Recipedb - Coopers Pale Ale Clone

[AndrewQLD]

:chug: Absolutely loving this one at the moment, and won't be happy when the keg blows froth.
A few inebriated thoughts...
* Dropping the sugar was a big plus IMHO - mashing low and pitching big gets the FG down low.
* Only thing I'll probably change next time is to ferment even lower (perhaps 16-17deg) to get less banana.
* The Powels pils has really worked well - beautiful malt backbone (I guess it must be cheap because of its modification)

Andrew, Fester and Taz - let us know how yours all turn out .

I think the Powells Ale malt would be well suited to this recipe, it does have a fantastic malt presence that would work well. I wish I could get Powells up here again it's great malt.
I haven't picked up Banana when fermenting with this yeast at 18, what temp did you ferment at?

Andrew

 

[Batz]

I'm drinking this one ATM,with the sugar addition,very nice indeed.

Batz

 

[Adamt]

I'm drinking this one ATM,with the sugar addition,very nice indeed.

Batz

Nothing beats a morning pint.. See signature! :chug:

 

[Hutch]

I think the Powells Ale malt would be well suited to this recipe, it does have a fantastic malt presence that would work well. I wish I could get Powells up here again it's great malt.
I haven't picked up Banana when fermenting with this yeast at 18, what temp did you ferment at?

Andrew

I had the fridgemate set at 18 deg, which usually means it hovers around 19, (possibly higher being such a vigorous fermentation).
Not saying there's too much banana - I quite like it when you get it on tap sometimes. The bottled variety does seem to err a lot more towards bread than banana though.

 

[AndrewQLD]

Here's the latest version of my CPA without the sugar component, I've also adjusted my mash water with salt additions based on my local Bundaberg water report.
My aim is to get the FG down as low as I can, hopefully 1.004 - 1.006, I'm still sticking to the white board grain bill but I have upped the dark crystal malt addition to by 20g to 50g to get closer to the originals color.
Changed the mash schedule as well to get a little better attenuation I hope.

I've got a 1 lt Coopers Pale Ale starter bubbling away as I type that smells great and I'm wondering if I dare squeeze in a brewday on saturday before going away for our anniversary
What's my chances :lol:

View attachment 25697

Style: Australian Pale Ale
Recipe: Coopers Clone Pale Ale TYPE: All Grain
---RECIPE SPECIFICATIONS-----------------------------------------------
Est SRM: 8.9 EBC SRM RANGE: 7.9-13.8 EBC
Est IBU: 26.6 IBU IBU RANGE: 25.0-40.0 IBU
Est OG: 1.043 SG OG RANGE: 1.035-1.048 SG
Est FG: 1.006 SG FG RANGE: 1.004-1.006 SG
Est BU:GU: 0.623 Calories: 393 cal/l Est ABV: 4.8 %
EE%: 80.00 % Batch: 23.00 L Boil: 28.19 L BT: 60 Mins
Amount Item Type % or IBU
1 Pkgs Coopers pale Ale Cultured [Starter 1000 mlYeast-Ale

---WATER CHEMISTRY ADDITIONS----------------
2g Calcium Chloride
2g Epsom Salts
3g gypsum.

-------Ingredients for Mashing--------
Amount Item Type % or IBU
3.75 kg Pale Malt, Ale (Barrett Burston) (4.0 EBC)Grain 93.75 %
0.20 kg Wheat Malt (Barrett Burston) (2.4 EBC) Grain 5.00 %
0.05 kg Crystal Dark Bairds (240.0 EBC) Grain 1.25 %

Total Grain Weight: 4.00 kg Total Hops: 28.00 oz.
---MASH PROCESS-----------------------------
Pilsner Mash
Step Time Name Description Step Temp
5 min Mash In Add 16.00 L of water at 36.8 C 35.0 C
15 min Protien Rest Heat to 52.0 C over 10 min 52.0 C
45 min Sacch Rest Heat to 63.0 C over 10 min 63.0 C
30 min Sach Rest Heat to 72.0 C over 10 min 72.0 C
10 min Mash Out Heat to 78.0 C over 10 min 78.0 C

