EOI Oxygen scavenging caps/crown seals

[Schikitar]

Brilliant, thanks for organising, it'll be interesting to see the results!

 

[wynnum1]

Have you looked at other postage options i see that office works will deliver anywhere in Australia and may be cheaper and better service and can put into a box with a label attached .

 

[n87]

Have you looked at other postage options i see that office works will deliver anywhere in Australia and may be cheaper and better service and can put into a box with a label attached .

Thanks. It does look like a cheaper option, taking ~$1-$3 off the price depending on size.
They have satchels, which is the easier option, otherwise I need to find boxes small enough (have access to plenty of huge boxes) or make them.


Aus Post satchels
500g: 35.5 x 22cm - 8.50
3kg: 40.5 x 31cm - 13.80
5kg: 51 x 43.5cm - 17.60

Officeworks satchels
500g: 19 x 26 - 7.50
2kg: 24 x 32.5 - 11.50
3kg: 29.7 x 42 - 12.50
5kg: 44 x 61.5 - 15.50

 

[n87]

Hi All, some great new info from the supplier:

The OXY Scav caps are activated when they get wet during the bottling process and start working when the pressure in the bottle increases.
Therefore they cannot be activated in any other way and thus they can be exposed to air before usage.
They absorb up to a limit (saturation) of the active chemical elements. I cannot give you a specific number because this depends on the headspace value. For sure it is calculated to absorb the oxygen remaining in the head space if the bottling principles of the industry were followed. (e.g. it might not be able to absorb all the oxygen trapped in the bottle if the headspace is more than 50% - extreme scenario just for example)
We recommend to use the caps within a year from production. However in tests that we have performed long after expiration date, the caps have been activated and absorbed the oxygen (Bubbles were visible in the liner).

And the weight for the whole carton (10,000 caps) is 21kg, so we may be able to just get 1000 in a 2kg satchel. I will get those who have 1000 to pay for a 3kg satchel, and if it fits in a 2kg, i will put $1 in the satchel with the caps.

I will start PMing throughout the day to confirm places, and if we still have most places filled, I will send out payment details and get it going.

 

[n87]

Just double checked the pricing, and the supplier has updated the postage [+~$11].
Updated prices:

Caps
500: $11.43
1000: $22.86
2000: $45.72

Postage [dependant on physical size]
500: 2kg: 24 x 32.5 - $11.50
1000: 3kg: 29.7 x 42 - $12.50 (if they end up fitting in a 2kg, i will send you a $1 coin )
2000: 5kg: 44 x 61.5 - $15.50

 

[n87]

So this is going ahead, PM's have been sent to those involved.

Let me know if anyone wants to go on the reserve list, in case someone pulls out, or of course, if someone wants to split their caps with someone local.

Reserve:
@Schikitar - 500

 

[Stouter]

A question with the use of these.
After looking at the Craftbrewer link for their equivalent, at the bottom of their page it mentions, "when used in conjunction with a counter pressure bottle filler". Do these need to be used, or are they more effective with one. I had planned to use them with a foot valve tube filler and regular capper.

 

[n87]

A question with the use of these.
After looking at the Craftbrewer link for their equivalent, at the bottom of their page it mentions, "when used in conjunction with a counter pressure bottle filler". Do these need to be used, or are they more effective with one. I had planned to use them with a foot valve tube filler and regular capper.

The response from the supplier (a couple of posts up) states that they are activated by moisture, and start working as the pressure rises. The CPBF would bring the pressure up much quicker, but also consider that as your beer warms up (assuming a cold crash) the pressure will increase.
I am planning on using them the same way as you.

I cant see them working any differently, just that they might start working quicker with a CPBF.... TBH, NFI, YMMV, etc.

 

[Stouter]

Cheers n87. I had read through already and noted the post regarding moisture activation, the craftbrewer spiel just threw me by adding another thing to the equation.
Had me thinking, is it really that simple? Yes, it is!

 

[n87]

There may be more forces at work, but for the life of me, i cant think of them.
The only thing CPBF gives you over standard bottle conditioning is close to instant pressure (I would guess equilibrium in ~15 mins) vs say 4-20 days depending on temp and beer.

I would love to have a look over the chemicals at play here and work it out myself... but that is just me.


On another point, the liners on these are a bit thicker that the standard caps, so they may require a bit more effort in capping. This would likely be for their O2 barrier side

 

[n87]

Thats a lot of fekin caps



real quick postage

 

[Schikitar]

Oh wow, that is a lot and super fast delivery!

 

[n87]

All bagged up in 500 lots.
Will be able to start sending out next week.

 

[n87]

These are all posted out and everyone should have their tracking number.

