KegLand Questions and Answers

[elmoMakesBeer]

@KegLand-com-au have you thought to create a narrow beer/wine theif that will fit through the soft-drink cap openings on your fermenter lids? It would be handy to be able to take a sample without needing to remove the entire fermenter lid and the wine theif you sell is a little too wide to fit. Obviously the volume that can be thieved each go will be less, but you only need a few drops for reflectometer and you can have a few grabs at it if you need more for a hydrometer/taste sample.

 

[RRising]

We still have a bit more optimisation work to do on the RAPT Pill. My best guess is that this should be finished by about May/June this year.

Cool, how's the app (i assume there is one for your RAPT platform) coming along?

Please do not cheap out on app development, its literally you get what you pay for, it's all good having a plan of a highly connected IoT brewery and the hardware to back it up but if the app doesn't work then it's all for naught. You see it heaps of times with IoT products where the app was contracted out to the cheapest dev and the product is unusable.

 

[cb341982]

If you really want to get very consistent results it's hard to hone in the recipe with town water as it varies through the year and the report gives such wide range of values it's not useful. Yes you can probably make good beer but without it with some variation from batch to batch. If you really want to make highly consistent beer RO is really the best option. If any of you guys just find water chemistry too complicated then simply use Brewfather. This software makes it really easy and Nathan did a great video on this here. We do give free RO water away at our Distribution Centre at (410 Princes Hwy, Noble Park North) so if you live in the area bring your tanks or whatever and fill them up for free.

Now with your question about putting some type of flow stopper/float switch or something like that to block the output this is not a good idea. When the output of the RO water system is blocked water will continue to flow and get diverted into the drain so this would be a waste of water. You could use the fill-o-meter on the input side of the RO Water System however you must remember this would measure total water into the filter including the waste water not volume of good RO water collected. This would however be much better than nothing and still be really useful.

If you wanted to go one step further than this then I would recommend getting an inexpensive float switch that looks like this:
View attachment 120015

Then use a power supply and one of these inexpensive solenoid valves and then install using this inexpensive 1/4 water tubing. So put the float switch into the bucket/brewery or vessel you want to fill the use the solenoid valve to turn off the water supply into the RO water system. This will be the most efficient and reliable way to solve the problem but you will need to do some basic wiring yourself.

I should also mention that if you have back pressure into the vessel you are filling up (such as going into a Fermzilla) this will also effect the efficiency of the RO membrane so it's also not a good idea. It's really best to come out of the RO vessel and straight into a bucket or unpressurised container or into the brewery directly. Higher pressure differential into and out of the RO filter will give you better efficiency, faster flow, and reduce waste water.

Thanks for the detailed response! Will the fill-o-meter work? Don't they need a certain amount of throughput to be accurate?

 

[bobsledboy]

@KegLand-com-au Any plans to start selling either Nitric acid or an equivalent to Five Star B.S. Remover? I find phosphoric/nitric mixed solution to work really well but it's a pain to get the nitric acid.

 

[DJR]

@KegLand-com-au Any plans to start selling either Nitric acid or an equivalent to Five Star B.S. Remover? I find phosphoric/nitric mixed solution to work really well but it's a pain to get the nitric acid.

Have you tried barkeepers' friend? I just found they sell it at the supermarket and does a great job on stainless, bit more elbow grease than the BS remover though

 

[elmoMakesBeer]

@KegLand-com-au have you thought to create a narrow beer/wine theif that will fit through the soft-drink cap openings on your fermenter lids? It would be handy to be able to take a sample without needing to remove the entire fermenter lid and the wine theif you sell is a little too wide to fit. Obviously the volume that can be thieved each go will be less, but you only need a few drops for reflectometer and you can have a few grabs at it if you need more for a hydrometer/taste sample.

Perhaps no need - I used my bottling wand "straw" as a pipette.

 

[bobsledboy]

Have you tried barkeepers' friend? I just found they sell it at the supermarket and does a great job on stainless, bit more elbow grease than the BS remover though

Yeah I rate barkeepers friend but I have a real problem with beer stone/calcium build up on my yeast starter flasks.

 

[Vic]

Try straight StarSan or Phosphoric acid. Gets rid of beer stone.

 

[KegLand-com-au]

@KegLand-com-au couple of quick ones.

What does RAPT stand for?

And in relation to your supply of ro water, what do you do with the waste water from the filtering process?

We have been having some conflict in the office about what RAPT actually stands for. As a result we have not publicly said what it stands for yet. Once we are in agreeance in the office we will make this public.

With RO water just us it on the garden.

 

[KegLand-com-au]

Yeah I rate barkeepers friend but I have a real problem with beer stone/calcium build up on my yeast starter flasks.

Generally for calcium build up one of the acids are a good idea. Phosphoric and Lactic will probably be quite effective. Where do you live? Is your water quite hard?

 

[KegLand-com-au]

@KegLand-com-au have you thought to create a narrow beer/wine theif that will fit through the soft-drink cap openings on your fermenter lids? It would be handy to be able to take a sample without needing to remove the entire fermenter lid and the wine theif you sell is a little too wide to fit. Obviously the volume that can be thieved each go will be less, but you only need a few drops for reflectometer and you can have a few grabs at it if you need more for a hydrometer/taste sample.

I must say I really prefer to just pressurise the fermenter with CO2 then draw out the dip tube. I really feel that this is the best practice. Which Fermzilla are you using?

