Cube Bitterness?

[Thirsty Boy]

Hey Scotsman,
I just got a hopsock aswell and used it on my last brew, ask a similar question in another Topic and the answer was that it will keep alot of the hop material out of the cube but the bittering compounds in the hops will have been released from the hops and still be dissolved into the wort..

Wont really matter on the 60min addition to much but im still sticking to 45min addition(for 60min) and cube hopping for the 20min addition(flavour) and dry hopping(if required for specific brew) after 7-10 days of fermentation for aroma... Getting good results with this method..

I still think with using the hopsock and by keeping most of the hop material out of the cube, you will decrease some bitterness though from the hops as im sure that all hasnt been released from them...

maybe -- what you say is roughly what I believe, so I'm not arguing with you - but I think that this is all still new enough that we are still discovering how it works and people's individual experiences have yet to firmly distill down to a commonly accepted "this is what happens"

The only area where I don't more or less think your method is solid, is in the dry hopping. Dry hopping adds a distinctly different sort of aroma to late hopping. Nothing wrong with it - but its not the same. That why people are mucking about with the french press stuff - to emulate late hop aroma, not just to get a strong aroma.

MattC - sorry mate, I missed your question till now. I use nearly boiling water for my Ultra Late hopping - from the kettle to a pre-heated beaker to measure the volume, to the French press.

TB

 

[clean brewer]

maybe -- what you say is roughly what I believe, so I'm not arguing with you - but I think that this is all still new enough that we are still discovering how it works and people's individual experiences have yet to firmly distill down to a commonly accepted "this is what happens"

The only area where I don't more or less think your method is solid, is in the dry hopping. Dry hopping adds a distinctly different sort of aroma to late hopping. Nothing wrong with it - but its not the same. That why people are mucking about with the french press stuff - to emulate late hop aroma, not just to get a strong aroma.

MattC - sorry mate, I missed your question till now. I use nearly boiling water for my Ultra Late hopping - from the kettle to a pre-heated beaker to measure the volume, to the French press.

TB

I agree TB, as I sent in a PM to Scotsman, I am still tweaking/experimenting with a few different things, unfortunately it takes a while to learn as Im only learning on each brew and each brew takes a little bit to drink... Im going to be trying the "French Press" idea next and see what the results are from that..

Im sure one day someone will be able to do some serious scientifics on "No-chilling" and give us a conclusive answer to everything with it to bring it in-line with chilling straight up after doing a brew and normal additions...

But for now, its just brew by brew and learning along the way.... so many factors to take into account other than addition times etc

:icon_cheers: CB

 

[hazard]

I found this on the homebrewtalk forum
View attachment No_Chill_Hop_Adjust.bmp

 

[buttersd70]

I found this on the homebrewtalk forum
View attachment 28459

mmm. I disagree. as I said a few pages back, I don't think theres that much difference. Particularly when you look at the discrepency between hop utilisation, cross-platform.

 

[clean brewer]

+1 for Butters in a way for me....

I have been working on:

-Bittering(60 MIN) as FWH
-20 Minute addtion into the Cube
and Aroma as a dry Hop into Fermenter after 7-9 days, but still playing with that aswell but have been getting some good results IMO.

Hopping also is dependant on Style aswell............... :icon_cheers:

:icon_chickcheers: CB

 

[Beer&Kebab]

I have been getting into AG for about a year now. Most brews have been cubed, though some have been BIAB half batches chilled in a 20 litre stock pot in the sink. These have all had "normal" hop additions. With the full size no-chilled batches I have been adding 60 min bittering additions + cube hopping + dry hopping and I have to say that the flavour and aroma aren't as good as my chilled attempts. I haven't done side by side tests but it seems to me with no chilling that the bitterness isn't really the issue but the lovely subtlness that comes from the late additions that are then chilled are lost. Another AHBer (maybe in this thread - I have read so many) said that chilling is like a mash-out, it preserves the hop profile. I think that is absolutley spot on. I find these days if I make a kit beer and boil a little malt and add the some 10-5-0 hop additions I get all the hop flavours and aromas just how I like coz I can chill the pot nice and quick and "lock-in" that profile. So for my next AG batch I am going to add the normal 60 min addition, no-chill that with no other hop additions. Then when it is chilled (IE the next day) I will run off a litre or so into a saucepan bring it to the boil and do the 10-5-0 hop additions (just like I do with a kit beer) and give it a quick chill in the sink and then mix it with the rest of the cubes contents into the fermenter. This is the only way I can think of getting around the issue. I can't see there being an issue with a small size boil adding the flavour and aroma like there would be adding bittering. Sorry for war and peace

 

[crundle]

For mid to low AA hops I have been keeping my hop additions the same as most recipes call for, but with high AA hops I tend to reduce the boil additions by about 1/5th or so. For flameout hops, or those 5 minutes or less before flameout, I have taken to going for the French Press method, but I leave the hops in the plunger for 5 minutes, and have noticed a slightly more lingering aroma in my kegged beers.

This hasn't been the result of a controlled experiment, just my observations over about the last 5 brews that used a fair amount of aroma addtions. I add the hot hop soup to my chilled keg filled with beer, then gas/purge and gas up over about 10 days. I get a nice strong aroma that lasts for ages, but have not noticed anything untoward, such as vegetal flavours from doing so.

Crundle

 

[Elbow]

There's a recipe in the DB for a 10 minute IPA which I'm keen on having a crack at:


http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum//ind...amp;recipe=1192

I was going to Pride of Ringwood for this (8.9%). How would this translate to NC given that the recipe calls for one mega addition of hops at 10 minutes to achieve 60 IBU'S? Would it all be french pressed, cube hopped or added at whirl-pool?

 

[Phoney]

There's a recipe in the DB for a 10 minute IPA which I'm keen on having a crack at:


http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum//ind...amp;recipe=1192

I was going to Pride of Ringwood for this (8.9%). How would this translate to NC given that the recipe calls for one mega addition of hops at 10 minutes to achieve 60 IBU'S? Would it all be french pressed, cube hopped or added at whirl-pool?

If you read the first couple of pages of the accompanying thread (below), NC info is all there.

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum//ind...showtopic=46298

 

[Elbow]

I don't have any brewing software at the moment so I'm a bit stuck!

 

[Hatchy]

I think he's suggesting that you don't need software, there's a conversation about NC for that recipe in the discussion thread about that recipe.

Does anyone know what temp the wort needs to be to stop hop utilisation? Does anyone do a half arsed chill to stop hop utilisation but not to get to pitching temperature?

 

[Effect]

I know some qlders that will chill to about 70-75 degrees to stop the hop utilization and still be hot enough for no chill.

 

[argon]

I know some qlders that will chill to about 70-75 degrees to stop the hop utilization and still be hot enough for no chill.

+1 i'm pretty sure I've heard Ross mention that he does this with any cubes beers. Seems like a decent compromise.