Can't Find The #%#$% Kit!

[Hughdawg]

Hi all,

I've been using a Brewcraft imported 1.8kg Belgian Ale to make a Chimay- like recipe. Unfortunately, the local shop doesn't have the kit, so I'm wondering if I could use grain / malt and get away without the kit? The bloke at the shop recommended a wheat kit, would this work? Cheers.

 

[sav]

What yeast are you using with the kit is the question
sav

 

[Armstrong]

The Brewcraft Belgian is actually Munton Wheat relabelled, so any wheat kit would be a decent alternative.

Brewcraft kit will slowly, if not already, disappear as they are all being relabelled under the name "Mangrove Jack".

Either way, they are imported from England and I can't see the point of that when there are so many locally produced products that will be considerably fresher

 

[Dazza_devil]

Dump the kits and go extract, you will never look back.
It's the next step along the pathway to better beer.

 

[petesbrew]

Dump the kits and go extract, you will never look back.
It's the next step along the pathway to better beer.

C'mon Boagsy. Either come back with an extract recipe for a chimay clone or your reply is a waste of bandwidth.

 

[kelbygreen]

I think extracts better but in saying that I have made a extract just as bad as a kit but thats my fault mainly I just make shit up as I go haha, Cant give recipe as hate wheat beer and dunno what chimay is lol

 

[Dazza_devil]

C'mon Boagsy. Either come back with an extract recipe for a chimay clone or your reply is a waste of bandwidth.

Easy enough to research one. Use the Style Guidelines, google, Jamil and Palmer's Brewing Classic Styles or whatever resources you have at hand and some brewing software.

I don't know which Chimay he's trying to clone and I don't know off hand what they use hop wise, IBU's or EBC's so I will just go for a Belgian Tripel.
I've never made a Belgian but with a little research here's what I would start with,

1 can Coopers Wheat LME
1kg cane sugar
2kg LDME
500g clear Belgian Candy Syrup

100g Dingemans Aromatic Malt steeped in 9-10 litres of a water @ 67 degrees C for 30mins (if you're worried about starch conversion use Carabelge)

50g Hallertau Mittlefrueh @ 60 mins
20g Saaz @ 10mins

Wyeast 3787 or safbrew T-58 using a nice big 3-5 litre starter.

Add the candy syrup toward the end of the boil.

Start fermentation at around 18 degrees C ramping it up until you hit about 26 degrees C after a week or so.

Add the cane sugar around day 3 or 4.

Try it at your own risk, it's never been brewed before and is just a quick stab in the dark.

You might want to ferment this out over 3 or 4 weeks in the primary and be prepared to age it for a few months in the bottle.

 

[Hughdawg]

What yeast are you using with the kit is the question
sav

I've got a few bottles of my last brew left over, where I used a whitelabs Belgian ale yeast WLP 550. I'm going to try and make a yeast starter from this. I agree with you, the yeast makes a big difference with this kind of beer.

 

[Armstrong]

I have been corrected on the Mangrove Jacks ... apparently they are making those one's in NZ ... so they are not Muntons like the Brewcraft can were.

 

[Hughdawg]

My recipe is:

Brewcraft Belgian ale kit
Morgans Pale Larger Malt extract (1 can)
350g dark crushed grain
a squeeze of licorice extract
Morgans Finishing hops bag (Hallertau)
Morgans Finishing hops bag (Goldings)
Wgitelabs Belgian ale yeast WLP550

It involves boiling for about 20 min and only makes 17L, but it's a fantastic brew. I've read adding brown sugar improves a Chimay Bleu imitation, but haven't tried this yet. Worth the effort.

 

[Hughdawg]

I have been corrected on the Mangrove Jacks ... apparently they are making those one's in NZ ... so they are not Muntons like the Brewcraft can were.

Bugger - I'd probably prefer to get one that wasn't imported (and probably cheaper). I'm going to try it with a wheat beer kit this time anyway and see how it goes. I'll let you know.

