Beer Has A Slight Sour Taste

[deathgod64]

I've posted here once before, and im at it again asking for a little advice. Now earlier I brewed my first batch of coopers from the micro brew kit followed instructions, so 1 week in the keg then 2 weeks minimum in the bottles well its right on that last day of the 2weeks and I thought I might give a bottle a try as I could not contain myself any longer. Cracked it open poured it perfect colour also had a nice head but when I went to take a sip at first it wasn't bad slightly watery and had a small hint of bitterness.

Now I read possible causes and most point to infection, I made sure I sterilised everything before used and washed it out with hot water several times, is there anything that could of caused a bitter taste? Mind you they haven't been refrigerated yet so im not sure if that could be a cause, or maybe should I leave it for a month to see if the flavour improves?

Cheers guys.

 

[Steve]

I've posted here once before, and im at it again asking for a little advice. Now earlier I brewed my first batch of coopers from the micro brew kit followed instructions, so 1 week in the keg then 2 weeks minimum in the bottles well its right on that last day of the 2weeks and I thought I might give a bottle a try as I could not contain myself any longer. Cracked it open poured it perfect colour also had a nice head but when I went to take a sip at first it wasn't bad slightly watery and had a small hint of bitterness.

Now I read possible causes and most point to infection, I made sure I sterilised everything before used and washed it out with hot water several times, is there anything that could of caused a bitter taste? Mind you they haven't been refrigerated yet so im not sure if that could be a cause, or maybe should I leave it for a month to see if the flavour improves?

Cheers guys.

Eli - Can you explain the taste?

 

[flattop]

More info
Which kit, how much sugar, was it with dextrose or cane sugar, which yeast (i assume packet yeast)?
How long after bottling did you try it?
It's not unusual for it to be a little shite in the first few days and to mature in the bottle.
6 months in the bottle would be ideal, first brew you would want 2-3 weeks before using the sample as a guide of the batch.

 

[deathgod64]

More info
Which kit, how much sugar, was it with dextrose or cane sugar, which yeast (i assume packet yeast)?
How long after bottling did you try it?
It's not unusual for it to be a little shite in the first few days and to mature in the bottle.
6 months in the bottle would be ideal, first brew you would want 2-3 weeks before using the sample as a guide of the batch.

Well I used the 1kg white sugar that came in the coopers micro brew kit box and yes it was a packet yeast. Everything in the micro brew kit for a first timer I used it sat in the fermenter for 7 days untill i transferred it to the PET bottles with 2 carbonation drops since their 700ml. Left those for 2 weeks and the 2 weeks i up today thought I might try one and its got a well its hard to explain im useless at explaining, but it doesn't feel like it has a full body its got more of a watery feel and no strong noticable beer flavour the hint of bitterness is only slight it could be due to lack of taste im not sure but im stuck at a cross roads should I leave the other bottles in the cupboard at room temp for a few more weeks/months? or put them in the fridge and see how they go for another week?

 

[seemax]

there are several *burP* possible explanations for the sour taste

<finishes off another bottle of ALL-cascade APA, love that citrus note>

-white sugar produces alcohol and leaves behind a cidery taste (dextrose does not)
-packet yeast is average and can and does produce unwanted flavours (but works over a larger temp range)
-high fermentation temp (try and stay around 18C for a cleaner taste)

my experience with kits is that they need min 6 weeks maturing time before the mellow out
my toucans take about 12 weeks, the harsh bitter taste reduces and the malt flavours comes out a bit
without any extra malt, all these kits will taste watery

time for another APA... or maybe a bock.... or a 6month old vienna lager... so much choice !!

 

[deathgod64]

Thanks so much seemax, could of been a high temp had 2 days where it was sometmies peaking at 32 should of wated till after the hot weather! yeah for this second batch i've bought dextrose from the brewing shop but still using a packet yeast not sure if I want to risk any other untill i can keep a stable temp. Got the fermenter in the laundry rather than the garage now so hopefully that works just gotta stop being lazy and start it

 

[seemax]

ouch, 32C is a no go for fermenting beer, that would explain the cidery/sour flavours
wait another 2-4 weeks and try again , in the mean time start your next brew
1kg dextrose is ok, better would at least be a packet of Coopers brew enhancer 2, it's 500g dextrose and 250g malt extract

you can always try wet towels and fan or an ice bath of some sort, but that all takes regular work
best thing to do is grab an old banger of a fridge on ebay or freecycle and get a temp controller (eg. fridgemate) for $40
you can then do lagers (around 10C) and ales (14-18C)

a stable temp is pretty important, too much up and down and the yeast goes wacko

 

[flattop]

Seemax is right, the high temps would make that batch a little rough. Not much wasted, leave it at room temp another 2 weeks then just store it for a few months.
It may not help, but it cant hurt.

