Hot Side Aeration

[Goose]

G'day lads,

Either the search engine is too stupid or I am (ok ok) but struggling to find something comprehensive on the topic. Been trying to read up on this a bit more but as usual I come to some conflicting views...

Palmer says HSA can occur to the wort at any temperature above 80F (27 deg C). So that means that one has to minimise splashing etc when transferring wort from the mash tun to the boiler. Fair enough. Further reading however suggests that HSA effects can be prevalent due to oxidation of enzymes. That means if they are denatured "properly" in a mashout then HSA should not be a problem.

From a yankee forum:

I just read in Papazian's Complete Joy that hot side oxydation is caused by the oxydation of enzymes. Once the enzymes are deactivated at 170 degrees, hot side oxydation isn't an issue.

Comments welcome please.... because when I transfer my wort from the mash tun I have been pouring it through a strainer... have no choice but to splash it into my boiler... :blink: is this bad, even though I do a 75 deg C mashout ?


Goose.

 

[tangent]

http://media.libsyn.com/media/basicbrewing/bbr11-02-06.mp3

have a listen to this - don't panic, have a homebrew

 

[Keifer]

Personally i don't know whether it's true or not, so i minimise the amount of splashing i do (except into the fermentor). In my simple 3 tier AG system the only times HSA may occur would be stirring & recirculating the mash, and then when x-fering from mash tun to kettle. So i just take it nice and easy in those 3 areas of brew day. Easy as!

 

[Screwtop]

Use a pinch of Sodium Met in the mash and relax!

 

[Finite]

Use a pinch of Sodium Met in the mash and relax!

whats the idea here screwtop?

 

[Goose]

Hey Tangent, thats an excellent and informative listen, top man thanks.

In summary, HSA risks appear to be prevalent mainly in the dough in phase of the mash, not post mash or post boil. Mr Palmer, in a cameo appearance describes it well.

Finite, Screwtop is coming from something mentioned in this broadcast, apparently a sodium met tablet in the mash can help to bind/remove any oxygen in the mash that can cause the oxidation that can cause problems later .... have a listen.

Goose



edit for sp

 

[PostModern]

A pinch of sodium met in in the HLT is all you need. It's a powerful anti-oxidant, sucks up any O2 before the lipids can. It also breaks down chloramines if your water contains those. Just a pinch will do it.

 

[Airgead]

A pinch of sodium met in in the HLT is all you need. It's a powerful anti-oxidant, sucks up any O2 before the lipids can. It also breaks down chloramines if your water contains those. Just a pinch will do it.

Folks

Does anyone know of any alternatives to Sodium Met? That stuff can do nasty things to the airways and with an athsmatic wife in the house I'm reluctant to use it. I suppose any food grade antioxidant that didn't add flavour would do. Anyone had any experience with anything else?

Dave

 

[JasonY]

The amount you are adding is literaly a pinch, you should not even smell it if that helps?

 

[Keifer]

Is that stuff safe to drink? whats in it chemically?

 

[Adamt]

Sodium met = Sodium Metabisulphite Na2 S2 O5

It is used to remove chloramine and oxygen from water, SO2 is evolved on contact with water.

You can look at is as another salt that adjusts the water profile. A pinch in a batch will not cause any problems.

 

[JasonY]

Is that stuff safe to drink? whats in it chemically?

No expert but it is used in a lot of stuff from wine to foods so within reason I am sure it is not a problem but stirring it into your cup of coffee in the mornings is probably not advisable

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_metabisulfite

 

[tangent]

check out Charlie Papazian's addition - cinnamon. 1/2 tsp in the mash. it sucks up the O2 as well and in the small amount you can't taste it

it's all in Basic Brewing if you care to do some research.

 

[sam]

Dave,

Another option is ascorbic acid, it should stop potential oxidation in the mash.

It's used sometimes in winemaking. I think it might have a bit of a taste, not sure about quantity used.

I had a quick googley, some HBer people use it in the mash it seems. Also used as a bottling preservative.

Anyway, I think it's less irritating than pot met.

sam

 

[Airgead]

Thanks folks

Its not so much the pinch ion the mash that woul dbe the problem its the bag of it sitting around that may cause problems if it wasn't sealed properly of if the missus wandered past when I had it open. A trip to the hospital would probably ruin the brew more than a little HSA.

I might give the ascorbic acid a try. Shouldn't need much so taste should be fine.

Cheers
Dave

 

[hefevice]

check out Charlie Papazian's addition - cinnamon. 1/2 tsp in the mash. it sucks up the O2 as well and in the small amount you can't taste it

What I like about [sodium|potassium] met is that it will take Chloramine out of the water as well as acting as an antioxidant for the mash. Any idea what (if any) effect cinnamon may have on chloramines?

 

[Adamt]

Wikipedia suggests it is a good antioxidant, and has antimicrobial properties, but no mention of chloramine, and I would guess that it would have no effect whatsoever on chloramine.

 

[PostModern]

I doubt cinnamon would break down chloramines. But you never know.

I keep my met in a sealed plastic tub. I'm sensitive to it too, but I'm not asthmatic, so I have no issues handling it. I literally take a pinch out of the tub with dry fingers and sprinkle into the tun. I then wash my hands, never had an issue. It's also a handy antimicrobial cleaning agent for washing out the mashtun, etc. I wear gloves when doing that.

 

[Screwtop]

Dave,

Another option is ascorbic acid, it should stop potential oxidation in the mash.

It's used sometimes in winemaking. I think it might have a bit of a taste, not sure about quantity used.

I had a quick googley, some HBer people use it in the mash it seems. Also used as a bottling preservative.

Anyway, I think it's less irritating than pot met.

sam

Ascorbic acid (Vitamin C) is used in the brewing industry and in particular the baking industry to speed up and improve fermentation.
Cheers.

 

[tangent]

no chloramines in my water so cinnamon is cool
clove is s'posed to be heaps more powerful but i reckon you'd get the smell come through. Might be the go around your missus though Airgead.
http://www.phytochemicals.info/research/an...dants-herbs.php