Biab Question ?

[rupal]

Hi all,

I am close to doing my first AG brew using the BIAB method, & i just finished reading the BIAB pdf tutorial. The one thing i am not 100% sure about is that it says to Dough in the grain & then heat up to mash in temperature, wouldn't it be better to heat up the water to strike temperature, & then dough in the grain ?

 

[Katherine]

Hi all,

I am close to doing my first AG brew using the BIAB method, & i just finished reading the BIAB pdf tutorial. The one thing i am not 100% sure about is that it says to Dough in the grain & then heat up to mash in temperature, wouldn't it be better to heat up the water to strike temperature, & then dough in the grain ?

You have to bring the water up to strike temp first, then add bag of grain then bring up to mash temp!

 

[rupal]

I am not 100% sure what you mean, The mash schedule i am doing for my recipe is a Single Infusion Mash @ 65c (90m) & Mash-Out @ 76c (15m). So would i measure the temp of grain & calculate the strike temp i need to get 65c mash once grain is added to the water ?

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

What I do is heat the water to 2degC higher than I want to mash at, turn off the heat, then add the grain and give the thing a really good stir. It is almost *always* close enough that it makes no sense to me to do anything else.

 

[Katherine]

Heat the water up to about 67... then put the grain in, agiate it quite alot... take another temp reading you may or may not have to put the burner on again. that works for me!

 

[Katherine]

Oh and keep calm... write down everything even your'e mistakes!

 

[rupal]

Thanks for the enthusiasm, i am just waiting to get a few bits & pieces (Wart Chiller & Ball Valve for Pot, etc...) by the way, i just realized that "Beersmith" has a built in Strike temperature calculator which is handy, also i just want to confirm with the "Mash-Out" I would raise the temp to 76c for the last 15 minutes & the pull out the bag & let it drain, is that right ?

 

[Katherine]

Thanks for the enthusiasm, i am just waiting to get a few bits & pieces (Wart Chiller & Ball Valve for Pot, etc...) by the way, i just realized that "Beersmith" has a built in Strike temperature calculator which is handy, also i just want to confirm with the "Mash-Out" I would raise the temp to 76c for the last 15 minutes & the pull out the bag & let it drain, is that right ?

yes... what are you brewing??? I usually skip the mash out , with no consequences...

 

[rupal]

i'm brewing a Belgian Dubbel, from a recipe i came across, the grain bill is over 8kg,

 

[Bribie G]

With 8 kilos of grain you might want to have the strike water about four degrees hotter than your desired mash temperature. Make sure the grain is at ambient temperature, not fridge temperature if that's where you have been storing it.

Also, dont just pour it in, trickle it in as a thin stream and keep stirring otherwise you'll be chasing lumps the size of vitabrits around in your mash for ages trying to break them up.

Have a jug of boiling water and a jug of ice water handy just in case but don't worry if you don't hit your mash temp exactly, no harm should arise.

Have fun :icon_cheers:

 

[Katherine]

Well you will need to mash out then I am guessing.... not into dubbel's myself. Im sure Spills or Thirsty can help you on that.

Just a suggestion....(KISS) why dont you make something a little more simple for your'e first AG! A quaffer... I found Ross's Summer Ale with Nelson Sauvin fantastic and great tasting beer then you can play around with single hops! Just because the process is reasonabily easy, still quite hard to make a great beer! That's my what I think anyhow! I have done 15 BIABS and just stepping out now... doing a kolsch next week... getting excited!

 

[Thirsty Boy]

You also need to be prepared for the fact that with a grain bill that large - you will most likely get uninspiring efficiency.

So whatever setting for efficiency you are using in Beersmith, its probably intended to be for a more middle of the road beer I would be inclined to cut your expected efficiency by about 5%... and maybe be ready for that to have not been enough.

This problem of decreasing efficiency with increasing grain bill is common to batch sparge, no sparge and BIAB brewing - its somehting you will learn o compensate for more accurately, when you have a chunk of experience under your belt.

good luck

TB

 

[rupal]

Has anyone ever thought of or tried to do a sparge with BIAB ? Make a slightly thicker mash (Less water) & once the mash is complete drain the pot via Ball Valve, then pour the sparge water over the grain bag still in the pot.

 

[SpillsMostOfIt]

Has anyone ever thought of or tried to do a sparge with BIAB ? Make a slightly thicker mash (Less water) & once the mash is complete drain the pot via Ball Valve, then pour the sparge water over the grain bag still in the pot.