 

[Hughdawg]

I think extracts better but in saying that I have made a extract just as bad as a kit but thats my fault mainly I just make shit up as I go haha, Cant give recipe as hate wheat beer and dunno what chimay is lol

You need to try a chimay, even if it's only once. The have a Dubble, a Rouge and a Bleu, which get progressively darker. They're a trappist beer, and I actually went to the monastery / brewery a couple of years back. The monks also make cheese, which they don't sell commercially, but went amazingly well with the beer.

 

[MHB]

Having brewed the Belgian Ale several times, I fairly sure it isn't the Wheat kit, the specks on the can line up with the Muntons Connoisseurs IPA, for starters the Wheat is >10 EBC and the Belgian was ~25.
The whole Brewcraft Imported range were rebadged Muntons kits, Muntons are apparently no longer doing this. Mangrove Jacks' range was introduced as replacements with virtually the same names and specifications - tho made in NZ.
The new MJ Belgian Ale might be worth a shot.
Personal opinion don't use Liquorice in your beer at best you get good beer with a Liquorice flavour at worst its undrinkable.

If it's any help, dipping into Graham Wheelers "Brew Classic European Beers At Home"
Chimay Red
OG 1.063
Bitterness 28 IBU
Colour 45 EBC

Chimay White
OG 1.071
Bitterness 30 IBU
Colour 25 EBC

Both will contain just under 10% Sugar (white), are finished with a hint of Hallertau at just over 0.5g/L. And no god dam Liquorice!

MHB

 

[Pennywise]

Personal opinion don't use Liquorice in your beer at best you get good beer with a Liquorice flavour at worst its undrinkable.

I couldn't agree more with this, also just IMO

 

[Dazza_devil]

I've tried the Blue once. I thought it was the nicer out of all the Chimays. I didn't detect any licorice in there though. I thought it was nice and spicy which perhaps comes a little from the yeast and also from a few little secret spices that the monks may put into it. Cinamon, Cloves, Orange peel comes to mind but it was quite a while a go.
According to the AABC Style Guidelines the Chimay Grande Reserve or Blue falls into the catagory of a Belgian Dark Strong Ale.
I would add some cane sugar or better still some dark belgian candy syrup to your recipe.
What grains are you using?
What did you base your hop selection on?

 

[manticle]

Your yeast strain is equivalent to 1214 which is allegedly the chimay yeast. That will go a long way to getting you there. Keep the recipe simple, use a bit of sugar for dryness and use noble hops.

A bit of aromatic or special b will help but don't overdo it.

Slight correction above: They have a tripel (white) dubbel (red) and dark strong (blue) although those classifications are pretty loose

 

[petesbrew]

I've only done a few partial & AG belgians... well, I've attempted kit ones, but they're not worth mentioning.
Candy Sugar is reasonably easy to make. (Sorry, couldn't be arsed providing a link).
Hopswise, Styrian Goldings + Saaz is fantastic.
WLP500 is my fave yeast. T-58 is kept as a backup, as this one takes months to be drinkable IMO.

Sorry, no extract recipe - just a few tips, that's all.

You HAVE to try making a belgian, Boagsy .... bloody love those belgians.

 

[Dazza_devil]

You HAVE to try making a belgian, Boagsy .... bloody love those belgians.

I agree mate. Those monks really know what they are doing for sure. The complexity and depth of flavour in these beers is really something else and made to be truely enjoyed and savoured. To bring all the different aspects of these beers together and balance it perfectly is IMO a work of real genius.

It's on the cards, I have a pack of WY3787 that's been patiently waiting in my fridge, like a monk.
Just getting all my gear together and working on my new revised methods before I attempt one.

 

[Hughdawg]

Thanks all, plenty to think about. I'm going to pass on the wheat beer kit, and try using the dark grain I bought from the shop. Unfortunately, it doesn't say which type it is, only "grain - dark" Maybe a bit of extra light malt would help too?

As far as hops are concerned, I'm going with Goldings and Hallertau because I've used them before with the last kit, and it came out well.

Manticle, you're right, the yeast will make or break it, and I'm hoping I can get a yeast starter going.

On the advice of just about everyone, the licorice will be left out.

Thanks everyone!