Twang..

[FDR]

Hi all, i've read a lot about twang and how to avoid it. I eventually reached the point where i'd given up on extracts and went for a BIAB batch using a temp regulator hooked up to an old fridge. This batch i did make a couple mistakes by not sparging, and tipping the trub into the fermenter instead of siphoning off. This brew smelled great and i was looking forward to finally brewing something that tasted like beer rather then twangy home brew... to my dismay, the twang was clearly there even though the nose was still very nice.

I've done many many extract brews to date, trying everything and varying the source when purchasing the extract. Tried liquid, dry, kits..

The only thing that hasnt changed is that i use carb drops to prime. The frustrating thing though is everything i read tells me i should be able to brew a semi reasonable beer with nothing other then extracts and a decent yeast (i've tried various yeasts).

I've got a mate who says he had a session at some blokes house drinking cheap extract beer, however the guy keg'd it. He said it tasted as good as any beer he can get at the pub, so i'm heading down the path of kegging.. does anyone have a similar story or experience with the twang monster?


Cheers

 

[manticle]

How are you controlling temperature? Can you describe the flavour with descriptors other than 'twang"?

How are you cleaning and sanitising?

How are you conditioning the beer?

Most common off flavour I encounter in kit brews is acetaldehyde. You can get this flavour in any beer regardless of the method used to make it. You can also avoid it or get rid of it. Would you describe it as any of the following:

Granny smith skin or stem?
Synthetic paint emulsion?
Pumpkin skin?

 

[FDR]

Previous batches i kept the fermenter inside in a cupboard or similar. More recently i've regulated the temp at around 21 using an electronic regulator which turns the fridge off and on. I'm pretty confident i've ruled out temperature as a factor.

Sanitising has been with product purchased from the brew shop, i'd have to check the actual product but i feel that everything is clean and that the flavour isn't that of an off/infected batch..

It's just a crappy taste basically.. it doesnt stop you from drinking the beer, just stops you from enjoying it, expecially after you have one or two glasses. The kind of thing that prevents you from being proud of what you've brewed because it tastes like shitty home brew.

Granny smith skin or stem?
Synthetic paint emulsion?
Pumpkin skin?

Hmm perhaps pumpkin skin comes close.. It's also a lack of flavour which you notice as well. Perhaps its something as basic as trying to add too much water to my brews? Diliting the beer flavour and leaving the "home brew" flavour. I've been using the bunnings 25ltr tubs, and guestimating a 23ltr fill.

 

[manticle]

Need more than crappy and twang to help work out what it is.

Off flavours and infections can have many causes and many different flavours.

Does it taste like butter, buttered popcorn or butterscotch?
Does it taste like medicine, band-aids, dettol?
Does it taste like floor cleaner, solvents, strong, rough alcohol?
Does it taste like crushed roses?
Does it taste like banana?
Does it taste like red apple?
Does it taste like cat piss, skunk odour?
Does it taste like a sewer?
Does it taste like baby vomit, off cheddar, toe jam?
Does it taste like metal, iron, rust, blood?
Does it taste vegetal, grassy?
Does it taste like cooked corn, cooked cabbage, tomato sauce?
Does it taste like dust, paper, cardboard?

Is it flat in the mouth, sweet, slick or sickly, sharp or sour? Is it tannic (bitter and drying at the front and sides of the tongue like sucking a teabag)?

Or any the descriptors I mentioned earlier?

Where are you based? Maybe someone can taste it for you and offer a solution.

Taste it with the above descriptors in front of you and see if any come close.

 

[Diesel80]

I reckon we also need the receipe.
I have done a couple of BIAB that tasted very sharp in the first week or two after gassing in the keg.
This faded and they were delicious. I was just drinking them too soon.

I have also had a one that was sharp and had a harsh bitterness. In this batch I used a high alpha hop and forgot to tick the no chill box in the brew software. That was undrinkable early, and then became only slightly better later on. This was brewer error and not attributable to BIAB process itself.

OP How long have you conditioned the beer for, and what were the target IBUs?

Cheers,
D80

 

[FDR]

I reckon we also need the receipe.

Sorry this was a while ago now, and have since moved home so i'm about to start trying again but don't really have the info it sounds like you need. I've still got bottles which made the trip to our new house so i'll stick a couple in the fridge and see what they're like.

Slightly soapy i think probably comes closest to describing it.

 

[manticle]

If it's pumpkin skin then I'd suggest you are probably pulling the beer of the yeast too early or you are not pitching enough healthy yeast.

Make sure the yeast is really fresh and give the beer 2-3 extra days at fermentation temperature once it has reached its final gravity. The flavour will dissipate with time evn in a keg or bottle if there is still a bit of yeast in suspension.

If it is acetaldehyde as I suspect it is - it is a naturally occurring chemical that yeast produces during fermentation. Essentially it is created as a precursor to ethanol and if given the chance, yeast will convert it to ethanol. If not, that sharp apple/pumpkin/paint flavour remains in the beer and masks most other things, depending on the level.

Soapy can either be soap (be good to know what product you are using and how you are using it) or breakdown of fatty acids.

 

[MastersBrewery]

To add a note here I see you have temp controlled a fridge for fermentation, if you are measuring the air temp inside the fridge your wort temp will be at least a few degrees higher, and definitely agree with above, leave it sit for a while at terminal gravity, and possibly raise a few degrees for d rest for a few more days. Also minor infections can cause off flavors so ensure you dismantle taps and clean threads of fermenters.

 

[FDR]

Ok great, i think i'll try another extract with the carb drops (feel like i've failed if i can't get it right before mucking around with grains). I should say i haven't been as thourough with gravity readings as i probably should, and instead just been fermenting for 3 weeks and assuming it's done. Perhaps i've have a few brews which weren't finished converting acetaldehyde to alcohol..

 

[Glengine]

I would rule the carb drops out as the problem as I bottle using them and have had a mix of great and average brews. I've had some odd flavours before but never had what I'd consider the infamous 'home brew twang'.

 

[citizensnips]

I'd take into consideration your water too. Don't expect it to taste like cub pub beer if ones brewed using Melbourne water and the other Adelaide, not saying your waters to blame but maybe take it into consideration.

 

[Spiesy]

Ok great, i think i'll try another extract with the carb drops (feel like i've failed if i can't get it right before mucking around with grains). I should say i haven't been as thourough with gravity readings as i probably should, and instead just been fermenting for 3 weeks and assuming it's done. Perhaps i've have a few brews which weren't finished converting acetaldehyde to alcohol..

If you're not taking gravity readings correctly, and there's no heater inside your fermentation fridge - during a S.A. winter, there's a good chance your fermenting ale is dropping below adequate fermentation temperature, and possibly not completing fermentation - and subsequently not cleaning up the nasties (i.e. acetaldyhyde, diacteyl, etc).

 

[Spiesy]

If possible; use a clean, neutral ale yeast like US05 or BRY-97; and control fermentation at 18-degrees, with a variance of 0.5 degrees (or thereabouts).

Also, you'll get a more accurate temperature reading with a thermowell, placing the thermometer probe right into the wort/beer - or at the very least, taping the probe to the outside of the fermenter, just under half way up and insulating the probe from the ambient air.

 

[stakka82]

I would start by using starsan or similar to take the sanitation variable out of the mix.