Style Of The Week 11/10/06 - Saison

[Tony]

putting this one in today. Will split the 34 liters between 2 x 17L cubes and ferment with different yeasts.

Ideas are based around some questions i got about using Melanoiden and Chinook in my BH Saison beer. I dodnt like the idea of the more extreme flavoured ingredients in what should be a subtle easy drinking beer.

So i have gone with a Saison that is Vienna malt driven, and using B Saaz (Oh how i love this hop) for its sticy peppery character.

Vienna Saison

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (L): 34.00 Wort Size (L): 34.00
Total Grain (kg): 6.00
Anticipated OG: 1.042 Plato: 10.47
Anticipated EBC: 7.7
Anticipated IBU: 26.6
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
50.0 3.00 kg. Weyermann Vienna Germany 1.038 7
33.3 2.00 kg. Weyermann FM Boh Pilsner Germany 1.038 4
16.7 1.00 kg. JWM Wheat Malt Australia 1.038 4

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
30.00 g. B-Saaz Whole 8.10 17.0 40 min.
30.00 g. B-Saaz Whole 8.10 9.6 15 min.
30.00 g. B-Saaz Whole 8.10 0.0 0 min (cube hopped 15g per cube).


Yeast
-----

Farmhouse ale and French Saison

 

[Tony]

2 batches pitched on 3711 and 3726.

Ooooo cant wait.

I used to hate summer brewing........ not any more, the hotter the better!

 

[Muscovy_333]

putting this one in today. Will split the 34 liters between 2 x 17L cubes and ferment with different yeasts.

Ideas are based around some questions i got about using Melanoiden and Chinook in my BH Saison beer. I dodnt like the idea of the more extreme flavoured ingredients in what should be a subtle easy drinking beer.

So i have gone with a Saison that is Vienna malt driven, and using B Saaz (Oh how i love this hop) for its sticy peppery character.

Vienna Saison

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------


Batch Size (L): 34.00 Wort Size (L): 34.00
Total Grain (kg): 6.00
Anticipated OG: 1.042 Plato: 10.47
Anticipated EBC: 7.7
Anticipated IBU: 26.6
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 60 Minutes


Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential EBC
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
50.0 3.00 kg. Weyermann Vienna Germany 1.038 7
33.3 2.00 kg. Weyermann FM Boh Pilsner Germany 1.038 4
16.7 1.00 kg. JWM Wheat Malt Australia 1.038 4

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.


Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
30.00 g. B-Saaz Whole 8.10 17.0 40 min.
30.00 g. B-Saaz Whole 8.10 9.6 15 min.
30.00 g. B-Saaz Whole 8.10 0.0 0 min (cube hopped 15g per cube).


Yeast
-----

Farmhouse ale and French Saison

And i'm going to rip off your grist and lay one down with 3724.....Love Vienna

 

[Tony]

mate.... it smelt and looked great into the fermenter!

Any Pils will do.... i was just using up old grain with the Boh Pils..... but you gotta love boh pils right

 

[beers]

2 batches pitched on 3711 and 3726.

Have you used 3726 before Tony?
I'm drinking my first attempt at using it. Farmhouse Ales state that Brasserie Blaugies ferment it cool, for a saison yeast anyway, at 25-27c. Mine got upto 24c & esters are on the subdued side. Has a nice profile though.

That's a lot of Vienna, I'd be interested hearing how it goes.

 

[Muscovy_333]

mate.... it smelt and looked great into the fermenter!

Any Pils will do.... i was just using up old grain with the Boh Pils..... but you gotta love boh pils right

I have some Boh Pils left over...bonus.
Im going to trial my first decoction on this grist, i hear the Boh Pils is better for it.

Hopping with my French Strisselspalt again, it is soo spicy on the nose!
If it works out i might take it to the BAR brewers et al swap in April at vic 45's place

 

[Tony]

Have you used 3726 before Tony?
I'm drinking my first attempt at using it. Farmhouse Ales state that Brasserie Blaugies ferment it cool, for a saison yeast anyway, at 25-27c. Mine got upto 24c & esters are on the subdued side. Has a nice profile though.

That's a lot of Vienna, I'd be interested hearing how it goes.

havnt used it before but my garage is sitting at about 28 deg so should be fine. Well i have used it but the Hibiscus ale i made with hit is chilling waiting tor me to have time to filter it....... probably firday!

Lots of vienna...... Meh..... its a base malt.

 

[felon]

Im five days into fermenting a Bullshead Summer Saison with 3726. It's been sitting very stable around 30 deg. Should be interesting. Very tasty out of the hydro. :icon_drool2:

 

[Tony]

be sure to post your results in the BHSS thread mate..... that recipe sure is proving to be a hit with the punters

Its just too damn easy to make and drink in the summer hey!

And people without temp control pump your fists to the air........ SAISON IS HERE TO HELP!

 

[humulus]

be sure to post your results in the BHSS thread mate..... that recipe sure is proving to be a hit with the punters

Its just too damn easy to make and drink in the summer hey!

And people without temp control pump your fists to the air........ SAISON IS HERE TO HELP!

Let's hound wyeast to make farmhouse a regular yeast!!!!! Just pitched farmhouse into another bulls head saison!!! Love that beer and that yeast!

