Vic Xmas 2009 Case Swap - Tasting Thread

[manticle]

Thank Christ. I thought I was the only one actually drinking any of these.

#21 Hutch: Nelson Sauvin pseudo lager

Pours with a white head that dissipates very quickly. High carbonation (spritzy).

Golden/amber colour, hazy (I've read somewhere that large amounts of hops can make things hazy)

Massive hop aroma.

Flavour is all hops. Very fruity. To me it tastes like Chinook with a hint of amarillo but the name of the beer obviously suggests the main character is Nelson which is not a hop I'm familiar with.

Masses of fruit with this, quite sweet too but not in an unpleasant way. The higher carbonation probably works in its favour because it prevents the sweetness from becoming too much. My only criticism would be perhaps a touch more bitterness might balance out all that fruitiness. I can detect some bitterness on the palate but there's a fruit salad going on in my mouth and it needs a slightly bigger playmate.

Very tasty though.

 

[Leigh]

#10 Manticle's Robust Porter

It's a boy! Mine gushed when opened, sat it down for a good 3-4 minutes before it slowed (I did open at room temp ~ 12C)

Apart from that, lovely roasty aromas, something earthy there too?, light tan colour, head dissipated a little too quickly.

Past the lips, had a good balance of malt and hop bitterness with a nice dry finish.

A really nice porter Manticle. Could drink this one all night, but unfortunately only had one bottle!

 

[manticle]

Probably best to chill first and then allow to warm to 8-10 deg C. Current weather has given me a couple of boys as I've been so used to just grabbing bottles from the shed at spot on temps over winter and the first bit of spring. That time has passed.

Earthyness may either be the fuggles hops or the caramelised first runnings (deep thick toffee syrup).

Glad you liked it.

 

[Fourstar]

5. Fourstar - Reunification Express, Viet Rice Lager
Only thing to add other then what others have already said is that I got a bit of honey flavour. I'm enjoying it, I'm just not sure what it is that has contributed to that - and I'd like to know, cause I think it adds nicely to the beer. Is it the rice? Malt?

Just a guess as JW Pils it malty sweet by nature. That with carapils (which does have a very very mild sweet note) would probabaly give it that honey sweetness.

Cheers! :icon_cheers:

 

[notung]

#1 - Kleiny - Unhappily Everafter Munich Helles.
Ok, I read the style guidelines before drinking so I'm sort of going off that.

Appearance: A clean pale-coloured liquid like deep straw, with a modest head that lasted a while but had gone 3/4 through the beer. You've already talked about the light carbonation, I know.
Aroma: I got malt aromas plus something which I interpreted as yeastiness but may be something else.
Flavour: Basically as it says in the BJCP guidelines: malt flavours (but very little sweetness) dominating, with an underlying spicy interesting-ness coming from the hops. I'm not sure which variety you used, but it tasted clean and a little bit spicy. I'm guessing it's a noble hop like tettnang.
Overall: I suppose I'm not normally a fan of lagers, but this swap is bringing me around. I enjoyed the subtle malt flavours in this brew and the refreshing smooth drinkability of it in general. Why is it called that anyway Kleiny? Are you refering to the feeling when the glass is empty. If so, I understand. Thanks for swapping this.

 

[WarmBeer]

Why is it called that anyway Kleiny? Are you refering to the feeling when the glass is empty. If so, I understand.

Yeah, Kleiny, what's with the name and the Goth chick on the bottle? You're too old, and have too little hair to be an emo

 

[Kleiny]

Why is it called that anyway Kleiny? Are you refering to the feeling when the glass is empty. If so, I understand. Thanks for swapping this.

Yeah, Kleiny, what's with the name and the Goth chick on the bottle? You're too old, and have too little hair to be an emo

Goes and puts on black wig and clothes and thinks of killing himself or just hiding in a dark corner of the house with a pasty white complexion. :lol:

The chick i just found on the net last minute and she looked ok so that was my label, as for the name i thought is was appropriate because i am yet to be fully satisfied with my brewing attempts at this style. Munich helles version 5 to be brewed in time for vicbrew 2010.