For those interested, the Mailman (Officeworks) system is a little bit of a pain in the ass for multiple parcels. the steps as follows:

Swipe to start (trying to be cool and iPhoney)
Are you picking up or dropping off
Scan your parcel
This is what you have paid for, are you sure that is correct?
Scan your extra cover card or next
[locker clicks open] Put your parcel in locker 4
did you put your parcel in locker 4?
I am printing your confirmation, do you have your confirmation
thank you (for 30 seconds)

wait 30 seconds, and start again.

TBH, I was over it before I finished the first one, but curiosity kept me going.
Would hate to do a big bulk buy

 

[Schikitar]

Thanks @n87, really appreciate the extra effort you went to mate!

 

[Stouter]

After using these for my last three batches I've put aside some long term laybuys. Several bottles from two stouts and a smoked Porter batch. Not sure if I'll be able to measure the difference, but I'm sure I'll appreciate it. With so many I'm just using them on every batch now regardless.
Definite difference when putting the caps on, needed a little more effort to get the lever action happening.
Aiming for an RIS in the next few batches, which would see good use of these caps.
Thanks again to n87 for the buy.

 

[n87]

Thanks for the review, I hope to bottle an eis bock in the next couple of weeks, that will be my first time using them.

 

[Schikitar]

Hey all, just reporting in on my use so far! So back on the 22nd July I bottled my Oatmeal XPA, in doing so I used these caps except for four beers which I labelled 1 - 4. I bulk primed with 6g of table sugar per litre, then stored the bottles at about 18 - 22 degrees for two weeks.

This beer came out really well, it was my fist AG brew and I was pleasantly surprised/chuffed with the result.

+3 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Strong hop flavour and aroma, nice malty backbone
Reg Cap - Very similar, if not the same

+4 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Strong hop flavour and aroma, nice malty backbone
Reg Cap - Still quite similar, maybe an ever so slight drop in aroma

+5 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Hop aroma has dropped a little, all other characteristics remain the same, still great
Reg Cap - Noticeable difference, diminished hop aroma and flavour, tastes more bitter/harsher

+6 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Another tiny incremental drop in hop flavour and aroma, but the backbone remains intact
Reg Cap - Definitely not as good, so unless I did something to these sample bottles it seems to me that the O2 caps have made a difference

This is in no way scientific, and totally anecdotal. There could have been other factors influencing the result. At +5 weeks I gave my wife a blind taste test, she had one of the O2cap beers (which she really likes btw, winning!) and then I poured her another from the reg cap bottle (without her knowledge) and she asked me what beer it was and bluntly said she didn't like it as much and could I just give her one of the other ones instead please! Ha!

I have since bottled a RIS and a RyePA, the latter of which have turned out really well and I'll see how long they hold up for as all my XPA's (except for 4 I've tucked away for further testing) were consumed! It'll be some time before I crack one of the RIS but I'm hoping these caps will go a long way to helping them bottle condition nicely!

If there's ever another bulk buy for these caps then please let me know, I'm sold!

 

[n87]

Hey all, just reporting in on my use so far! So back on the 22nd July I bottled my Oatmeal XPA, in doing so I used these caps except for four beers which I labelled 1 - 4. I bulk primed with 6g of table sugar per litre, then stored the bottles at about 18 - 22 degrees for two weeks.

This beer came out really well, it was my fist AG brew and I was pleasantly surprised/chuffed with the result.

+3 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Strong hop flavour and aroma, nice malty backbone
Reg Cap - Very similar, if not the same

+4 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Strong hop flavour and aroma, nice malty backbone
Reg Cap - Still quite similar, maybe an ever so slight drop in aroma

+5 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Hop aroma has dropped a little, all other characteristics remain the same, still great
Reg Cap - Noticeable difference, diminished hop aroma and flavour, tastes more bitter/harsher

+6 weeks from bottling
02 Cap - Another tiny incremental drop in hop flavour and aroma, but the backbone remains intact
Reg Cap - Definitely not as good, so unless I did something to these sample bottles it seems to me that the O2 caps have made a difference

This is in no way scientific, and totally anecdotal. There could have been other factors influencing the result. At +5 weeks I gave my wife a blind taste test, she had one of the O2cap beers (which she really likes btw, winning!) and then I poured her another from the reg cap bottle (without her knowledge) and she asked me what beer it was and bluntly said she didn't like it as much and could I just give her one of the other ones instead please! Ha!

I have since bottled a RIS and a RyePA, the latter of which have turned out really well and I'll see how long they hold up for as all my XPA's (except for 4 I've tucked away for further testing) were consumed! It'll be some time before I crack one of the RIS but I'm hoping these caps will go a long way to helping them bottle condition nicely!

If there's ever another bulk buy for these caps then please let me know, I'm sold!

Awesome writeup, thanks.
Great to hear they are doing something.

 

[n87]

I used these myself for the first time last week on an eisbock, There does seem to be a little extra resistance when capping, but not a huge amount.
I bottled a couple in swing tops to compare in a few months.