Avoiding Chill Haze Without Polyclar

[manticle]

The reason mega beer is served cold is because it tastes awful when served at the correct temperature. The cold kills the flavor.

One reason why I enjoy what most people think of as warm beer. It tastes better.

Agreed. To me the sign of a good beer is that it tastes nice above 5-10 degrees. When I make a good one, mine do. I only chill my beers at all in the fiercer heat of summer and this is my first summer of AG brewing. Beer under 40 degree sun (admittedly inside a shed but still hot) tastes ok but the feel/texture of it that warm is not ok. Also it tends to gush when I open the bottle and occasionally you do need tits freezing refreshing in that weather.

Thanks for that explanation Thirsty Boy. I cold condition all my beers for around a week. If I had a walk in coolroom I could do more for longer but I'll have a crack at extending the CC period when my stocks are plentiful and I can afford the fridge space.

 

[Asher]

Get your Calcium levels up.

For protein to coagulate well you need adequate calcium..... then Chill B)

 

[Kai]

I just flipped through Michael Jackson's "Great Beer Guide" - the lowest recommended serving temperature out of 500 beers featured - was 9C for the lightest beers, with 10-15 for the majority of the ales with any colour -- up to 18 (max) for a Chimay Grand Reserve.

While I agree that beers are often served too cold, I think it pays to step away and think here for a minute. What was Michael Jackson? A pom. What is England? Bloody freezing.

I would never serve beer as warm as 9C on a 40C day. Once it's in a glass you can warm your beer up but you certainly can't cool it down again.

I agree that a solid boil and a cold chill is the best recipe for minimising chill haze without additives. I used to boil the guts out of 20-25L batches in a 60L pot then would chill in a cube on wintry nights in the Adelaide Hills (-3 to 5C). That with a week of cold conditioning post-ferment was usually a recipe for a fairly clear beer at fridge temp.

 

[Nick JD]

"Removes polyphenolic compounds and oxidised melanoidins. This means that when used in beer it will remove haze-causing husk tannins and oxidised compounds that contribute to off flavours."

 

[BjornJ]

Reading the article BCP linked to on byo.com gives good information:
http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/arti...quer-chill-haze


But it also says No Chill beers would all have chill haze :

After chilling and a good cold break rest (for about two hours), the clear wort can be siphoned or poured into a primary fermenter, leaving cold trub and haze-forming compounds behind. Unfortunately, this effect is lost if the wort is cooled slowly. Many homebrewers let the boiling wort cool overnight in a sealed, sanitized container, then pitch yeast the next day. When this is done, the beer will always have a chill haze because the haze-forming compounds will have remained in solution.

Now that isn't true, is it?


Thanks
Bjorn

 

[Bribie G]

Reading the article BCP linked to on byo.com gives good information:
http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/arti...quer-chill-haze


But it also says No Chill beers would all have chill haze :

After chilling and a good cold break rest (for about two hours), the clear wort can be siphoned or poured into a primary fermenter, leaving cold trub and haze-forming compounds behind. Unfortunately, this effect is lost if the wort is cooled slowly. Many homebrewers let the boiling wort cool overnight in a sealed, sanitized container, then pitch yeast the next day. When this is done, the beer will always have a chill haze because the haze-forming compounds will have remained in solution.

Now that isn't true, is it?


Thanks
Bjorn

Probably only true in the Northern Hemisphere

My default kegmate temperature setting when I've got a selection of ales and lagers on tap


Genuine recycled BribieG Photo:

This one was no chilled and I didn't even bother cold conditioning it, I kegged it straight out of primary because I thought it was going to be a failure - so didn't gelatine or polyclar it either, turned out a wee ripper (Irish Red).

 

[The Scientist]

Reading the article BCP linked to on byo.com gives good information:
http://www.byo.com/stories/techniques/arti...quer-chill-haze


But it also says No Chill beers would all have chill haze :

After chilling and a good cold break rest (for about two hours), the clear wort can be siphoned or poured into a primary fermenter, leaving cold trub and haze-forming compounds behind. Unfortunately, this effect is lost if the wort is cooled slowly. Many homebrewers let the boiling wort cool overnight in a sealed, sanitized container, then pitch yeast the next day. When this is done, the beer will always have a chill haze because the haze-forming compounds will have remained in solution.

Now that isn't true, is it?


Thanks
Bjorn

Well, I no chill all the time and with the addition of gelatine my beers are crystal clear. So if gelatine only removes the yeast in suspension then I should be left with chill haze. So I'd have to say that theory is busted.

I boil like hell for at least 60min and would have to say it was this which is breaking down the proteins and leaving me with a clear beer. I even let a fair amount of break matter go into both my no chill cube and even fermenter, so the above is no science or non-sense if you will


Cheers TS :icon_cheers:

 

[haysie]

Well, I no chill all the time and with the addition of gelatine my beers are crystal clear. So if gelatine only removes the yeast in suspension then I should be left with chill haze. So I'd have to say that theory is busted.