Kleiny

 

[Supra-Jim]

Glad you like the beer Manticle, I'm actually yet to taste this (except for the odd hydrometer sample!) Good to hear it is carbed up already, thought it might have taken a little longer.

Anyway, my tasting efforts were not too successful this weekend:

CM2 - Aussie Gold Lager

Really nice appearance with a deep golden colour, tending towards copper. Low carbonation, with a little head that dissipated quickly. Taste was great with really nice mouthfeel. Nice sublte bitterness that hangs around on the tonuge. Only issue was the last mouthful, I got distracted and it wearmed up a bit, and i got a big green apple flavour.

Other than that nice beer CM.

Seemax - Kiwi Pale Ale

Sorry mate, mine was vingear.


Cheers SJ

 

[Kleiny]

#5 Viet Lager 4*

I judeged it just under the light lager section as a general 4*

Aroma: Sweet malt aroma with some background sulphury notes from the lager, Some light fruitness but very light, very clean on the aroma's
9/12

Appearance: Slight haze but golden in color, i thought chill haze but even when a little warmer, Tight white head which dissipates fast into a thin lace which lasts a long time on the edge of the glass.
2/3

Flavour: Sweet malt up front with a dry bitternes finish, slightly astringent but probably still a plus does not seem to detract from the flavour, Balance is a little on the bitter side but still good, you dont need to change the balance, some spiceyness and floral from hops. I did detact a little tartness just at the end.
14/20

Mouthfeel: Light body with an overall coating, the carb is med to high and just right for the lager style, slightly astringent at the finish.
4/5

Overall: A great beer with a session feel, the light body and easy flavour make it drinkable, their are some fruity esters and a good balance, its a little hazy which could be cleared up with a nice color.
7/10

36/50
Very good with only very minor flaws,

This is a great beer 4* just couldnt fit it into the American way of thinking that they make the only light lagers in the world other than germany. But just recently visiting Phucket it brings back memmory's of Tiger and Singha(without the spiceyness)

Kleiny

 

[Kleiny]

might get a couple of swap beers judged today, just finished night shift at the fire house and time for a few beers, kids are asleep, wifes asleep :super:

 

[Fourstar]

This is a great beer 4* just couldnt fit it into the American way of thinking that they make the only light lagers in the world other than germany. But just recently visiting Phucket it brings back memmory's of Tiger and Singha(without the spiceyness)

Yeah i agree, Maple was aksing me what Cat to judge it in, its quite hard as Asian Lagers are not comparable to the US varietys with their nose characteristics. If anything the aussie macro lagers are more suited to those guidelines in the light lager cat.

Thanks for the comments. If only i could do away with that haze listening to the brewstrong podcast on it now. <_<

 

[Kleiny]

Yeah i agree, Maple was aksing me what Cat to judge it in, its quite hard as Asian Lagers are not comparable to the US varietys with their nose characteristics. If anything the aussie macro lagers are more suited to those guidelines in the light lager cat.

Thanks for the comments. If only i could do away with that haze listening to the brewstrong podcast on it now. <_<

yep Charlie Bamforth lays it down in that interview with the BN Crew

 

[Kleiny]

#6 CM2 Aussie Lager

Once again no real style to judge against other than American lagers in the light lager category and i couldnt push an Aus lager into the amber lager category. Im gonna rant soon i can tell about the inadequacy of the BJCP styles and the styles around the world they miss therough pure American arrogance SSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHH get on with the review.

Aroma: Sweet malty aroma with hints of darker malts or cara/crystal, or just caramalisation of wort, There is a slight hop background but fairly fairnt and hard to pick. Light fruity esters and light sulphur. On warming some acetaldhyde.
6/12

Appearance: Hazy with a amber color not really to style even for a Aus lager a bit dark. low head on pour and dissipates quickly to nothing.
1/2

Flavour: its biscuit caramel sweet maltyness, with a little bitterness upfront not really enough to balance. It is thin in the flavour. alot of this can not be attributed to an Aus lager.
12/20

Mouthfeel: Thin consistency with flavor but medium body with a cloying coating of the pallet. Carb is low and could be higher. I found the body weird in that it was watery but cloying.
3/5

Overall: i would not consider this as an example of a Aus lager as it has aroma and flavor with cara/toffee, some acetaldhyde, very mod body with a real watery feel to the flavour. Some sulphury tones. it is malt forward and do with some balance work but maybe without the cara / toffee flavour the bitterness might be right.
6/10

28/50
Good but misses the mark on style and has flaws.