 

[felon]

Will do Tony. Thanks for a great recipe and thanks humulus for the yeast. :icon_chickcheers:

 

[Charst]

Just wondering thoughts on the attached recipe. I got some tins of goo for christmas so I'm using a coopers international lager can with 17 IBU in can (galaxy hop addition).

Can of Coopers Wheat is other addition and fermenting with yeast harvested from the new local Saison La Sirene

The saaz are quite low AA% but it looks a little over hopped to me, but I've never used saaz so..

 

[Mikedub]

love Saaz, and it would would complement the spiciness of a Saison yeast but I'd agree with you Charst, there is not a lot of breathing space for the yeast profile to come through with that hopping schedule, I've in the past gone for 60, 20, and 5 minute additions,

 

[Charst]

love Saaz, and it would would complement the spiciness of a Saison yeast but I'd agree with you Charst, there is not a lot of breathing space for the yeast profile to come through with that hopping schedule, I've in the past gone for 60, 20, and 5 minute additions,

just hoping to get a bit of hop complexity if thats the right word. I've made a few beers with additions as you mentioned and find the smell and be great but lack in in flavour or gaps in the taste between if you get me.

so i thought id split the additions over a range of minutes. any thoughts on the overall quantity of hop addition? it APA like in amount but its only 3.0% AA

 

[Mikedub]

Im five days into fermenting a Bullshead Summer Saison with 3726. It's been sitting very stable around 30 deg. Should be interesting. Very tasty out of the hydro. :icon_drool2:

I'm a fan of the Wlp565 (3724) I often read posts bitchen it stalls 2/3s the way through fermenting, I pitched last Sat night at 1.052, its been around 28 - 32 degrees since, this morning it was 1.006, not a fusel in sight, now that's bitchn

 

[Mikedub]

just hoping to get a bit of hop complexity if thats the right word. I've made a few beers with additions as you mentioned and find the smell and be great but lack in in flavour or gaps in the taste between if you get me.

so i thought id split the additions over a range of minutes. any thoughts on the overall quantity of hop addition? it APA like in amount but its only 3.0% AA

I imagine your listed schedule - nearly 100g evenly spread in a 23l batch would seem to have you covered , although low AA, Saaz is not low in flavour IMO

 

[manticle]

just hoping to get a bit of hop complexity if thats the right word. I've made a few beers with additions as you mentioned and find the smell and be great but lack in in flavour or gaps in the taste between if you get me.

so i thought id split the additions over a range of minutes. any thoughts on the overall quantity of hop addition? it APA like in amount but its only 3.0% AA

I'm a fan of what you're suggesting with beers that totally rely on hops like apas and ipas. Not sure about it for this though. I'd be more inclined to shoot for two nobles or similar that complement each other - something like hallertauer mittelfreh and saaz, tettnanger and saaz or spalt and saaz (or any combo of the above). Stryrians might also work. A hoppy saison is a different kettle of fish to a hoppy US pale ale.

However, having never hop bursted with nobles myself, I can't tell you definitively that it won't work. If it doesn't will you be devestated? Could use this free kit for a trial to see for yourself.

 

[Lecterfan]

DISCLAIMER: my experience(s) so far have only been with wy3711. I have tasted reasonably hoppy beers brewed by others with this yeast and after full and decent (1.006 - 4ish) attenuation there is f/a flavour but the yeast (and that includes a popular APA recipe from AHB done with wy3711 for a giggle - bloody nice beer, but just tastes like a saison).

I've brewed with this yeast four times myself now (they are all young and most of my comments now are based on tasting from secondary) and the only one I got any hops from was one with 50gms styrian at flameout.

My concern would be that you are using two cans of extract so what will be the attenuation/FG? If the yeast works warm enough and attenuates out - AND if wy3711 is anything to go on - you will still get plenty of yeast flavour. All up three very big "ifs" based only on my anecdotal experience...

 

[Charst]

I'm a fan of what you're suggesting with beers that totally rely on hops like apas and ipas. Not sure about it for this though. I'd be more inclined to shoot for two nobles or similar that complement each other - something like hallertauer mittelfreh and saaz, tettnanger and saaz or spalt and saaz (or any combo of the above). Stryrians might also work. A hoppy saison is a different kettle of fish to a hoppy US pale ale.

However, having never hop bursted with nobles myself, I can't tell you definitively that it won't work. If it doesn't will you be devestated? Could use this free kit for a trial to see for yourself.

Definitely won't be devastated but may knock back the quantities a touch, keeping the amount of additions though.
Have some hallertauer so may go a mix.

La Sirene yeast taste very bananary tasting the settled starter. only being built up at 20 degrees so i hope the other fruit comes through when fermented in the batch at higher temps.

 

[sponge]

Looking at pumping a Saison out on the w/e

Any feedback on the following recipe?

45% pils
20% munich
20% vienna
15% wheat

2g/L Saaz (or EKG) @ 20min
2g/L Hallertau (or styrians) @ F.O

1.040-45
30IBU
3711 @ 22-23'C

Still not sure whether to go Saaz & Hallertau, or EKG and styrians

Any preferences from the saison brewers out there?




Sponge