bittering hops, does it matter?

[_Mick_]

Just wondering if anyone could tell me if it really makes any difference what hops you use for bittering? As long as you get the AA you want of course.

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Good question, I did a quick search on the topic and there are quite a few great threads on this, including this one http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/43120-bittering-hops/ which suggests some flavour can come through and the hop choice will make a noticeable difference (on top of the AA% contribution) :beer:

 

[lukiferj]

Plenty of info on here as mentioned above. I usually use magnum as I find it adds bitterness with little harshness or flavour. High AA and works in a lot of the styles I brew.

 

[_Mick_]

Cool thanks, I have been reading a bit on this topic and have found a fair bit of info but unfortunately being the internet there is alot of contradictions out there... Hoping someone has some first hand experience on what they do for bittering. I'm just looking for ways to cut cost so instead of buying lots of little bags of hops I can buy a bulk lot of a high AA hop as a generic bitterer.

 

[syl]

Cool thanks, I have been reading a bit on this topic and have found a fair bit of info but unfortunately being the internet there is alot of contradictions out there... Hoping someone has some first hand experience on what they do for bittering. I'm just looking for ways to cut cost so instead of buying lots of little bags of hops I can buy a bulk lot of a high AA hop as a generic bitterer.

It's not just an internet thing, it's particularly prevalent amongst homebrewing scene! It's due to the mix of science and subjective tasting and testing. There are a lot of pedants and a lot of theories that are simply fads. Hot side aeration???

I find that bittering hops do impart some flavour, to do with the make up of their oils. It's a reason I don't bitter with galaxy anymore, felt it imparted grassy flavours overall (sort of like dry hopping too early with galaxy)

If you want a neutral bittering hop, use Perle or Magnum. They add great IBU's whilst not adding too much harshness or notable flavours.

 

[wbosher]

I was discussing this exact topic with Manticle and Dr Smurto a while back, and I think you'll agree that they have plenty of experience. I'll see if I can find the thread, but basically the lower AA hops aren't quite as harsh as the higher ones, a more mellow bitterness if that makes sense.

Not such a big deal in a highly hopped IPA, but something with a lower IBU, it could possibly be detected.

Here it is

 

[Bribie G]

The bittering hops make a huge difference. Pride of Ringwood single addition, Saaz single addition and Challenger single addition will produce wildly different tasting beers. Many Continental brewers have no concept of late hops, flameout additions or dry hopping but you still get that hop aroma hit when you open the bottle. A rather extreme example of this is the hop Galena used in Corona. When I did a Cerveza style lager I used a fairly small amount of Galena in a 60 min boil and even though I only put in about 15g for the whole brew you could still get a slight hop nose on opening the bottle.

Having said that, some hops such as US Magnum and Pacific Gem are very neutral anyway if you are just looking for the "purest" bittering effect.

 

[manticle]

Some are more neutral than others.

I prefer to use a hop I don't mind the flavour of as they will impart character in my experience. I buy hops mostly in 500g lots so I don't worry too much about trying to save a few cents.

 

[QldKev]

I think it depends, If you bitter with a fairly neutral hop and slam it with 4g/L citra at flame out, then you won't get any bittering hops flavor. If you slam a hit of bittering and use a light / use no late hops then the bittering addition will shine it's ass off.

I think the best neutral bittering hop is Super Alpha, but like most NZ hops we get over charged for them. Second to that is US Magnum, which does impart some flavor. I do prefer to bitter with the correct hop for the job, as manticle said it doesn't cost much extra, unless you are paying too much for the hops to start with.

US Magnum is current $US12.99 for a lb from http://www.yakimavalleyhops.com Fill up your basket to 3.5lb to get the best shipping benefit, and get a few decent amounts of some great hops. It may take an extra couple of weeks compared to local purchased stuff, but it works out at about half the cost.

 

[syl]

I think it depends, If you bitter with a fairly neutral hop and slam it with 4g/L citra at flame out, then you won't get any bittering hops flavor. If you slam a hit of bittering and use a light / use no late hops then the bittering addition will shine it's ass off.

I think the best neutral bittering hop is Super Alpha, but like most NZ hops we get over charged for them. Second to that is US Magnum, which does impart some flavor. I do prefer to bitter with the correct hop for the job, as manticle said it doesn't cost much extra, unless you are paying too much for the hops to start with.

US Magnum is current $US12.99 for a lb from http://www.yakimavalleyhops.com Fill up your basket to 3.5lb to get the best shipping benefit, and get a few decent amounts of some great hops. It may take an extra couple of weeks compared to local purchased stuff, but it works out at about half the cost.

Very good service from Jeff in the past. Would definitely recommend them. The hold up isn't his shipping, it's generally our customs!

I have found customs have been great though. They do a pin prick test of one bag and leave the rest.

 

[stm]

How much (and what weight) are the little bags of hops you are buying? Are these the hop tea bags from your LHBS? In this case, yes, cost is an issue, but if you buy 90g bags from Craftbrewer or other sponsors of this website, then cost is no longer an issue even if you are bittering with Saaz or other low AA% noble hops. Or you can buy by the pound as suggested above!

 

[manticle]

I agree with Kev in part - a lot of late hopping will disguise most of the flavour impact you'll get from a different hop. However given that it's mostly new world type hops that people use for high late hopping and given that most of them are high aa (the example given of citra is 11-13% generally), what is to be gained by using something else? Why not use citra all the way (unless there's a shortage). Maybe Cascade and centennial since cascade is usually 5-6% and Centennial close to twice that but generally I don't see a lot to be gained.

For something with a fair bit of late saaz at 3.5%, it makes some economical sense to bitter with something like German Northern Brewer although I would prefer to suck it up and just use the saaz.

In addition to flavour, many hops will add piney resinous character so even if the flavour is not distinct, the hop is.

IF I were pushed I'd say German NB would be my first pick and Magnum always gets a good rap from people who use it. Centennial for US style but I like the flavour of centennial anyway

 

[GalBrew]

I like to use Magnum in most of my higher IBU ales to act as a bittering hop, mainly as it allows me to stretch my other hops out a bit more. I still use POR from time to time in certain styles, but with Euro beers I tend to use low alpha hops all the way through.

 

[wbosher]

I just bought some Cascade at 9.1AA%, that's a lot higher than I've ever seen it before. Be using that all the way through

 

[Dave70]

Conversely, sort of, has anyone gotten harsh results from using a hop more traditionally associated with aroma / flavor like say cascade for bittering?
Cant recall if it was cascade exactly, but I'm pretty sure I've added a bunch of mid low to mid range hops in the past early in the boil, most likely to use them up, to attain APA levels of bittering (at the high end) and it turned out rough as guts.

 

[wbosher]

I do that all the time Dave, not noticeable bad results. I often us a low AA% hop like Fuggles as a bittering hop in my English beers.

Most of my beers are single or double hop, rarely more, so if I use one hop for flavour/aroma, I usually use the same one for bittering as well.

What I have done on a couple of occasions is rather that add a shitload at 60mins, I'll add less at say 80min. No complaints yet...

 

[syl]

Conversely, sort of, has anyone gotten harsh results from using a hop more traditionally associated with aroma / flavor like say cascade for bittering?
Cant recall if it was cascade exactly, but I'm pretty sure I've added a bunch of mid low to mid range hops in the past early in the boil, most likely to use them up, to attain APA levels of bittering (at the high end) and it turned out rough as guts.

Not with Cascade. Cascade is beautiful all the way through.

 

[_Mick_]

Excellent thanks for the replies, so the general consensus is Magnum for generic bittering.
Cheers

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Conversely, sort of, has anyone gotten harsh results from using a hop more traditionally associated with aroma / flavor like say cascade for bittering?
Cant recall if it was cascade exactly, but I'm pretty sure I've added a bunch of mid low to mid range hops in the past early in the boil, most likely to use them up, to attain APA levels of bittering (at the high end) and it turned out rough as guts.

I can +1 your experience Dave, I accidentally put Cascade in at 60min for a fat yak clone instead of the Nelson Sauv, but had a moment of "F it" and threw in the Nelson as well, leaving myself without any 0min/dry hop hops. Turned out drinkable but was a very bitter beer. Lesson learned, don't be an idiot on brew day.

 

[Bribie G]

Conversely, sort of, has anyone gotten harsh results from using a hop more traditionally associated with aroma / flavor like say cascade for bittering?
Cant recall if it was cascade exactly, but I'm pretty sure I've added a bunch of mid low to mid range hops in the past early in the boil, most likely to use them up, to attain APA levels of bittering (at the high end) and it turned out rough as guts.

I've started doing some "pot luck" brews just to see what happens. Using the same base malt all the time plus maltose syrup, I reach into the fridge and just grab a bag blindly, and weigh out to 30 IBU - single addition.

Latest one was Centennial, which is noted as an aroma hop. Ended up surprisingly Non-smooth and a bit astringent. (edit: the archetypal home brew that a Tooheys New drinker remarks "ooh that's a bit different", meaning "Please God get me out of here, make it end :lol: )