Stubborn Wyeast 2206

[professional_drunk]

Want to get your thoughts on my current batch.
I brewed a 1.051 wort and pitched wyeast 2206 bavarian lager 4 days ago. 2 days ago I was a bit concerned, so I pitched another package of the same yeast. Fermentation is set to 12c. Yeast is a fresh in date pack. Currently the wort is not showing any signs of life. I brewed another batch on the same day which I pitched w34/70 and that one is progressing fine so I doubt there is a problem with process. The only other unusual thing I can think of is that the fermenter held some kombucha in the last batch, but I cleaned and sanitized everything between batches.

I've never experienced a lag time this long. A google search shows some people have have had lag problems with 2206, but 4 days seems a bit much. The only thing I can think of is that the yeast of this type is faulty.
Any thoughts?

 

[yankinoz]

What do you mean by no signs of life? Can you see into the fermenter? Are you going by action in an airlock? Check the specific gravity. If that is still near 1.051., both pkts of yeast were dead.

 

[professional_drunk]

OG hasn't moved. Using an allrounder. No bubbles, no krausen. Looks the same as on brew day. Surprisingly, nothing wild looks to have taken over either. Can't believe 2 packets of yeast are DOA. I might try and stick some wort from my already fermenting batch in and get it started.

 

[professional_drunk]

Lesson learned. Keep backup yeast on hand.

 

[MHB]

If you used Wyeast smack packs and they swell up after spanking, the yeast wasn’t dead. One of the handy features of a smack pack.
If pitched cool, especially if there is a large difference between the yeast temperature and the wort (>5oC) and if you wort isn’t well aerated it can take quite a while for some Lager yeasts to wake up and get going.
Did the smack packs swell, was the wort aerated?
Mark

 

[professional_drunk]

Wort was given pure o2. The yeast packs were at room temperature by the time they got pitched. The smack packs didn't swell. Is that a reliable indicator though? I thought I may have had packs not swell in the past but this is the first time I've ever had problems with wyeast.

The only other experience I've had with bad lag was danstar bry, but it fermented fine in the end.

btw, fermenter is still dead today.

 

[MHB]

Lager yeast should only be pitched close to its fermenting (or the wort) temperature. Going from 20oC to 12oC can kill a fair percentage of the yeast.
Swelling indicates that the yeast is alive (among other things), best practice is to have the smack pack at the same temperature as the wort, smack it, when it swells, pitch it into a well aerated wort.
Worth having a bit of a read up on how to use the yeast you are buying, Wyeast offers a fairly good starting point; there is also lots of other good information out there.
Mark

 

[yankinoz]

Lager yeast should only be pitched close to its fermenting (or the wort) temperature. Going from 20oC to 12oC can kill a fair percentage of the yeast.
Swelling indicates that the yeast is alive (among other things), best practice is to have the smack pack at the same temperature as the wort, smack it, when it swells, pitch it into a well aerated wort.
Worth having a bit of a read up on how to use the yeast you are buying, Wyeast offers a fairly good starting point; there is also lots of other good information out there.
Mark

Mark, we don't know the batch size. If it's 20+ L a single pkt without making a starter would be an underpitch. Add, as you say, yeast death due to temperature change and a very long lag is quite plausible. Still, no action five days in and after a second pitch? I dunno.

Prodrunk, the batch is in danger. If you don't have backup dry yeast, I suggest raising the temp immediately to 17 or higher. If fermentation starts, slowly cool back to 12. Explanation: lager yeasts thrive best at temps above the ideal range for quality. Hopefully you haven't invented Bavarian sour lager.

Prodrunk, making a starter would likely have prevented this.

 

[MHB]

Guy is brewing on a 20L Braumeister so I'm willing to take a punt on his batch size.
M

 

[professional_drunk]

Still doing 20l on my Brau. Even an underpitch should show signs of life after 4 days. In my thinking, if yeast doesn't show it's presence after 48 hours, then I think there's trouble. Are there any yeasts that lag longer than 48 hours in their normal course?

Unfortunately it's easter and my local brewshop is closed. No backup yeast, so I'm going to throw some wort from my already fermenting batch and see what happens. I've already written it off in my mind.

I know I likely underpitch, but I've made lagers in the past with good results and not dealing with starters has simplified my brewing.

Yank, it's tempting to get back into making starters so I could have foreseen the problem before risking the entire batch. Need to weigh the simplicity of not doing starters vs the rare event of buying dud yeast.

 

[yankinoz]

Still doing 20l on my Brau. Even an underpitch should show signs of life after 4 days. In my thinking, if yeast doesn't show it's presence after 48 hours, then I think there's trouble. Are there any yeasts that lag longer than 48 hours in their normal course?

Unfortunately it's easter and my local brewshop is closed. No backup yeast, so I'm going to throw some wort from my already fermenting batch and see what happens. I've already written it off in my mind.

I know I likely underpitch, but I've made lagers in the past with good results and not dealing with starters has simplified my brewing.

Yank, it's tempting to get back into making starters so I could have foreseen the problem before risking the entire batch. Need to weigh the simplicity of not doing starters vs the rare event of buying dud yeast.

Even if you add the wort, I'd still raise the temp at first.