Wild Yeast Problems - How you overcame

[clintonforster]

Hi Guys,

I've been having wild yeast infection problems for the past 7 months. I've brewed every single week since last June and no matter what i do i always get a wild yeast infection. My brew tastes the same and has the same distinct off flavour no matter what the grain bill, hops or yeast i use. The taste is kind of band aidy or soapy or something i really can't describe it.. it's just not beer.

The beer does not clear even with finings and gets very carbonated in the primary fermenter and ends up with a very low gravity. I have no plastic in my brewery and use a stainless steel brewbucket. I either brew in a pot on my stove or in an urn, i do 15 litre BIAB.

I have brewed with other brewers who are making great beer and are not as much of a cleaning and sanitizing freak as i am so i know there's nothing wrong with my process. I brewed with a mate last week on his system, he cubed a bit and i cubed a bit. I took mine home and got the same problem as always and his obviously turned out fine.

Suffice to say this is amazingly soul destroying for me as brewing is all i want to do and think about.

If anyone has any insight on how to get rid of this problem from my house please let me know, i just signed a new lease and don't have anywhere else to ferment/brew and have no idea where the problem is originating though it must be airborne. We have no fruit trees nearby either.

 

[tugger]

Mabee try nochill.
I had similar problems. I think I was picking it up in the semi open top whirlpool/ chilling process.
I have heard about using oil of clove and water in a spray bottle to spray and wipe around the house as an anti fungal mould spore and yeast killer.
I think it was 3 drops in 1L of water.

 

[clintonforster]

Mabee try nochill.
I had similar problems. I think I was picking it up in the semi open top whirlpool/ chilling process.

yeah i no chill and cube, doesn't help. Even did my last brew at another guys house on his system, cubed it, brought it home. His is fine, mine's infected.

 

[manticle]

Are you transferring from cube to fermenter or fermenting sraight in the cube?

 

[clintonforster]

Are you transferring from cube to fermenter or fermenting sraight in the cube?

transferring to my brewbucket

 

[manticle]

Ok. Try this.

Get a brand new cube and tap. Fill with boiling water then sanitise.

Replace tubes and lines with new stuff.
Clean everything in the brewery with boiling water and percarb or pbw. Pull apart all taps. Anything that will take chlorine bleach (so NOT stainless for starters) clean/santise using non-scented sodium hyporchlorite. Give all this a good soak in sodium metabisulphite solution, then another, thorough boiling water rinse.
Now spray liberally with no rinse sanitiser of choice.
Mash, boil, no chill cube. When cool, pitch yeast straight into cube, lid backed off a couple of notches.

One final question -how are you aerating the wort?

 

[tugger]

What sanitiser are you using and what concentration. I know you said you are a good sanitiser. I have found when bugs pop up a good dose of hot caustic followed by some peroxitane nails everything.
Edit. Manticle beat me to it.

 

[clintonforster]

The thing is all my stuff in the brewery is new anyway, all my tubing and cubes and everything. Are you saving clean my urn with sodium metabisulphite solution? The last cube i used was brand new and i brewed it at my mates house, then cleaned my brewbucket with tricleanium and pitched and sealed, I aerate by shaking

I really don't think cleaning my stuff is gonna help because i've bought new fermenters and tubes and everything multiple times to no avail and always pbw or oxyper and use star san 1.567 ml per litre. I think my house has something nasty in it.

 

[manticle]

I understand what you mean about house/wild yeast and I (and other brewers) have had similar issues. The cleaning regime is a total nuts one that is simply to eliminate that and any residual 'house' bugs. Sodium met serves 2 purposes - some anti- microbial features but also drives off the chlorine residue. Boiling water is for similar reasons.

It's mostly eliminating the transfer aspect I'm getting at though - pitching directly into the cube. I know how disheartening this can be - this is how I overcame it.

As for what solution goes where - check each item to see if it's suitable for contact with that chemical first, but wherever it is suitable, hit it. I mean walls, floors, fridge, everything.

 

[clintonforster]

so do you always pitch direct in the cube now? i just really have trouble understanding how this stuff gets in my brew when i'm so careful and clean compared to other people i see brew. Brewing seems to be such a simple and forgiving process for everyone but me!

 

[TimT]

What a heartbreaking problem. I haven't had infection issues as bad as this. Maybe, paradoxically, a really really continuously clean environment can make room for infections like this? Like, when you've cleaned away all the other bugs that are naturally proliferating in the kitchen, a tough local opportunistic bug can move in and take up the majority of the available space before you do anything about it? So you go from spick and span kitchen to, BING, filthy wild yeast ridden environment even though you didn't see anything happen?

 

[TimT]

Not possible to brew outside/brew in another room?

 

[clintonforster]

Not possible to brew outside/brew in another room?

Lately i've been doing all my brewing outside on non windy days, cubing, then pbwing and sanitising outside and transferring and pitching outside with everything covered with sanitized tea towels to stop stuff finding its way through. Nothing has been going into my house unless it's airtight sealed and still it gets in.

I have also Brewed outside, cubed and taken my fridge and plastic fermenter that had only had one previously botched brew in it and then been cleaned well, took it to my mates place and fermented and still got the same problem.

 

[manticle]

so do you always pitch direct in the cube now? i just really have trouble understanding how this stuff gets in my brew when i'm so careful and clean compared to other people i see brew. Brewing seems to be such a simple and forgiving process for everyone but me!

I don't absolutely always (lived in 2 different premises since then) but I do almost always.

That transfer leaves wort and vessel more exposed than you think. A properly no chilled vessel is as sanitary as you can get. I also eliminated any plastic from being near my starters. I boil and cool wort in a lidded ss pot but when I had an erlenmeyer, that worked too.

In case you missed it above - how are you aerating?

 

[manticle]

Sorry - you took the fridge to your mates to ferment in and got the same issue or did I misread?

 

[manticle]

What a heartbreaking problem. I haven't had infection issues as bad as this. Maybe, paradoxically, a really really continuously clean environment can make room for infections like this? Like, when you've cleaned away all the other bugs that are naturally proliferating in the kitchen, a tough local opportunistic bug can move in and take up the majority of the available space before you do anything about it? So you go from spick and span kitchen to, BING, filthy wild yeast ridden environment even though you didn't see anything happen?

You don't really believe that do you?

 

[luggy]

Are you using bleach to sanitise?

 

[manticle]

He's using starsan.

 

[indica86]

I had several persistent issues at one stage. I once threw a full FV in the bin.

I feel for you.

 

[Camo6]

What a heartbreaking problem. I haven't had infection issues as bad as this. Maybe, paradoxically, a really really continuously clean environment can make room for infections like this? Like, when you've cleaned away all the other bugs that are naturally proliferating in the kitchen, a tough local opportunistic bug can move in and take up the majority of the available space before you do anything about it? So you go from spick and span kitchen to, BING, filthy wild yeast ridden environment even though you didn't see anything happen?

You don't really believe that do you?

Doth not nature abhor a vacuum?

I certainly wouldn't blame a wild yeast infection on an overly sanitised brewery but when you eliminate all the competition then whatever gets deliberately introduced into the area can easily get a strong foothold given the chance. The same principle we use to ferment wort in most cases.

@ Manticle, I realise this isn't the point you're making but recently had 1469 ferment a flask of unrelated wort covered in gladwrap and foil in a freshly star-sanned fridge. (Tasted good however)

I believe there is a similar example in Jurassic Park when the dinosaurs start fertilising eggs too... "Nature finds a way."

But regarding the OP, my heart goes out to you. I've had a lot of ferment issues due to negligence but not to the level your describing. God speed.