Next is Manticle #10 (it seems like im being a hard marker but that is the way i see them, i hope mants impresses for style)

Kleiny

 

[Fourstar]

Next is Manticle #10 (it seems like im being a hard marker but that is the way i see them, i hope mants impresses for style)

Just checked, 7 point spread between yours and Maples for my result. 43 vs. 36.

 

[brettprevans]

cheers Kleiny for the review. 28/50 aint too bad considering it was the 1st solo AG and 1st AB brew on my rig & with a dodgy temp gague that meant a 6step decoction.

christ im wanting to try a few of these beers. its killing me.

 

[Maple]

Just checked, 7 point spread between yours and Maples for my result. 43 vs. 36.

Also judged against 2 different categories.... Send me another and I'll give 'er a go against light lager

 

[Fourstar]

Also judged against 2 different categories.... Send me another and I'll give 'er a go against light lager

Couldnt you just compare from your notes and give it a score? after all you write down what you can taste, not what you cant, they're just added extras to fill the blank pieces of paper+ get brownie points on the judging sheets!

Unfortuantly i dont have any more.

 

[Kleiny]

Just checked, 7 point spread between yours and Maples for my result. 43 vs. 36.

In a discussion im sure i could be persuaded (with a good argument) a couple of points to close the gap

 

[manticle]

#24: Wonderwoman: Summer Ale

First up I liked the label. I like the effort that went into it too.

Pours with a fluffy head that quickly dissipates but a thin head and lacing remain throughout the glass. Hazy,light gold colour.

Again hops on the nose. Lots of fruit and since the last case swap I had, I'm now more familiar with this hop.

Flavour is very hoppy/fruity - I get passionfruit and lemon and maybe a touch of grapefruit. There is a nice bitterness to this.

However I find the body a bit lacking and the carbonation a little high. I'd really like a nice sherbert tingle sensation to go with the lemon.
Not overly sweet, very little malt. I'm not a fan of loads of carb in anything (beer, soft drink, cider etc) so it may just be me but I reckon the beer could do with a touch more maltiness and slightly less fizz. Nonetheless the lightness and fruitiness together with that good bittering makes a refreshing summer ale which is what you've designed. Too much carb makes me burpy so drinking one after the other in the sun might not suit me but I'm sure it would suit many. Unlike most however I could happily drink several dubbels or stouts in a row whereas many like to chew only one beer in a session so I may not be the target drinking audience. Certainly no fermentation flaws that I can detect.

 

[manticle]

#25: Beerdingo: APA

Golden colour, head dissipates to thin foam but a small amout of lacing remains.

Aroma is mildly hoppy but malt is apparent too.

The flavour is lovely. I have no idea how to style this is but this is very different to the other hoppy apas and ipas I've had so far. There's a real rich malt that reminds me of caramel and what caramelised wort sometimes brings to a beer. I don't know if that's stylistically accurate but I'm a fan. There's a bitter citrus (almost orange) bitterness that goes very well with the malt flavour.

This is not to take away from any of the other pales I've so far had but this and Chris' are probably my favourite of the hoppy pales I've tasted. There are hops present here but really nicely balanced with the malt. I'd happily brew this. Delicious beer BD.