---SPARGE PROCESS-----RECYCLE FIRST RUNNINGS !!
Drain Mash Tun
Batch Sparge Round 1: Sparge with 17.20 L of 78.0 C water

---BOIL PROCESS-----------------------------
Est Pre_Boil Gravity: 1.035 Est OG: 1.043 SG
Boil Ingredients
Boil Amount Item Type
60 min 28.00 gm Pride of Ringwood [8.30 %] (60 min) Hops
10 min 1.00 items Whirlfloc Tablet (Boil 10.0 min) Misc
10 min 1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 10.0 min) Misc

Well it's done and dusted, fermented down to 1.006 although I had my doubts it would get there, fermentation was at 18 and like a volcano for the first 3 days then dropped back to a more sedate pace for the next 5 days. Tastes great out of secondary with a nice bready yeasty taste and a good dry finish.
I'll be kegging tonight and will give a report back in a couple of days.

Andrew

 

[KHB]

Well it's done and dusted, fermented down to 1.006 although I had my doubts it would get there, fermentation was at 18 and like a volcano for the first 3 days then dropped back to a more sedate pace for the next 5 days. Tastes great out of secondary with a nice bready yeasty taste and a good dry finish.
I'll be kegging tonight and will give a report back in a couple of days.

Andrew

Be good to hear how it finished, i am looking to make another one of these soon too.

KHB

 

[AndrewQLD]

Enjoyed this beer over the Easter break with my son, and it is very true to the original. Sadly the keg only lasted 2 days between three of us.
I will be cutting the crystal back to 30g (knew I shouldn't have changed it) as the colour was a little darker than the original, and that's the only fault I could pick.
Glad it fermented down to 1.006 as well, any higher and the malt would have been prominant.

All in all I am very happy with the all malt clone and will be sticking with the recipe in post #57, It's a little more complex to brew than the one with sugar but it's so close to CPA it's worth the effort.
I've also replaced the beersmith file and edited the recipe to reflect my results.
Here's the new Beersmith file as well.

View attachment Coopers_All_Grain.bsm

Andrew

 

[gibbocore]

Hi All,

Quick question for andrew or anyone else, with the mineral additions, if i already add 5.2 stabiliser, do i still need to add the others to the mash? I take it this is to aid in attenuation?

And also, where would i buy calcium chloride and gypsum?

 

[AndrewQLD]

Hi All,

Quick question for andrew or anyone else, with the mineral additions, if i already add 5.2 stabiliser, do i still need to add the others to the mash? I take it this is to aid in attenuation?

And also, where would i buy calcium chloride and gypsum?

Craftbrewer sells the salts, as should most HB shops. From my understanding 5.2 is for PH adjustment and if your adding salts to the mash you probably won't need it, but that depends on what your adding.
The salt additions I have used are based on my local water chemistry and were calculated using John Palmers Residual Alkalinity spreadsheet, these additions get my mash within acceptable PH levels as well as giving the beer a more rounded, not too malty or too bitter profile.

You can download the spreadsheet from here, enter your local water profile and then adjust the salt contributions to get the desired results.

Of course you can still brew this beer without the salt additions with good results, and if you do you will need to use your 5.2 for your PH adjustment.

Andrew

 

[gibbocore]

Cheers for the quick reply mate. I'll just run the 5.2 stabiliser i think as sydney water is pretty rounded as it is. Will be doing the steps as a decoction, so a long day is in stall for me. (will be keeping the grain boiling to a minimum as to keep the colour)

 

[AndrewQLD]

Have fun, and can you let me know the results and thoughts when your finally drinking the beer?

Andrew

 

[gibbocore]

Will do, cheers.

