Beer Aftertaste Problem

[vlbaby]

Beer Krout,
If you really suspect your fermenters are imparting the funky flavours, then before you through them out, I would suggest this. You fill one with pre-boiled ( sanitised ) water or even just boiling water, seal the lid and leave it to sit for a week or so, then have a taste. If the fermenter is adding flavours, it will be 10 times harder for it to hide in plain water as compared to your beer.

Ofcourse, if it is an infection problem your fermenter is causing, this probably wont tell you anything, but it will at least let you know is there is flavours leaching in your beer.

BTW I never thro out old fermenters, you'll find a use for them somewhere else in your brewery. I have one as a HLT.


vlbaby.

 

[warrenlw63]

Exactly the reasons I dumped plastic and went across to glass.

1) No taps to stress about and;

2) No scratches (that I know of) to harbour bacteria.

Worth the extra stuffing around in terms of cleaning.

Warren -

 

[Steve]

Brad
What was the brew and what yeast did you use?
Cheers
Steve

 

[Lufah]

Another thing I thought about, are you reusing yeast? That could carry over and wild yeast or bacteria.

Travis

 

[pint of lager]

Infections can be hard to track down.

Remeber that every surface that comes in contact with your beer must be clean and sanitised. Lids, threads, grommets, o'rings, can opener, stirring spoon should be plastic or steel not wooden, the tap spout just prior to racking or filling bottles, don't float the hydrometer in the fermenetr, use a test jar and throw away or drink the sample, don't pour it back in and the fluid in the airlock that gets drawn back in when you pick up the fermenter are all possible sources.

One brewer I know of, he always had a similar problem to you. He found that he couldn't brew in his kitchen. Once he moved to the laundry, his infection problem went away.

 

[Beer Krout]

Steve
I was not trying to make a Guinness or a Belgium lambic sour "style".
It's not just been one beer, it's been a number of batches that have had this problem.
I've used WLP-001, WLP-004, Wyeast Czech Pilsner and Saflager.

Lufah
I haven't been reusing yeast as a rule. I did do this once and the batch was infected and I had to chuck it out.

pint of lager
You right there's a lot of things to think about, everytime you do any thing with the brew. I have/had been soaking anything that touches the brew in bleach for up to days. I don't float the hydrometer in the fermenter or throw back the samples. I put boiling water in the airlock.
My fermenting is done in the bathroom and bottling in the laundry.

If it's lactic infection have I got a chance of getting out?

Does a lactic (sour) infection normally show itself straight away. Or does it take a few months to build up sourness?

I just tasted an amber ale that is not quite two weeks in the bottle. Tastes great at the moment. I plan to drink it quickly before the lactic sourness slowly sets in.

 

[sosman]

Brett,

Whereas it is possible you may have some infection in your brewery, it is not the first place I would look. For peace of mind give everything a good clean and sanitise.

Given that there may be question over the age of some of the kit/extract that may explain the cidery taste in one of your brews. The sulphury note in the pils is probably just a normal byproduct of fermentation and will probably disappear.

It is easy to imagine flavours that are not really there, that is why I wanted a friend to help out with the tasting, even though I have judged hundreds of beers. Different people are also sensitive to different flavours and aromas.

If you are not up for a partial mash just yet, grab a reputable kit that is known to be fresh, and don't dilute it too much and add quality adjuncts. If you search around on here I am sure you will find some kit recommendations. After that it might be easier to track down other sources of "off flavours".

FWIW I would try to work on one variety of kit for a brew or two. Going from pils, to nut brown, to stout, to lager makes it difficult to track other variables.

 

[organicbrewer]

Are you using tap water or filtered/bottled water? I ask this because my first couple of brews had an astringent aftertaste that got worse as the beer got older. It turned out to be the chlorine in my drinking water. Now that i filter my water no more taste.

 

[Beer Krout]

Thanks sosman
Ok guys. I'm going to try a few things with sanitation. ie buy some gloves, replace the rings and taps,. I will try using bottled water and brew the same beer for a few brews to see if anything changes.

Organicbrewer
I've been using tap water. Melbourne water is supposed to pretty good. I guess it could be my pipes. I will try bottled water and see how that goes.

Will report any successes or failures at a later date.

 

[BRAD T]

Brad
What was the brew and what yeast did you use?
Cheers
Steve

[post="67130"][/post]​

Hi Steve,
It was just a Kit brew of 1 can Coopers Lager 500g Pale Malt extract & 500g Coopers Brew Enhancer 1 with 34/70 Yeast.

