Help A Fellow Australian To Stay Drunk

[Lecterfan]

Bad time to bring up various philosophies on population growth then?

Bad time if you don't want me to reply


edit: OH! I get it.....gloomy and political...sorry, cog...nit...ive....funk...shun....sl..ow..ing...

 

[gone_fishing]

Yeah, single muvvas should be compensated. Poor little things being dominated by the system and abusive men
GF

 

[manticle]

Yeah, single muvvas should be compensated. Poor little things being dominated by the system and abusive men
GF

Single parents of either gender.

Whole family court/children/parent's rights system needs a shake-up as well.

 

[davo4772]

Im pretty sure it's only for derelicts with dependents that blow all of their dole cheque's on booze, tobacco & gambling & their poor kids go without.

And the rest they wasted.

 

[hendog88]

Put simply, welfare recipients include many more people than the long term unemployed and unemployable.

You've lumped in aged pensioners and the disabled, students and single mothers with your stereotype.

I won't go into what a demotivational poverty trap the current system can be for people. Here try living on $200 a week and feel ashamed of yourself while doing it. If you try and work to supplement that and give yourself a bit of pride we'll cut that amount in half.

Some people are unemployable and addicts of various types. To suggest that's all welfare recipients displays an eagerness to demonise people you don't know due to stereotypes.

thanks Manticle :beer: , id been reading through this thinking wow ive been stereotyped... im an apprentice greenkeeper, first year i earn $300 a week from my wage and usually get about $150 a fortnight from centrelink to help me through! its bloody tough but it all helps.. tho im not a fan of those that arent trying to help themselves and are just claiming the money for nothing.. that said ive just found out that the bowling club i work at is being shut down in 6 weeks and ill be out of a job after that. so if any1 knows of a bowling club that needs a first year apprentice, send their name my way!

 

[felten]

hmm I've been out of work for a decade, maybe I should finally jump on the dole train

 

[Bribie G]

What you really need to do is to research your Aboriginal past, get a declaration of Aboriginality from an elder and you can then go to Uni and get onto abstudy which is a far better rate than austudy (or youth allowance). Also you can do a masters on abstudy which other (i.e. newer) Australians aren't allowed to do, and milk the system for the next ten years.
OOps did I just say the above?
Naughty me.
But it's true. h34r: h34r:

 

[Tim F]

A result of this has been the new relationship between the individual and the State, where the individual stands naked under the constant Gaze of the State - Centrelink being a prime example in the Western World. In return for this "control" the State has to give welfare as part of this new "social contract" with the individual.

The reason we have Centrelink etc is so people who are unable to support themselves can become self sufficient. It is a communal, civilised way of supporting each other when we need it and it has nothing whatsoever to do with controlling people in any way. This was the principle behind welfare payments when they were introduced and I guarantee that it is still true right now.

 

[Crusty]

Punish the workers who hold down two or sometimes three part time jobs.
Take extra tax from them & give it to the Junkie's that go to the beach all day, smoke bongs in the afternoon
& drink piss all night. Get up around 10am & repeat the process.
We receive a fortnightly supplement income from Centrelink as my wife works 12hrs per week, permanent part time & I work casual,
28-30hrs per week. The welfare system is so screwed up that when I took on a second job as a mail contractor on a postie bike,
we lost our health care card, I could only get the tax free threshold from the one employer & Centrelink took $120.00 per fortnight
off us as our combined gross was just under $50,000.00 per year. This sends a very clear message that by getting off your arse & working harder,
you will be hammered for having a go. I will never work full time again to receive less money, it's frigging ridiculous. I have never been unemployed & have been offered
a full time job only two weeks ago & I did the math, & we are worse off taking on the full time job. I would be receiving less money per week & all the benefits stripped
from us for trying to better ourselves & support our children. This Government really stinks. What's the alternative for running this country? I donkey voted on the last two
elections as well as our local elections as I cannot see a single person in power or opposition who makes any credible sense that doesn't dribble horse shit.
Stop punishing the workers, robbing small business & forcing our pensioners ( once tax payers ) to the threshold of bankruptcy or support dependancy. No wonder our crime rate is on the rise as everyday people are forced into situations to try & survive. The people in power are so out of touch with everyday Australian's, it's absolutely disgusting.
Don't get me started on the illegal refugees or boat people either. Australia's the place to go for free accomodation, housing, food & hardship money.
YOU GO LABOUR, WELL DONE!

 

[Paul H]

To add another perspective as an employer, our business employs two women who job share a Mon-Fri weekday administrative role. Both women are a valuable asset to our business. One of the women has sought to reduce her availabliity from 3 to 2 days per week. We had asked the other if she was interested in moving to 3 days. After a couple of days deliberation she came back to us declining the offer on the basis that she would be better off financially to remain at two days as in her situation of of being married to a tradie with a fixed salary & having twin children in day care. Ironically they both need the additional income to support their lifestyles, which are by no means extravagent.