I boil like hell for at least 60min and would have to say it was this which is breaking down the proteins and leaving me with a clear beer. I even let a fair amount of break matter go into both my no chill cube and even fermenter, so the above is no science or non-sense if you will


Cheers TS :icon_cheers:

Exactly the same method, with a minimum 48 hrs c/c @ 2deg, then a week or 2 in the keg @ approx 5deg before cracking. Good beers most of the time, always clean n clear.

edit, did try the polyclar in both the boil and the fermenter, I didnt see any difference and for mine it wasnt worth the extra step in my brewing process

 

[Bribie G]

Turning the argument on its head then beers from commercial breweries - where they quite obviously don't no-chill in cubes - should be free of chill haze. On my last visit to the Platform Bar, none of the beers were crystal clear apart from the James Squire offerings, the rest (Sunshine Coast, Wood & Stone, etc) were chill hazed. Of course being a pub they were being poured at their default temperature i.e. mind numbingly cold.
However TB once posted details of the different substances that CUB use to clear and filter their beers and there was everything on the list apart from eye of newt and wing of bat. I guess the James Squire beers had received the full treatment, well they are a real brewery after all B)

 

[altstart]

Exactly the same method, with a minimum 48 hrs c/c @ 2deg, then a week or 2 in the keg @ approx 5deg before cracking. Good beers most of the time, always clean n clear.

edit, did try the polyclar in both the boil and the fermenter, I didnt see any difference and for mine it wasnt worth the extra step in my brewing process

No good adding Polyclar to the boil you need Brewbrite it is made by ISP who make Polyclar. Brewbrite is designed to remove chill haze by adding the correcct amount to the last 15 mins of the boil. There are several threads on here use the search function on Brewbrite it really works.
Cheers Altstart

 

[TidalPete]

Hey Jim,

How long have you been using Brewbrite?
Apparently CraftBrewer decided against stocking this stuff due to the short shelf life (6 months I think they said?)
Do you find it's still ok after a longer period?

T

 

[daemon]

On my last visit to the Platform Bar, none of the beers were crystal clear apart from the James Squire offerings, the rest (Sunshine Coast, Wood & Stone, etc) were chill hazed. Of course being a pub they were being poured at their default temperature i.e. mind numbingly cold.

If it's the Draught Ale from Stone and Wood then it should be hazy as it contains raw wheat. Not sure what the process is at the Sunshine Coast but like many little micro-breweries I'd rather drink the unfiltered, unpasteurised versions that have plenty of flavour

I've been simplifying some of my processes recently and ignoring some of the visual aspects of the end product. While I'll admit it's nice to take a photo of a crystal clear beer, the only time I can personally taste a difference is when it's yeast still suspended. I've gone back just the one fermenter (no racking) for most of my beers over the last 6 months and the last few haven't worried about gelatin or polyclar. Since time is a bigger factor, I simply ferment for 10 days, chill to 2c in primary for 2-3 days (3 second job to change the fridgemate) and keg. Less time, less cleaning and less chance to introduce problems rather than solving them.

Most are reasonably clear within a week, chill haze only within two weeks and even it will drop out in roughly 4 weeks if chilled (and if they last that long!). It's not as quick as using Gelatin and Polyclar, however it cuts down in time and cleaning which suits me better.

 

[Kai]

Stone and Wood Draught Ale is meant to be hazy, and most of the haze is from yeast. Leave a keg of it to settle for a couple days and it will drop quite bright

 

[altstart]

Hey Jim,

How long have you been using Brewbrite?
Apparently CraftBrewer decided against stocking this stuff due to the short shelf life (6 months I think they said?)
Do you find it's still ok after a longer period?

T

G'day Pete
I have had a kilo of this stuff for well over a year and it is a bloody brilliant product. As for the use by date from personal experience mine is as good as the day I opened the pack. I believe the manufacturer has now deleted the use by date from the product. Whatever grainbill I have used this with the result is no chill haze and it is so easy to use. The only problem is obtaining it retailers dont seem interested in stocking it.

 

[JonnyAnchovy]

I know the clear vs cloudy thing has been done to death, But I really think haze adds aesthetically to some types of beer.

In purely aesthetic terms I totally agree haze is a little offputting in lagers, but for a massive hoppy IIPA (or any ale really) I think slight haze actually enhances the visual quality of the beer - makes it feel more unrefined and 'crafty'. Besides that, I find myself brewing mostly APAs and IPAs now, and dry hopping the bejezus out of them, so true brightness is difficult to achieve.

The correlation between chill haze and shelf life is of course another matter entirely....

 

[manticle]

Main reason for the original post is understanding process.

That said if there's stuff making the beer cloudy, it's likely to have an effect on something important like flavour. That may be a good thing as in yeast in a hefe, or hop oils in an AIPA or it may be a bad thing (as in starch haze) - obviously depending on style, personal preference etc.

 

[TidalPete]

G'day Pete
I have had a kilo of this stuff for well over a year and it is a bloody brilliant product. As for the use by date from personal experience mine is as good as the day I opened the pack. I believe the manufacturer has now deleted the use by date from the product. Whatever grainbill I have used this with the result is no chill haze and it is so easy to use. The only problem is obtaining it retailers dont seem interested in stocking it.

Don't suppose you could tell me where you got yours from & how much per kilo? If you don't want the world to know a PM will do.

T

 

[JonnyAnchovy]

OP is actually a really good question. I recon a lot of us harbor a desire to eliminate as many additives as possible and make the most 'natural' beer we can.

 

[Nick JD]

There's a reason commercial breweries remove the crud from their beers by filtration ... it makes the shelf life short.

 

[haysie]

There's a reason commercial breweries remove the crud from their beers by filtration ... it makes the shelf life short.

Come in spinner " Whys that Nick?"