One question to a few of you. Some of you have suggested you have not yet tasted your own beer. This surprises me a little. Do you do the same thing with comps (if you enter them that is)? The way I look at it, I like to know what I'm passing onto someone else so any infection problems, carb problem,s etc. get picked up. I know what my beer tastes like so I don't expect too many surprises when someone tastes it. Obviously there are more expert palates than mine that may pick up faults but I know it's carbed, I know it's not infected and I know it's representative of my brewing (for better or worse). It's the same when I cook - I taste as I go and I taste before I serve. How else do you know if it needs more salt? If I didn't have this attitude you'd all be drinking my cloudy, possibly infected and definitely not right pilsner.

This was my swap cherry popper though so maybe I'm missing something. Definitely curious though.

 

[Maple]

One question to a few of you. Some of you have suggested you have not yet tasted your own beer. This surprises me a little. Do you do the same thing with comps (if you enter them that is)? The way I look at it, I like to know what I'm passing onto someone else so any infection problems, carb problem,s etc. get picked up. I know what my beer tastes like so I don't expect too many surprises when someone tastes it. Obviously there are more expert palates than mine that may pick up faults but I know it's carbed, I know it's not infected and I know it's representative of my brewing (for better or worse). It's the same when I cook - I taste as I go and I taste before I serve. How else do you know if it needs more salt? If I didn't have this attitude you'd all be drinking my cloudy, possibly infected and definitely not right pilsner.

This was my swap cherry popper though so maybe I'm missing something. Definitely curious though.

You're on the money with that Manticle. The swap was my 3rd in line for this swap, first didn't work out (but then it did, long story), second one I didn't get what I wanted out of it, and the third one was a tried and tested one, that I made sure I had at least half a keg before the day to know it was suitable.

 

[Fourstar]

You're on the money with that Manticle. The swap was my 3rd in line for this swap, first didn't work out (but then it did, long story),

What happened to brining along a bottle of that maple?

 

[Brewmeister70]

One of the difficulties of theses swaps in some respects is the output of some brewers is quite low over-all and if something isn't as expected, or turns south late, there is not really the opportunity to make another brew.

Part of the bad turns out to be a good chance for brewers who are less experienced to learn about how to make a better beer through tasting some examples that have issues. This is normal and a good thing IMO.

Sure, it would be awesome if we could all produce a super drop for these swaps and I'm sure that everyone who participates does try their best but there is also the temptation for many of us to try making something out of left field that we hope to be wonderful but have zero previous experience in producing.

It's all part of the fun.

 

[Kleiny]

Manticle

I could not agree more with your statement, not only should you know what you are giving somebody else to taste but you should now what you are entering in a comp. If its bad you still may enter it and hope for feed back on how to rectify a problem. Not just thats infected and cant be judged.

As a brewer we should be tasting the whole way through a brew from the grain to the mash to the wort to fermentation to the final product and during lager or maturation. Then and only then do you get respect for the flavours and were they are produced within the system. This is also important in picking where off flavours are attributed. This process also allows you to make changes on the spot in terms of carb or low/high gravity, attenuation etc.

Kleiny

 

[manticle]

One of the difficulties of theses swaps in some respects is the output of some brewers is quite low over-all and if something isn't as expected, or turns south late, there is not really the opportunity to make another brew.

Part of the bad turns out to be a good chance for brewers who are less experienced to learn about how to make a better beer through tasting some examples that have issues. This is normal and a good thing IMO.

Sure, it would be awesome if we could all produce a super drop for these swaps and I'm sure that everyone who participates does try their best but there is also the temptation for many of us to try making something out of left field that we hope to be wonderful but have zero previous experience in producing.

It's all part of the fun.

Not so much about a perfect or even super drop - god knows if any of mine have turned out super. It's more about knowing what you are putting in by tasting it yourself beforehand.

It's not really a massive criticism - anyone who enters a swap puts themselves and their brewing on the line for all to see and good on them for having a crack. I just personally couldn't contribute something blind (and to be honest one of the best beers I've tasted so far was made by someone who claims not to have tried the finished product). I realise people are limited by time etc (not least of all me). I'm just trying to understand a different mode of thinking.