Yes.

You would need a second vessel to decant your sweet liquor into. You'd lose temperature (so have to add more heat). You'd need a third vessel to heat the hot liquor in, at which point you might as well do what the Multi-Vessel brewers do. (To make myself perfectly clear, I am negatively disposed to the idea.)

For a while, I used to DunkSparge (tm), where I would reserve some of the hot liquor in a 20litre bucket and dunk the drained bag in there, tipping the result into the kettle. It does give you a bit more efficiency, but at the expense of an extra vessel and a lot more piss-farting around.

Recommendation: Start simple, doing as the guide suggests for a while, then play.

 

[Thirsty Boy]

yep, quite a few people have tried out various methods for sparging a BIAB - your method seems as good as most.

BUT - The bags themselves dont sparge particularly well - the water just channels through/around/over the top of them. The only method I have seen that seems particularly effective - and the only one I have used as part of a legitimate brew rather than an experiment - is the Dunk Sparge.

All the variations require another vessel though, something to heat the extra water up in.. something to drain the wort into - doable and you can use your fermentor for at least one of these.

I personally think that bothering with it takes away from the main advantages of BIAB. The lack of bits of equipment and the simplicity of the process. For no real advantage other than a few points of efficiency. Some people think its worth it, not me though.

TB

 

[reviled]

Has anyone ever thought of or tried to do a sparge with BIAB ? Make a slightly thicker mash (Less water) & once the mash is complete drain the pot via Ball Valve, then pour the sparge water over the grain bag still in the pot.

+1 for about 2 degrees above mash temp for your strike temp, pretty much allways bang on for me to every time..

I sparge, but not in a dunk sparge way h34r: (dont shoot me anyone)

I basically use a little less water than full volume, probably about 4:1 instead of 5:1, then instead of raising temp to mash out, I just pull the bag halfway out after the mash without turning the burner on, sparge about 1.5litres over the bag while its in the pot, then dump the bag in a bucket, and sparge again with another 1-1.5litres of water.. For the sparge water I just boil the jug and let it cool while the mash is going..

This process increased my efficiency by heaps, regularly between 81-83%, BUT more importantly, I now get consistent figures every time and I know what to expect B) Which is the main thing..

And ill usually top up a litre or three in the fermenter as well, all of this came from having a bloody small pot, but it works, and my beer tastes good, so im happy!

 

[reviled]

All the variations require another vessel though, something to heat the extra water up in.. something to drain the wort into - doable and you can use your fermentor for at least one of these.

I personally think that bothering with it takes away from the main advantages of BIAB. The lack of bits of equipment and the simplicity of the process. For no real advantage other than a few points of efficiency. Some people think its worth it, not me though.

My variation just requires a bucket (which all BIAB'ers use) and a normal household kettle..

I sort of agree it adds extra work, but not much, maybe an extra 2mins, its pretty easy to pour water over a bag, I dont do it in any fancy way just to make sure the sticky stuff on the bag goes in my kettle.. And I find my main advantage is I dont have to bring the mash to mash out temp (which takes ages with a 2 ring burner) so actually, I guess im saving myself effort (not having to stir the mash excessively while heating) and time (mash finished quicker, boil starts sooner)

 

[Nick JD]

As someone who has never done an all grain ... what efficiency would you get if you didn't sparge at all?

 

[reviled]

As someone who has never done an all grain ... what efficiency would you get if you didn't sparge at all?

With BIAB? And a mash out? You can expect to roughly get around 70% but it all depends on alot of things.. But 70 is a fairly good ballpark figure.. Reason I changed my way of doing it is because my efficiency was going up and down like a rollercoaster, now its stable..

 

[Mantis]

My variation just requires a bucket (which all BIAB'ers use) and a normal household kettle..

I sort of agree it adds extra work, but not much, maybe an extra 2mins, its pretty easy to pour water over a bag, I dont do it in any fancy way just to make sure the sticky stuff on the bag goes in my kettle.. And I find my main advantage is I dont have to bring the mash to mash out temp (which takes ages with a 2 ring burner) so actually, I guess im saving myself effort (not having to stir the mash excessively while heating) and time (mash finished quicker, boil starts sooner)

I did this with my partial biab brews. The second AG BIAB had woeful efficiency and I didnt sparge it.
Will tommorow when I do my 3rd and see what happens