaps. Doing another soon.
Tobes

Excellent Tobes. Glad you enjoyed it!

Your comments seem pretty close to my observations based on recipe #3 also. I am due to brew recipe #4 in about a month and comparatively, this recipe has double the hops in the whirlpool and 50% more dry hops. That one is going in the WASABC comp. so I really hope it comes up a treat.

I've been on a bit of a German craze the last 3 or 4 months (munich dunkel twice, vienna lager and dunkelweizen) and although I do really enjoy those styles, AIPA's still stand out as my favourite by a long shot. Can't wait to get some ales on tap!

 

[danestead]

Just a bit of an update. I'm brewing again in about a month for the WASABC competition and have made some minor adjustments (as you tend to do when you over think things over time) to the recipe I stated in post #136.

IBU's back to 52, Caramunich II back to 2.5% and less sulphate and no magnesium added to the water profile to try and improve a minerally astringency that I've had a comment about.


Dano's Hop Hog Clone (Recipe 4)

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 25.00 Post boil
Total Grain (Kg): 5.88
Anticipated OG: 1.058 Plato: 14.30
Anticipated EBC: 14.1
Anticipated IBU: 52.5 Tinseth
Brewhouse Efficiency: 78 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes
Target FG: 1.014

Alc by Volume: 5.8%


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
87.5 5.15 kg. Barrett Burston - Ale Malt Australia 1.038 6
10.0 0.59 kg. Weyermann Munich I Germany 1.038 15
2.5 0.15 kg. Weyermann Caramunich II Germany 1.035 125


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
33.00 g. Magnum Pellet 10.28 36.1 60 min.
12.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.62 5.5 15 min.
12.00 g. Cascade Pellet 7.93 5.0 15 min.
12.00 g. Centennial Pellet 9.33 5.9 15 min.

17.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.00 0.0 Whirlpool at 70 degrees.
17.00 g. Cascade Pellet 5.60 0.0 Whirlpool at 70 degrees.
17.00 g. Centennial Pellet 9.90 0.0 Whirlpool at 70 degrees.

25.00 g. Amarillo Gold Pellet 8.62 0.0 Dry Hop - Aim for 4 days of dry hop time
25.00 g. Cascade Pellet 7.93 0.0 Dry Hop - Aim for 4 days of dry hop time
25.00 g. Centennial Pellet 9.33 0.0 Dry Hop - Aim for 4 days of dry hop time

Wort is immersion chilled immediately at flame out to 70 degrees for the 15min whirlpool/hopstand and then plate chilled to the fermenter.


Yeast
-----

WYeast 1272 American Ale II with starter for correct pitch rate.


Water Profile
-------------

RO/DI water built to the following proile.

Profile: Dano's American Ale v3

Calcium(Ca): 110.0 ppm
Magnesium(Mg): 0.0 ppm
Sodium(Na): 15.0 ppm
Sulfate(SO4): 100.0 ppm
Chloride(Cl): 50.0 ppm


Mash Schedule
-------------

Dough In Temp: 38 Time: 0
Intermediate Rest Temp: 66 Time: 20
Intermediate Rest Temp: 67 Time: 40
Intermediate Rest Temp: 72 Time: 10
Mash-out Rest Temp: 76 Time: 10
Sparge Temp: 76 Time: 0


Fermentation Specifics
----------------------

Pitched From: Starter
Primary Temperature: 18 degrees C until 1.020 gravity and then 22 degree diacetyl rest. Leave the beer on the yeast for minimum 3 days once FG is reached then chill to 1 deg for clarification.

 

[Moad]

This one drinking yet? Haven't done an aipa for a long time and am ready to move on from the browns stouts and porters of winter

 

[danestead]

I am dry hopping it this afternoon so will have it in the keg in about a week! Cant wait!

 

[Moad]

Following...please report back! Cheers mate

 

[bruiserbbq]

My attempt at your #4 recipe Dano. I got the colour right...but not quite as good as the real thing.
Mine is not as sweat or floral. This was only my second go at all grain (BIAB) so I made a few mistakes.
But I'm still pleased with the result. Will certainly be brewing this again.....as soon as I empty the keg!
Thanks for the recipe Dano.....much appreciated.

Cheers Mark

 

[danestead]

Wow that colour is spot on isnt it!

My number 4 is crash chilling atm so should have it in the keg for a taster in a week or 2.

 

[mattyg8]

I also did this one with slight modification as couldn't get any magnum at the time, its currently fermenting and will be dry hopping Saturday! Cant wait.

 

[bruiserbbq]

I forgot to mention I FWH with the Magnum pellets. The bitterness is about right....but doesn't have the aroma or the in your face hops like the real deal.

I thought I had blown it when I added the remainder of the hops into the keg....I tried it the next day.....and it tasted like orange/fruit juice....I thought oh no!
But it settled down after a week....thank goodness!

I must learn to have a bit more patience before sampling!

Cheers Mark

 

[purple-lazy]

I had a go at a version of this on the weekend. Fermentation is rapidly progressing to the point where I need to decide on my dry hopping method. This will be my first time dry hopping.

If you're about Danestead I was wondering if the four day contact time you recommend was at fermentation temps or during cold crash?

I'd also love to hear an update on your number 4 brew if there's any progress there?

Cheers and thanks for the recipe.

 

[danestead]

I had a go at a version of this on the weekend. Fermentation is rapidly progressing to the point where I need to decide on my dry hopping method. This will be my first time dry hopping.

If you're about Danestead I was wondering if the four day contact time you recommend was at fermentation temps or during cold crash?

I'd also love to hear an update on your number 4 brew if there's any progress there?

Cheers and thanks for the recipe.

The 4 day contact time is at fermentation temp. I've dry hopped at cold temps. before however I didnt get much aroma out of it. The warmer temps. seem to extract those aroma oils much quicker than at a colder temp. I've gone away from dry hopping in a bag now because it is a pain in the ass and I wasn't getting great aroma from that technique. Probably because the hops were not able to spread out in the fermenter as well. So I try to dry hop just before fermentation has finished.

Number 4 is in the keg but I had a couple of issues with that one. The 1272 yeast decided to attenuate right down to 1.010 rather than the 1.014 which it had in the past which has left the beer too dry. I've also had issues with my brewing water which is leading to an astringency. I've decided to scrap the whole RO/DI water with salts thing, and try just using proportions of RO and tap water to see if that solves the astringency problem. So an over attenuated and astringent beer. Not so flash. That beer was judged at the WASABC on the weekend so I'll have the comment sheets soon but I'm not expecting much in the way of scores unfortunately. I should really chill that keg again and compare it to a real Hop Hog to see if the hopping etc is on the right track. Try take the good out of what I've brewed you know.

The good news for you is I think the issues are with my process rather than the recipe, as it's turned out quite nice in past batches.

Let me know how you go.

 

[purple-lazy]

Cheers mate. Thanks for the feed back. I'll probably dry hop tonight then by adding directly to the fermenter, and rack off in 4 days or so.

Sorry to hear about your water issues. I treated mine for the first time with this brew also. Too early to tell yet how it's going to work out, but to be honest I'll be happy if I get something that's reasonably drinkable.