The other point Seemax so delicately made was that you really need maturation time in the bottle and drinking your gear a week or so after bottling doesn't do it justice.
Try to stockpile a few different brews or at least put half a batch away for drinking later. Hard when you are new to brewing and have only produced 30 bottles, but otherwise your flavors will be naff and you will give up the hobby without doing it justice.

 

[reviled]

+1 for temp controlled fridge or chest freezer, makes life way easier! Id say that the 32* would be the culprit with your brew here mate...

If you dont want to spend money on a fridge and temp control, a big plastic bucket which will fit the fermenter works well, or bathtub, fill with water and some PET ice blocks and cover with a wet towel.. Doesnt take much maintanence, just replace the ice blocks when they melt..

 

[shayne]

for what it's worth, my first brew is sour too. same kit, same scenario - very quick ferment (i had foam on my lounge room floor, the misses loved it

it's 3 weeks in the bottle now, and gotta say it has improved a little, but still sour. i thought i was doing well, but have since found out (from the enormous amount of advice and info on this forum) that brewing that hot that quick is not going to produce a good beer. shame i have 3 more rounds in bottles that i think suffer the same problem - i'm now looking for a fridge, you can pick them up on ebay for a song these days and temp sensor from jaycar for about $40.

the good news is, since this is my only source of beer, i get to drink it cause i don't think it's worth keeping

 

[deathgod64]

for what it's worth, my first brew is sour too. same kit, same scenario - very quick ferment (i had foam on my lounge room floor, the misses loved it

it's 3 weeks in the bottle now, and gotta say it has improved a little, but still sour. i thought i was doing well, but have since found out (from the enormous amount of advice and info on this forum) that brewing that hot that quick is not going to produce a good beer.

Don't worry from my minor experience heat can either give you a good or bad brew. My second batch was brewed at an 18 - 23 temp its a draught and does have a stronger flavour but it has an off taste on mine I think it may of been infected not sure. After it was bottled with carbonation drops it may of accidently sat in the sun to long which I think is the contributing factor. I did use a glucose sugar from the brewer this time which definently improved things

 

[Nickwrighty]

When i returned to brewing about a year ago, i had the same problem flavours as yourslf. Then i purchased a temp mate for my mini fridge.
This has improved my brewing by leaps and bounds. (Also i can finally make Lagers)

 

[shayne]

Then i purchased a temp mate for my mini fridge.

What is a "temp mate"? I found a device on jaycar for ~$40 to turn a fridge into a 'wine cellar' so I assume would have a similar effect, but interested in what everyone else is using. obviously a fridge is too cold and mine wouldn't go up to 18 I wouldn't think, so need a way to switch it off based on temp.

 

[buttersd70]

This is a tempmate link

Just one of several similar products.

 

[deathgod64]

One thing I want to ask you guys. Now following the coopers instructions your brew stays in the fermenter for one week before you bottle with carbonation drops. What I want to know is i've heard things about a second bucket where you put your beer in after the first week instead of bottling with sugar.

Is this other method a better/safer way of brewing? I'm contemplating buying a mini fridge and the Tempmate after reading about it as I am still not 100% sure where my bad tastes are coming from. I'm almost certain im doing the first steps accuratly.

 

[mesa]

Hi Elli,
There are two scenarios where you transfer beer to a second fermenter.

The first scenario is the "bottling bucket". I used this for quite a while. Basically instead of putting carbonation drops in each bottle, you disolve some sugar in water and put it in the bottom of a second fermenter. You then drain the beer from you first fermenter into the second fermenter (which mixes it with the sugar water) and then from there straight into the bottles. The advanges are 1) Table sugar is more available than carbonation drops 2) You can more easily vary the amount of bubbles (i.e. reduce them for a stout) 3) If your careful you can get more beer out of the first (primary) fermenter before you stir up the sediment.

The second scenario is the "secondary fermention/fermenter". This one is a bit more complicated. I've brewed a lot of batches (kit, extract and all grain) without using it. Some people claim using it increases the risk of infection. I'm using it at the moment to add some extra hop flavour to an APA, mostly because I haven't tried it before and I'm curious.

Hope that helps a bit

--
Mesa

 

[buttersd70]

Don't confuse secondary fermentation with a second vessel for conditioning....the former is racked to prior to the end of fermentation, and the latter is racked to after fermentation is complete. Totally differant animals.

 

[Darren]

Don't confuse secondary fermentation with a second vessel for conditioning....the former is racked to prior to the end of fermentation, and the latter is racked to after fermentation is complete. Totally differant animals.

I was always of the understanding that secondary fermentation was malo lactic fermentation as occurs in wine

When making beer, it is only a primary ferment, then conditioning in secondary vessel.

cheers

Darren

EDIT: EliAmirian, Is your beer sour or bitter or both?