 

[Bribie G]

Hi All,

Quick question for andrew or anyone else, with the mineral additions, if i already add 5.2 stabiliser, do i still need to add the others to the mash? I take it this is to aid in attenuation?

And also, where would i buy calcium chloride and gypsum?

I use 5.2 and put in a bit of epsom salts for the magnesium and a bit of Calcium Chloride just in case if I am making a pale ale. Ross sells all the brewing salts for about $3,50 a pop... probably enough to last you a couple of years.

 

[gibbocore]

i have this on tap now, and all i can say is WOW, so damned close to the origional.

Well done Andrew, i didn't quite get the attenuation, only got to 1010, but this in the end allowed for a heap of malt aroma, what a great underrated yeast, i'm going to use the slurry to make a stout.

Also a tip for anyone attempting this, the harshness of POR is essential for the coopers taste, i used super alpha, thinking its only bittering so what difference could it possibly make, well its almost a bit too clean.

Also, leave heaps of headspace cause this yeast is a bit of a houdini.

Anyone got a good coopers stout recipe?

 

[AndrewQLD]

Thanks gibbocore I'm glad you enjoyed it.
I haven't got a Coopers Stout recipe but I have a Coopers Dark Ale recipe that I'm drinking now and is really nice, smooth with a hint of Chocolate and toast. And your right the yeast is great in the Darker Ales.

View attachment CDA.bsm
if you don't use BeerSmith let me know.

Cheers
Andrew

 

[Hutch]

Also a tip for anyone attempting this, the harshness of POR is essential for the coopers taste, i used super alpha, thinking its only bittering so what difference could it possibly make, well its almost a bit too clean.

Also, leave heaps of headspace cause this yeast is a bit of a houdini.

Very good advice there.

I made this recently with Super-pride instead of POR flowers (not available ATM), and it is slightly lacking something, (though still a good quaffer). Only needed 16gms Super Pride at 60minutes, so no real surprises that the hops are undetectable.

I'd have to say though, that when I made this recipe with Northdown instead of POR, it was an absolute ripper of a beer. Never would have thought that an English hop would work so well, with a fantastic flavour that complements the bready/fruity coopers character.
Then again, POR is from English bloodlines originally!

 

[Kai]

Hi All,

Quick question for andrew or anyone else, with the mineral additions, if i already add 5.2 stabiliser, do i still need to add the others to the mash? I take it this is to aid in attenuation?

Adding salts will also affect the flavour profile of the beer. I think most particularly is how the different salts affect the perception of bitterness. Of course, as mentioned, your salt additions come down to the initial composition of your water..

 

[drsmurto]

I've posted this question before but have never had a satisfactory answer (or at least one that agrees with me :lol: )

What would the result be if i followed this recipe but used wyeast 3522 instead?

A BPA made with POR.....

Its been in my head for a while - CPA doesnt really seem like an english pale ale despite Thomas Coopers origins. I find it has a spiciness to it that presumably comes from a combination of the POR and the yeast. A BPA yeast such as 3522 lists spiciness as one fo the products. 3522 is also a high attenuator and a great floccer. CPA is also a good session beer.

Thoughts?

Making Rooks BPA recipe this weekend but want to use the yeast cake for something else......

 

[AndrewQLD]

To be honest DrSmurto, I think you would be very disappointed, the main flavour contributer to CPA is the yeast. I've tried this with several other yeasts and they produce a bland lifeless beer lacking in any real flavour. Given that the grain bill is quite plain and the hop contributions are so low and only bittering you need a yeast with a lot of character to get something tasty and the CPA strain has a lot more than most.

Probably not the answer you wanted though

Andrew

 

[kabooby]

I think you should give it a go. I recently fermented a German pils with a Saison yeast and it was great. I have used WLP550 before and it is a good yeast. Mrmalty says its the same as 3522.

There is only one answer to your question and that is to do it yourself and see.

Kabooby