Sparge water treatment

[Bonenose]

Hi all,

I have been looking into water treatment over the last few days and am a bit confused about sparge water treatment. I am using a Robobrew so at end of the mash lift mash pipe out and run sparge water through it, so given that my mash is over when doing this is there any point in treating my sparge water?

Am I missing something here, happy to admit my ignorance still new to me.

To clarify my water is is fairly neutral 7.6pH and no high levels of anything that I can tell, again given my limited knowledge, and also no chlorine.

Cheers

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Hi Bn,
It depends what beer you're brewing as to how the water profile should be adjusted.

Where are you sourcing your water?

 

[labels]

Hi all,

I have been looking into water treatment over the last few days and am a bit confused about sparge water treatment. I am using a Robobrew so at end of the mash lift mash pipe out and run sparge water through it, so given that my mash is over when doing this is there any point in treating my sparge water?

Am I missing something here, happy to admit my ignorance still new to me.

To clarify my water is is fairly neutral 7.6pH and no high levels of anything that I can tell, again given my limited knowledge, and also no chlorine.

Cheers

I can't see any reason to treat your sparge water any different from your mash water and I think most people here would use the same water.

pH is seldom a problem when brewing and of all the things you need to concern yourself about, pH is probably near the bottom. Unless you're using way-off water which you're not. You can add Calcium Chloride and/or Epsom Salts (Magnesium Sulphate) which will lower your pH and also alter your water profile. Also Gypsum will help.

The buffering effects of the natural acids in the mash are huge and adding acid has a limited effect. It will lower it but only to a point where it will pretty much bottom out.

My view, concentrate on brewing good beer, look after your yeast and leave the pH to look after itself.

 

[Bonenose]

Water source is bore water.
I am not really worried about pH have been messing around with water calculator on brewers freind and looking at making some additions of gypsum and salt based on this. Was just wondering if there was any advantage in treating my sparge water or if I just treat water for the mash.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Your sparge water goes into your finished beer.. so yes, it's worth treating it if it has any flaws or if you are aiming for a particular profile.

 

[Bonenose]

According to water calculator my Ca and SO4 are low so using gypsum to bring them up and then salt for sulphate to chloride ratio. Brewed a few beers so far with no issue without any water treatment, wanted to have a crack at a few with some treated water see if there is much difference.

 

[MHB]

It is absolutely worth at least Acidifying your sparge water, other salt additions can be beneficial but acidifying is really important.
If the pH is Alkaline it will extract tannins really quickly, you also want the total amount of Ca in the kettle at the start of the boil to be 50-100ppm minimum.
So after having a look at your water profile, remember that the Ca content is on all the wort you collect, if you don't have enough in the mash water to keep the minimum Ca content when it is diluted with sparge water, adding more to the mash or to the sparge water is a good idea.
Mark

 

[Bonenose]

Calcium is only 25 so need to treat that, did not know about acidifying sparge water will have to get onto that.

 

[mtb]

I acidify sparge water with a quick 1mL shot of lactic acid. Easy to use, just grab a cheap syringe off fleaBay, and it's worth it for peace of mind IMO.

 

[manticle]

If you go to the effort of treating mash pH, it's worthwile treating the sparge water (and super easy). I just use lactic - extra calcium salts go to the kettle but either way is fine.

 

[Bonenose]

Ok cheers guys, I'll get on to it.

 

[Quokka42]

I disagree with most comments here, and agree with sources such as Brun and Brewer's Friend - use your water to sparge as is. The low pH is only required for the mash, which should be stopped by now, and it sounds like you have all the nutrients you need for the ferment. Read the comments on the Brun water site - if your brew turns out too malty the first thing to try is just boiling then decanting your water (bore water tends to be a bit hard.)

If it ain't broke - don't fix it.

 

[Jack of all biers]

+ 1 for MHB and Manticle's advice, but as a bit of explanation I'll expand. Labels is fairly well spot on for Mashing, but the question is about treating sparge water. If when sparging the liquor in the mash goes above a pH of 6 then you start to enter the territory of extraction of tannins which can lead to an astringency in your beer. If your mash is a pH of 5.2-5.8 then it will buffer at that pH for quite sometime before it rises with the pH of the sparge water. Now if as in the OP the sparge water pH is 7.6 then towards the end of the sparge the pH will naturally rise above 6 as the buffering ability of the mash is reduced as the sugars are rinsed away.

Whilst it is not a must, if you want to improve your beers by playing with your sparge water, then pH adjustment is the first place to start. Play with Brewers Friends advanced water calculator for sparge water adjustment. Calcium, zinc and other ions can be added too, but adding them to the mash maybe better to assist mash pH and enzyme activity.

And for the record the Water book, for which Martin Brungard had some input recommends that sparge water be adjusted to a pH of 5.7 (as insurance) to ensure that the mash pH never reaches 6 during the sparge. For example the heat of the sparge water then has no effect on tannin extraction when the pH is below 6 (decoction not extracting tannin astringency is a good example of this).

EDIT - my above writings are not just from reading books, but also from thorough and accurate testing of water (liquor and sparge), mash, first runnings and last runnings. Even with my average sparge water pH of 6.8 the last runnings have sometimes risen above 6, although on lighter coloured beers I'll admit and only just.

 

[manticle]

I disagree with most comments here, and agree with sources such as Brun and Brewer's Friend - use your water to sparge as is. The low pH is only required for the mash, which should be stopped by now, and it sounds like you have all the nutrients you need for the ferment. Read the comments on the Brun water site - if your brew turns out too malty the first thing to try is just boiling then decanting your water (bore water tends to be a bit hard.)

If it ain't broke - don't fix it.

Where does brun say that?

 

[MHB]

I disagree with most comments here, and agree with sources such as Brun and Brewer's Friend - use your water to sparge as is. The low pH is only required for the mash, which should be stopped by now, and it sounds like you have all the nutrients you need for the ferment. Read the comments on the Brun water site - if your brew turns out too malty the first thing to try is just boiling then decanting your water (bore water tends to be a bit hard.)

If it ain't broke - don't fix it.

I think you need to do a bit more reading, or perhaps re-reading because you clearly didn't understand the stuff you have read already.
The OP said his Ca was 25ppm, which is very low, however bore water can vary from near zero to so minerally it isn't drinkable, but at 25ppm it is unlikely to be "Hard" and recommending "boiling and decanting" the classic treatment for high temporary hardness isn't just irrelevant its pretty stupid.
Mark

 

[Mardoo]

I love AHB late night.

 

[Benn]

Now might be a good time for me to chime in with a question about which way round to hold the instructions for my Ph meter,

 

[Jack of all biers]

Depends if it's a cheap Chinese ebay one. If so, turn them upside down, light a match, stand back... h34r:

 

[rude]

Opp could use R/O water to sparge then he wouldnt have to acidify
but would have to buy R/O unit filters

 

[Bonenose]

Right, correct me if I am wrong, so I can do my salt additions to achieve my desired water profile in with my mash water only, using total water volume in the calculator of course and then just an acid addition to the sparge water to adjust pH.