I should also say that once the fermentation has started I would not recommend using the refractometer. I only use the refractometer on the brew day (prior to fermentation). Once alcohol is present it's just easier to use the hydrometer. As you would know once alcohol is present you end up introducing another variable and thus have to put the refractometer readings through a conversion table or some type of software to correct for this error. So best just to use the hydrometer. Definitely once the RAPT pill is available this is an even better solution.

 

[bobsledboy]

Generally for calcium build up one of the acids are a good idea. Phosphoric and Lactic will probably be quite effective. Where do you live? Is your water quite hard?

Yeah I'm in Perth so the water is quite hard ~110ppm as CaCO3. I have tried undiluted vinegar as a substitute for BS remover to no effect. Will give the lactic a go.

 

[elmoMakesBeer]

I must say I really prefer to just pressurise the fermenter with CO2 then draw out the dip tube. I really feel that this is the best practice. Which Fermzilla are you using?

I should also say that once the fermentation has started I would not recommend using the refractometer. I only use the refractometer on the brew day (prior to fermentation). Once alcohol is present it's just easier to use the hydrometer. As you would know once alcohol is present you end up introducing another variable and thus have to put the refractometer readings through a conversion table or some type of software to correct for this error. So best just to use the hydrometer. Definitely once the RAPT pill is available this is an even better solution.

I’m using the flat-bottom fermenter and not looking to start pressure-fermenting. No strong objection to pressure-fermenting but it seems unnecessary for me at the moment. I’ve been taking frequent refractometer readings (alcohol corrected using my own spreadsheet) and infrequent hydrometer samples to verify. So far within 1 gravity point when they’re compared, which suggests the correction works. I’m keen to track fermentation closely for new (to me) yeasts, ferment temperatures or or different grain bills.
The RAPT pill would interest me, provided it doesn’t get too upset with krausen. Of course I wouldn’t rely on it for og and fg, just tracking the change in between.

 

[RRising]

Has anyone done the Robobrew 3.0 to 3.1.1 board swap? is it worth the upgrade?

What benefits does it has over the old 3.0 board?

 

[Bourkie]

Cool, how's the app (i assume there is one for your RAPT platform) coming along?

Please do not cheap out on app development, its literally you get what you pay for, it's all good having a plan of a highly connected IoT brewery and the hardware to back it up but if the app doesn't work then it's all for naught. You see it heaps of times with IoT products where the app was contracted out to the cheapest dev and the product is unusable.

I'd also strongly suggest allowing community members becoming beta members. I would be more than happy to provide valuable feedback from being a beta tester.

 

[bbarbi355]

Whats the ETA on the 60L FermZilla All Rounder Pressure Brewing Kit?

 

[theSeekerr]

Has anyone done the Robobrew 3.0 to 3.1.1 board swap? is it worth the upgrade?

I did it because my 3.0 board died.

User facing, it has 2 new features:

1. The controller now has a setting 'HH' after 99C that will keep the elements on 100% of the time, rather than having to set the temperature above 100C to maintain a boil
2. You can switch the timers into a mode where the timer doesn't start until the setpoint temperature is achieved, so you don't have to guess at your ramp times and include them in the program anymore.

As an electrical engineer, I'd also add that the old board was garbage. Very poorly designed, with unsafe clearances between high voltage and low voltage. The new one is vastly better in that regard.

 

[RRising]

I did it because my 3.0 board died.

User facing, it has 2 new features:

1. The controller now has a setting 'HH' after 99C that will keep the elements on 100% of the time, rather than having to set the temperature above 100C to maintain a boil
2. You can switch the timers into a mode where the timer doesn't start until the setpoint temperature is achieved, so you don't have to guess at your ramp times and include them in the program anymore.

As an electrical engineer, I'd also add that the old board was garbage. Very poorly designed, with unsafe clearances between high voltage and low voltage. The new one is vastly better in that regard.

Thanks, thats awesome to know, ill definitely consider the upgrade.

So im guessing that since you are an electrical engineer you found it trivial to swap over, it doesn't look too hard if you label everything before.

 

[TONY VAN DER ZANDEN]

Thanks, thats awesome to know, ill definitely consider the upgrade.

So im guessing that since you are an electrical engineer you found it trivial to swap over, it doesn't look too hard if you label everything before.

I.M ABOUT TO CHANGE MINE ON A 65L ROBOBREW, YOU CAN DOWN LOAD A HOW TO FROM KEGLAND WITH SIMPLE INSTRUCTIONS, NOT THAT COMPLICATED.

 

[MHB]

Yeah I'm in Perth so the water is quite hard ~110ppm as CaCO3. I have tried undiluted vinegar as a substitute for BS remover to no effect. Will give the lactic a go.

There is a lot of difference between Beer Stone and a Calcium (usually Carbonate) buildup. You really need to identify which problem you have.
A Carbonate buildup can be removed with most any acid. Just make sure it isnt strong enough to harm you, your brewing equipment...
Beer Stone is quite a lot more complex, you really are best advised to use a made for the job chemical from someone who really knows how to manage the problem.
Beer stone is a blend of both Calcium Oxalate (mostly from malt) and Proteins (mostly), the Proteine protects the Oxalate from some acids, the Oxalate protects the proteine from Alkaline (NaOH) cleaners.

Bit of an Advertorial, but this from Morebeer isnt too bad a start, covers how to and a bit of the chemistry behind how it works.
Mark

Someone like Kegland should be able to order 25L of a dedicated Beerstone remover and repack it. There are some that might even not need to be shipped as DG, worth asking around some of the better chemical manufacturers, preferably one who specialises in brewing solutions.
Mark