What Is The Next Step Up From K&k?

[Mantis]

Where ya getting ya US05 for $2?

Bought a 500g pack from Ross

 

[Jase71]

Don't you AG guys get someone to grow and roast the grain for you???

Surely you don't have total control???

You mean all-grain brewing (or should I have just said 'brewing', being that AG is the only way) isn't about controlling everything ? While it's a bit much to ask that people grow their own barley, why not self germinate grains at home, then roast to one's own idiosyncratic own specifications ? Without doing so, it would seem that the most critical parts are already done ! And I would hope that hand milling with a mortar & pestle is de rigueur, electric mills seems like cheating to me, for it takes so much of the precious experience away........

Finners, watch out that you don't flare up your hayfever with all that fine malt powder either. Not only is extract brewing CRAP, it's also a health hazard.

Are we helping the original poster out in this thread ? He hasn't chimed in since it got tasty.

 

[Jase71]

I love drinking a good beer, no matter how it's made. One of the best APAs I've had was made by a former member of my local club and it was extract, crystal and hops. It came second in NSW 2007, iirc, and deservedly.

Was that the same year as a kit beer won the Nationals ?

 

[Katherine]

I use a mortal and pestle for my acidulated malt... I have not got a grain mill so I have to do a weekly shop to my LBS.... I have a bag of acidulated malt that a kindly retailer on this site gave to me....

That 10 minutes with my mortal and pestle gives me the feeling of power... I feel that I could control the world.... :icon_cheers:

 

[Barley Belly]

Don't put words in my mouth. Where did I say "total" control? No, the farmer grows the seed, the maltster malts the seed and I mash the seed that I want in the beer I am brewing. Much more choice of grain than there is of extract, and many many different things can be done with things like water profiles, mash temperature and duration, runoff speed, milling gaps, etc etc etc.

Of course there are plenty of things extract and minimashers can do with their fermentable bill. Hell, I brewed that way for years myself and made some great beers, but believe it or not, the best compliment I got for one of my beers was "you can't taste the extract!" I don't regret going AG and I recommend anyone with even a hint of curiousity to check it out. The results are brilliant and the process can be a lot of fun (yes, as no doubt it is with even kits and bits).

To be frank and to put the arguments aimed at me at rest, I love drinking a good beer, no matter how it's made. One of the best APAs I've had was made by a former member of my local club and it was extract, crystal and hops. It came second in NSW 2007, iirc, and deservedly.

I am not sure where I got the total control thing from, my mistake

and I thought because you said "The infusion part has just been done for you by Coopers or Bintani or whoever."
that you must grow the seed, and you malt the seed

my mistake again

 

[PostModern]

Was that the same year as a kit beer won the Nationals ?

I believe a kit did win


























Once.

 

[Pollux]

Okay, someone has to say it....Actually I think someone has, but no-one seemed to get it.....


Everyone has their own limits in terms of time, skills and budget.

I started in HBing to save costs on drinking commercial, and for a while I made kits with Coopers BE1, and I thought they were great, and hell, I made it...
Then I started to add LDME, and that was even more shit hot...
Then I added some hops, made the previous ones seem crap..
Then I started to steep grain, that was even tastier, even out of the fermenter.
And currently I have my first all extract in the fermenter, it tastes great too....


The moral is, people tend to brew for themselves, if they are happy with what they are making, or perhaps want to tweak it a little, than that's great news, more power to them.

But the number of AG and extract/Kit+Bit/K+K fanboys is beyond pathetic...Last time I checked this was a forum for beer production, which would mean everyone SHOULD be over 18....



After sitting back and reading this entire thread, I have to question that about some of the members who have posted....


To put it simply, everyone sit back, have a beer that you made and enjoy, and let everyone else be....

 

[Fermented]

You're lucky to have a good gas stove. My electric one did not really appreciate trying to get the wort to the boil in my first few AGs. It's more the boil off of liquids than the smell. Boiling off several litres of water can lead to a bit of condensation. B)

Am a fresh air freak so the windows are open all year round, plus the laundry is adjacent and the window is open there. I just close the door when I am cooking stuff that needs reducing or long cooking (>6hrs) so that I don't get grief from the missus about condensation/oil/chilli smoke condensing on the chandelier in the dining room.

Still, I think AG in any apartment (unless you have a 500 square metre penthouse with gardens!) is a bit ambitious.

Cheers - Fermented.

 

[Jase71]

Pollux, I think we're all at a point now where a sense of humour is the most important requirement.