As our business is growing we need the coverage of 5 days a week. The new job sharing arrangements do not suit our needs & as a result it looks like we may have to discard the job sharing arrangement & hire a full time staff member. The net result is that two families will now have their standard of living reduced. As an employer & business owner we are able to increase our financial positions & that of our family though working harder, longer & smarter without financial penalty, apart from an increased tax burden (don't get me started). However if you are an employee you have no such opportunity unless you are in a position that is very well paid.

Cheers

Paul

 

[Crusty]

To add another perspective as an employer, our business employs two women who job share a Mon-Fri weekday administrative role. Both women are a valuable asset to our business. One of the women has sought to reduce her availabliity from 3 to 2 days per week. We had asked the other if she was interested in moving to 3 days. After a couple of days deliberation she came back to us declining the offer on the basis that she would be better off financially to remain at two days as in her situation of of being married to a tradie with a fixed salary & having twin children in day care. Ironically they both need the additional income to support their lifestyles, which are by no means extravagent.

As our business is growing we need the coverage of 5 days a week. The new job sharing arrangements do not suit our needs & as a result it looks like we may have to discard the job sharing arrangement & hire a full time staff member. The net result is that two families will now have their standard of living reduced. As an employer & business owner we are able to increase our financial positions & that of our family though working harder, longer & smarter without financial penalty, apart from an increased tax burden (don't get me started). However if you are an employee you have no such opportunity unless you are in a position that is very well paid.

Cheers

Paul

Well said Paul,
This is the exact situation I find myself in. Getting an extra day of work for me will also attract a penalty for trying to financially benefit my family.
We have to give a yearly estimate to centrelink who in turn works out what benefit we are entitled to based on our gross combined income.
Do I want to receive a supplement income, No I don't, I can't stand the losers but unfortunately we are in a situation of not earning enough gross income
to be able to support ourselves. To omitt Centrelink completely, I would need to be earning $75,000.00 per year to support my wife & children as well.
Not too many jobs paying that kind of money these days.

 

[Bribie G]

Welcome to the "poverty trap" :icon_cheers:

When I arrived in Australia in the 1970s there was full employment, no "underclass" like we see today and it seemed that everybody (unless you owned a business) was on more or less the same income level and could live comfortably on that. It was most unusual to be on the dole for more than a few weeks until you could secure another job and welfare benefits were very limited. I seem to remember getting $130 a fortnight or similar until I got my first job at around $150 a week, which was average. If you earned over $200 a week you were considered well off. However you have to look at the living standards of the time.

The problem nowadays is that most people would just refuse to accept the lifestyle of those days, it's almost like a different planet. This is what it was like in Bundaberg in the early 70s - a fairly typical mid sized city.

Three bedroom chamferboard house with one bathroom, a single car (e.g. EH Holden with no air con or heating) - a black and white TV that would cost you a fortnight's pay. No computer or internet. No eftpos or ATMs, if you wanted money you had to physically go to the bank and queue to get it out. Hardly any supermarkets in today's sense. No mobile phones. No social networking or forums Most people walked down to the pay phone if they needed to make a call. No Maccas. Only two beers on tap take your choice. Virtually no public transport apart from a couple of rattletrap buses four times a day weekdays. Universal drink driving. Women had to leave their jobs at banks and local councils if they got married. (hence virtually no male unemployment). No overseas holidays although some adventurous souls were getting to Bali. No freeways in Queensland anyway. Holidays were at a caravan park at the beach. Definitely no poofs or boongs thanks. List goes on.

But people were happy because they didn't know anything else, like us nowadays I suppose. However most people could live just fine and I never remember any complaints about the cost of living or the impossibility of owning a home ( my first house was $19,000 )



Like the Chinese Curse, we definitely have come to live in interesting times

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

The whole welfare/singlemother/child support is bullshit

My ex has worked out that she can work 1 day a week, get single mothers pension, get all MY family tax benefit A & B, get child support from me and end up with more money in the hand than I do, and I have to work.

Now when it comes to me wanting more than 5 days a fortnight with my kids, she refuses, the reason being is that once I get more time with the kids her child support and family tax goes down. But does she say that in mediation or court.....of course not...she just refuses to give me more time. She also bleats that she cant get more work, but that is crap, as the more work she gets, the less she gets from the government.

Its about time the system was made so that lazy arse people cant make a living at other peoples/tax payers expense

 

[manticle]

My brother's going through a similar thing with the mother of his child.

She doesn't work, lives with her own mum and has other children with other fathers.

My brother has been employed with the same company for years, has a decent income, has met every single child support payment in full and on time and has recently married. He has no criminal record or history of drug/alcohol abuse and basically no reason to be denied access to his child.

The system is definitely skewed and in need of a proper shake-up - just not the kind of 'reform' that simply maes it difficult for those using the system as it should be used while continuing to allow the wilful abuse by those who know how to work it.

 

[BobtheBrewer]

The reason we have Centrelink etc is so people who are unable to support themselves can become self sufficient.

I would suggest that there is a fair proportion of people receiving Centrelink benefits who are unwilling to make the effort to support themselves.