 

[Maple]

# 10 - Robust Porter Judged against Cat 12B

Aroma: Chocolate, Toffee, Caramel initially - 10 minute interlude (putting the little one to bed as it warms) Rich Toastiness and even a slight hint of coffee in the nose. Amazing how this one gives up all these notes as it warms, very complex aroma. No hops detected in aroma, no phenolics detected either. 10/12

Appearance: Clear deep brown with Crimson tinge in the light. Tight compact head, tan colour, receeding - low retension 2/3

Flavour: Raosty with tannins coming into it. I get the Chocolate/Caramel coming through from the aroma into the taste as well. Nicely balanced - no cloying sweetness to speak of, very well attenuated. Earthy hop profile faint in the taste, but in teh background, and lends the right level of bitterness to this style. No off-flavours detected 16/20

Mouthfeel: Slightly astringent - can be picked up from dark roasted malts and accentuated from high temp sparging. some OK, but something to key in on. This was thinner in body than the aroma had lead me to believe, but still a medium level body. Dryness a nice finish with a low to moderate carb level. 3/5

Overall: some astringency picked up - watch your sparge temps, or perhaps try cold steeping black malt for similar desired effect. This was accentuated by the dryness in the finish, however it was backed-up with a good maltiness. use of hops contributes to the overall good balance of this example, well done. 7/10

Tally 38/50

 

[manticle]

Cheers.

Agree on the body - it needs a bit more. I think I oversparged this one as I slightly miscalculated the water amounts. That may also account for the astringency rather than the temps?

Pity about the head (mentioned in another review of this too) as I think it's an integral part to any english style. The testers I had prior to the swap seemed ok head wise so I'm not sure what's happened but I tried one last night and got the same problem: nice fluff that fizzled away to nothing in no time.

Didn't pick up the tannins but I have a couple of bottles left so I know what to look for when I crack them.

 

[Leigh]

#6 CM2 Aussie Lager

The bottle I got was flat, poured from about 6inches away to get some "froth" that quickly dissipated (sp?). Was more of an amber than a pale lager IMO. Slight malt on the nose, onto the tongue the beer was quite warm with strong bitterness and barely any maltiness. I like a little less bitterness in my lagers, with a little more malt. As the glass warmed, the warmness turned "solventy" which detracted from the beer.

Wasn't what I was expecting, would probably taste a lot better with a higher level of carbonation (I expect this to be right at the next swap Brett )

Manticle, I just ran out of time, but the only taste I haven't had is carbonated/matured. Have tasted at bottling, yeast pitching etc so I know what it will be like. The beauty of plastic bottles is I know the carbonation was right when I boxed them as all the bottles were nice and firm, but not overly hard.

 

[brettprevans]

I agree that the swaps should be trying to showcase your best brews or maybe experiments/styles that others may not try themselves. Following that logic you should be testing your beer to make sure its good enough for the swap (ie at the top of your brewing capability, not compared to others brewing capability).

For example. I was testing my case swap to make sure it was ok. it tasted great out of the first keg. it doesnt seem to have made the transition well to bottle or from the 2nd keg. Now that's an issue for me to rectify but i at least know my beer was good enough to swap prior to bottling because i was testing it (PS im not kegging then bottling anymore as it doesnt keep the carbonation levels, you can all put up with sediment in your bottles from now on).

that being said im thinking im having another crack at this for next summer's swap and change the hop schedule as it seems to be throwing people and its certainly not to a bjcp style. but then again i was definitely not brewing to style. i was trying to push the boundaries with rice, nugget and POR flavouring/aroma.


edit: on a completely differant but slightly related topic. whilst cleaning out the chesty i tried my blended munich/english ale/RIS last night that i was going to bring to the swap (just 30ml worth). bloody nice. indeed not a session beer, but nice. might bring a couple bottles to next fornight's bjcp stout session.

 

[brendo]

edit: on a completely differant but slightly related topic. whilst cleaning out the chesty i tried my blended munich/english ale/RIS last night that i was going to bring to the swap (just 30ml worth). bloody nice. indeed not a session beer, but nice. might bring a couple bottles to next fornight's bjcp stout session.

BJCP is tonight mate... 1/12 - Stouts and Porters... bring it on...