 

[PostModern]

Everyone has their own limits in terms of time, skills and budget.

Indeed.

After sitting back and reading this entire thread, I have to question that about some of the members who have posted....
To put it simply, everyone sit back, have a beer that you made and enjoy, and let everyone else be....

Nothing like a bit of harmless flame war. Chillax, dude.

 

[Katherine]

It's very funny to read!

The post's just got misinterpted as usual as there is no facial expressions! No AG' r has bagged out K&K....

 

[Pollux]

Nothing like a bit of harmless flame war. Chillax, dude.

I'm chilled, it just seems all this crap isn't really helping the poor guy who asked the question, and I fear he has just vanished now and will continue to make beer he isn't quite happy with, then give up and go back to megaswill......

 

[jonocarroll]

Nothing like a bit of harmless flame war. Chillax, dude.

1. Add water to HLT
2. Place AHB forum responses under HLT to boil water instantly
3. ???
4. Profit!

:super:

 

[Katherine]

Pollux, I think we're all at a point now where a sense of humour is the most important requirement.

Totally and a little less EGO!!!!!!

 

[Mantis]

I'm chilled, it just seems all this crap isn't really helping the poor guy who asked the question, and I fear he has just vanished now and will continue to make beer he isn't quite happy with, then give up and go back to megaswill......

I hope he has printed out Thirsty's document and given up on this thread h34r:

 

[Fermented]

1. Add water to HLT
2. Place AHB forum responses under HLT to boil water instantly
3. ???
4. Profit!

I sense a /b/tard in our midst.

Cheers - Fermented.

 

[buttersd70]

snip......then roast to one's own idiosyncratic own specifications

Jase, some of us do roast our own grain. I don't go as far as germination, but I do roast to my own 'idiosyncratic specifications'.....I've stayed out of the argument thus far, because I have a strong sense of wanting to help people advance their brewing (as I was helped early on), and try not to get into this type of argument, preferring encouragement over accusation and counter accusation, as I'm sure you know.....

I'm nowhere near as one-eyed as some AG brewers, probably because I did the kit to extract to grain journey....some will refuse to even try kit beers...some go further, and refuse to try extracts, or even partials....I keep an open mind on such things. But when push comes to shove......it was said earlier by someone in this thread that thier worst AG was better than their best extract. I would have to agree with that. As far as "brewed to style", "competition winning beers", "BJCP guidlines"....thats all bollocks imho. What counts is taste. My best beer, ever, that I brewed was a partial. But my absolute best extract (with specialty grains) was just a shadow to my worst failure in AG brewing. For me it is the passion, the dedication, the determination, and the ability to think outside the box....it's the pursuit of perfection. What control do I want? As much as I can possibly get. I can force an AG beer to low apparent attenuation of only 50%, even with a 'high attenuating' yeast, if I want to.....theres no way I can do that with extract and specialty malt alone.

I'm not trying to bag Extract brewing, in any way shape or form. It gives a much better result than kits and bits, which in turn gives a much better result than kits and kilo......but its not a shade on partial, or AG brewing, done in the hands of someone with experience, passion and vision.

Sorry to rant, mate....I like you, you know that....but I think you pushed your point a bit far. Sorry.

edit...no less than 7 posts have gone up since I started typing this......

Hopefully the OP is reading this entire thread, picking out the gems, and throwing out the crap.

 

[Jase71]

No AG' r has bagged out K&K....

Really..... then my PC's playing silly buggers, as I swore I read the following statements:

"The thought of drinking kit beer on a regular basis makes me dry reach"

"K&K/Extract is just not brewing. You aren't brewing anything."

As for the direction of this topic, let's think if it was transposed to a round-table at the pub, where we're all chatting away, and let's face it, taking the piss out of each other in a jovial tone that is the norm in many an Aussie pub environment (unless it's one of those fancy bloody boutique pubs). It wouldn't seem out of place at all, would it ? Unless of course there's a sensitive type among us, then we'd all have to walk on eggshells so as not to upset any notions of social sensibilities.

Fact is, kits & extracts ROCK. See 2007's fabled National Winner ! :lol: (Ok, Ive now got all the mileage out of that little fact, so I'll stop now)

 

[brendo]

make beer... not war :beer:

 

[Katherine]

It wouldn't seem out of place at all, would it ? Unless of course there's a sensitive type among us, then we'd all have to walk on eggshells so as not to upset any notions of social sensibilities.

I think there is a little bit of "sensitive type" in us all hey Jase.......