 

[Tim F]

I would suggest that there is a fair proportion of people receiving Centrelink benefits who are unwilling to make the effort to support themselves.

In my experience (I work at Centrelink) It's very much the minority. The vast majority of customers genuinely have just fallen on hard times, lost their job, or stuff going on in their life and they can't work, but they are looking for work again or working up to it. Personally I'm happy if a few percent of my taxes are going to the odd slacker if so much more of it is really helping people.

*Note - this is just my opinion, not Centrelinks official position.

 

[jasonharley]

The reason we have Centrelink etc is so people who are unable to support themselves can become self sufficient. It is a communal, civilised way of supporting each other when we need it and it has nothing whatsoever to do with controlling people in any way. This was the principle behind welfare payments when they were introduced and I guarantee that it is still true right now.

The real issue is transition. Take away welfare immediately and crime will likely go up....... there are third generation families who have never work a day in their life and find getting up in the morning a major challenge. So resorting to crime is a way for some to survive because working would be a foreign concept. Furthermore, because Australia has no 'family contract' ie. the responsiblity of children to parents ..... there is no family support networks like in Asian countries..... this makes reliance on the state more liekly. But like many outdated political concepts, the welfare state needs to be replaced. The State is running out of options, especially in the face of globalisation ...... the poor will always be there .....so get use to it !!!

 

[yum beer]

Punish the workers who hold down two or sometimes three part time jobs.
Take extra tax from them & give it to the Junkie's that go to the beach all day, smoke bongs in the afternoon
& drink piss all night. Get up around 10am & repeat the process.
We receive a fortnightly supplement income from Centrelink as my wife works 12hrs per week, permanent part time & I work casual,
28-30hrs per week. The welfare system is so screwed up that when I took on a second job as a mail contractor on a postie bike,
we lost our health care card, I could only get the tax free threshold from the one employer & Centrelink took $120.00 per fortnight
off us as our combined gross was just under $50,000.00 per year. This sends a very clear message that by getting off your arse & working harder,
you will be hammered for having a go. I will never work full time again to receive less money, it's frigging ridiculous. I have never been unemployed & have been offered
a full time job only two weeks ago & I did the math, & we are worse off taking on the full time job. I would be receiving less money per week & all the benefits stripped
from us for trying to better ourselves & support our children. This Government really stinks. What's the alternative for running this country? I donkey voted on the last two
elections as well as our local elections as I cannot see a single person in power or opposition who makes any credible sense that doesn't dribble horse shit.
Stop punishing the workers, robbing small business & forcing our pensioners ( once tax payers ) to the threshold of bankruptcy or support dependancy. No wonder our crime rate is on the rise as everyday people are forced into situations to try & survive. The people in power are so out of touch with everyday Australian's, it's absolutely disgusting.
Don't get me started on the illegal refugees or boat people either. Australia's the place to go for free accomodation, housing, food & hardship money.
YOU GO LABOUR, WELL DONE!

FFS Crusty, what maths did you do?

Centrelink only reduce your payments as a percentage of your income..it is not possible to be worse off.......
thats a typical cop out from a dole bludger...if thats not what you are...take the full time job, put an extra few dollars in ya pocket,
hold yer head high, brew your beer and thank **** you had assistance to help when you needed it!

 

[yum beer]

I would suggest that there is a fair proportion of people receiving Centrelink benefits who are unwilling to make the effort to support themselves.

just for interest...90% of the population of Australia recieve some form of Centrelink payment/assistance.

Thats a lot of slack arse bludgers...ow I just kicked my toe on one.

 

[outbreak]

The real issue is transition. Take away welfare immediately and crime will likely go up....... there are third generation families who have never work a day in their life and find getting up in the morning a major challenge. So resorting to crime is a way for some to survive because working would be a foreign concept. Furthermore, because Australia has no 'family contract' ie. the responsiblity of children to parents ..... there is no family support networks like in Asian countries..... this makes reliance on the state more liekly. But like many outdated political concepts, the welfare state needs to be replaced. The State is running out of options, especially in the face of globalisation ...... the poor will always be there .....so get use to it !!!

I totally agree... Our sense of family and civic responsibility is warped. These days we are not citizens as that requires a moral responsibility, we are only consumers.

I just don't understand how someone who has the ability to work a good honest day, doesn't. I work 50 hours a week (no im not looking for sympathy) and I am looking for a Saturday job so I can save for a chance to own a shitbox in a crappy suburb all because the baby boomers thought it was a good idea to treat their homes as investments and totally fucked the property market. I complain about it sometimes but I know what I have to do to change my situation, and I am doing it.


Both my parents worked when I was little. Dad was the main income, and mum worked at a restaurant 3 times a week at night, and when we went to school mum started working during the day. I don't understand how it is so hard? To get a job that earn approx 45k a year is easy in any retail setting (i've been there and done that) and to get casual wages to the tune of 20k a year isn't hard at all. I don't understand how a thrifty family couldn't survive off that and then if the main income earner worked hard and excelled at their job to get a promotion things would get easier and they could even look at saving money.