Cheers
Brad T

 

[Steve]

Brad
I did an ESB Bavarian Lager last year using the same yeast...turned out the same. Band Aid - Medicical taste. I had to dump it as they started gooshing. This was also from Col. He reckoned it was the yeast not stored at correct temps at the suppliers?. I dunno. He fixed me up with a replacementt - being the nice bloke he is. Its very disappointing. P.S. Hows the fridge conversion coming along? Saw your post on the keg-set up thread.
Cheers
Steve

 

[Ziggy-san]

BK -

In addition to the thoughts on chlorine and infections, it could HSA -- hot side aeration. Conventionally, HSA off flavors are describeds as 'wet cardboard' flavors -- I thought it smelled like wet sawdust and sulfur and tasted like athlete's foot covered in lamicil.

It could also be oxidation...

I seriously doubt yeast autolysis is the culprit -- I've stored beer on primary trub for six weeks with no issues.

BTW, is there any good reason for using valves in your buckets? I found them to be more of a hassle what with the need for extra sanitation, and racking canes and tubes work just as well.

Check your tubing as well.

 

[Darren]

Could easily be oxidation. Was the beer exposed to air for extended periods of time?

 

[Beer Krout]

Can't really blame it on Oxidation.
The tasters didn't detect an oxidation flavour in their testing.

The last batch I did was an ESB Fresh Wort kit. Pour in to the fermenter and top up with cold water. No heating at all.

Still has a sour aftertaste?!?

 

[sosman]

Can't really blame it on Oxidation.
The tasters didn't detect an oxidation flavour in their testing.

The last batch I did was an ESB Fresh Wort kit. Pour in to the fermenter and top up with cold water. No heating at all.

[post="68432"][/post]​

Isn't that the one you made up to 23 litres? IIRC that was the main problem.

 

[organo]

Beer Krout..

if it's any consolation, I reckon I have exactly the same problem...

after laying down my brews, it seems to take a month, more for the early ones, and less recently to develop a sour aftertaste to my brews..

a recent stout is quite undrinkable now, and it seems to have taken about fortnight for a very smooth drink to become a sour/bitter medicinal mess.. java script:emoticon(':blink:')
smilieam holding on to see how it develops, but am not optimistic...

am reading the thread with great interest, and as soon as I have bottled my present brew (Cooper's Sparkling Ale) - which is already showing signs of sourness.. am going to clean my gear as much as possible...

only problem is that I either have to drink (very difficult) - or throw out (painful) - some beer to make way for the next lot

Commiserations..

Organo

 

[Darren]

BK,
Oxidation can go through several phases. Severe oxidation can result in sourness that masks any slight oxidation faults (cardboard).
Also exposure to oxygen allows bacteria such as acetobacter to thrive, resulting in sourness.
How much "headspace" do you have in your fermenter? How well is your fermenter sealed whilst conditioning?

 

[Beer Krout]

Hi Guys

I'm not sure about the oxidation. I'm usually very careful after primary fermentation starts to avoid it. I have two plastic 30L fermenters and I rack from one to the other with a 2m by 8mm of clear PVC plastic tube spiraled on the bottom of the second fermenter.

My brew volumes are now between 15-18L

I have just purchased a 20L Glass Carboy style fermenter for a secondary. If oxidation is happening during that stage. This should fix it. Haven't used it yet.

My bulk priming method has been to gently pour the sugar solution on the side of the fermenter and gently stir with a spoon, hopefully avoiding oxidation.

Bottling is done in the normal, little bottler way!

Organo. Commiserations also.
Just chucked out a heap of six month old beer, that was undrinkable.

I'm taking a lot of new careful steps to rid myself of this problem, whether its lactic sourness, oxygenation or chlorination. I'm unsure, but I will attempt to fight it on all fronts.
Have begun the yeast starter for a new batch of APA. Will keep you guys informed on how things turn out.

BK.

 

[pint of lager]

BK, you are using 30 litre fermnters and racking from one to another with a batch size of 18 litres. Are you racking for bulk priming, or for secondary? Bulk priming is ok, but if you are seondarying in a fermenter with large headspace, that would certainly be the cause of oxidation.

 

[Weizguy]

For my 2 cents worth... <_<

I have had a couple of ESB fresh wort kits that became sour.
Certainly don't want to blame it on them. Not out of hand, anyway.

I could taste mine as a vinegar flavour, and blame it on acetobacter. At the time, we had a few Drosophila (vinegar flies) in the house.

I cleaned my equipment (more vigourously than usual) and have brewed since that time without the same result.

In my case, I need to ensure that there are no beasties in the house and house ventilation/ air turbulence is minimised while brewing.

Looking forward to my California Common and Dunkelweizen soon.

Seth :lol: