What Is That Aagh Taste?

[PistolPatch]

Is there a prize here for anyone that can read so much and still brew really bad beers after 4 months? (And I thought I was a quick learner!)

What I'm getting is that Aagh! taste on the first half a middy. After that, the beer is drinkable but I assure you, we are not talking Pilsner Urquell. In fact, I only drink it when I have to. At least I am consistent!

After spending $1,500 or so and very high levels of concentration, I am ready for a good beer! I have no knowledgable LHBS that I am aware of here (one guy actually thought my beer was great!) so I was wondering if there are any AHB'ers on the Gold Coast who can taste my beer? Or, if not, is there some way I can send my beer to someone who can have a taste? (I only keg but am sure I can put together an accurate bottle using my $120 beer bottler!) And, if you come up with the answer I will put you in my will.

I think I'm at the stage where I really need the above as I'm absolutely sure I have the basics of sanitation, temperature and ingredients right - very meticulous in these areas so I don't think any advice on these aspects will yield any results unfortunately.

Is there anyone close that can help? If not, see the For Sale section in the next few days. (Just joking. I am determined to brew beer that is at the very least, swillable.)

Relevant info:...

Live in Southport
Have been doing various Kit with Kilo of quality ingredients
Have been hopping (maybe too much?)
Have been boiling
Have been aerating
Fermentations done consistently at 18, 20 or 22 degrees
Have tried Safale
Have done 1 wk primary, 1 wk secondary, and anywhere from 2-9 wks CC

Finally have also done some wrong things in earlier brews but still that AAgh taste prevails. I know it points to infection but as I said, have been meticulous in this area.

Anxioulsy awaiting...

PP

 

[johnno]

PP,
Just enter them in comps.
You will get feedback from the judges.


johnno

 

[ozbrewer]

if your doing kits i dare say the tase is a common kit/extract tang, and there ARE ways of getting rid of it


Im on the north side (deception bay) if you want to come up for a drive, if not drop a bottle in the post and i will have a taste

 

[delboy]

i have the same problem what is it ??

lets send each other some pet bottels and have a comparrions i am sure it is a kit thing .
but before i go out and get broke i think i will invest in a fermentation fridge set up to try and keep the temps steady .

might do a PH test on the water too and total alklinity ??

using the local pool shop water test gear so i know whats going on with the water .

delboy

 

[PistolPatch]

Johnno! You have seriously cracked me up! If any of the judges actually die from my beer, am I legally responsible? I should submit one just for fun though. God knows what I should submit the beer as! (I have just had this horrible feeling that your suggestion may have been serious. Please set me right. Home brewers don't really send crap beers into competitions do they? If so, how many judges are dead?)

Oz. Thanks heaps. Just had a look at my map and unfortunately I never get to do my jobs very far away from here. You have me absolutely fascinated though when you say that there ARE ways of geting rid of it. Please let me in on this secret. If your secret is not BC (like Politically Correct but for Brewers) please PM me.

As for sending a bottle through the post, I didn't realise you could do that although a slight pause in my thinking may have revealed the obvious!

Oz, I hate to see you being an unneccessary victim of my home brew but I feel that I may have to take you up on your offer of posting you a bottle so will send a PM tomorrow requesting your address and all other personal details so that if you die whilst tasting, all my worldy assetts will be transferred to your estate. Seriously though, many thanks for the offer which, unfortunatley for you, I think I will be taking up.

Thanks very much Johnno and Oz.

Cheers
PP

 

[vlbaby]

PP,
are you brewing AG or extract or kit? I assume your brewing AG since you've spent $1500 on your brewing already.

VL.

 

[agro]

The Gold Coast...

It could well be the water. Could you post details on your process, I'm sure there are a lot of people here who would like to help. For that matter there must be somebody else on the Gold Coast.

Agro.

 

[peas_and_corn]

It could very well be the water... I buy 5L bottles of BiLo water and use that... plus afterwards I use the empty bottles to mix my iodophor in, which is handy.

 

[PistolPatch]

Hi there Delboy!

Didn't see your post until after I wrote my last. Great, in a way, to see someone else experiencing similiar problems. Before you go to a whole lot of time and trouble, let's see what the guys here come up with.

I was going to say don't worry about PH etc, but what do I know? Maybe it's something as simple, yet obscure as that?

The only advice I can offer now re temp control is to search my posts specifically looking for '100 Can Cooler'*. Very simple and very controlled and will cost a total of $30 (I actually think it's $20!)

Cheers PP

*For those that enjoy laughing at other's inexperience...

Four months ago when I re-commenced brewing, I had my fermenter sitting in my laundry tub with about five 750ml freezer blocks which I had to alternate as often as able (temps achieved being 24-28!). Then, clever as I thought I was, I thought, get a pond pump to pump the cool water over the top of the fermenter! No difference! And I had to go back twice to the shop to get a capable pnd pump. Final answer was the 100 Can Cooler idea which I ended up getting from here! So many weeks and so many dollars wasted.

By the way, to hijack my own topic, if the above rings a few bells, please take the time to read the link below. There hasn't been too much feedback on the suggestion I made there but if anyone can relate to the above then I'm sure they may be able to add some weight to the suggestion. If bored, please look here and write something that makes a little more sense that what I may have written. Cheers and thanks.

 

[PistolPatch]

My goodness guys, didn't realise there would be such an immediate response! Am also now forumming under the influence so will do my best to answer/or address the above.

VLbaby - Just extract VL. As for the money, here's as best as I can remeber some of the things I bought! $1,500 spent on 2 Bratt Brew kegs, general keg set-up, freezer conversion, freezer, 6 cubes, gas rental/hire, water filter, three to four hundred on unnecesarry things because I didn't know better and a few hundred on ingredients. Add $150 for spray paint as I had to make my fridge presentable as I'm in a one bedroom apartment! (Yes, I could have done that for next to nothing as I can actually do two-pack but alas I have no facilities here. It does look good though!) Stainless steel pots etc. And this is before Ihave even attempted AG! But VL, now I am a little older and have a little more spare cash, all is joy!

But, I hope we can help others to not have to spend so much. It all adds up very quickly.

Agro and Peas - Both of you mentioned the water which is an interesting coincidence which I certainly wouldn't have thought of. Unfortunatley, I'm going to confound you! I use a water filter and every bit of water that goes into my brew goes through that. Sorry guys but I certainly like the way you're thinking!

Really appreciate your feedback guys. As you can imagine, it can be a little dissappointing that after 4 months I still am unable to brew a decent beer!

 

[Jagungal]

I get more of a ummmm in my brews, rather than the ahhhhhhh. Sometimes it is a bit of both though, ummm at first .. then ahhh as it goes down quickly followed by NEXT !!.

Maybe you could think about doing a Fresh Wort Kit. That would allow you to compare and see if the taste is coming from the Kits you use or something else that your are doing.

I mainly do ESB Fresh Wort Kits and Full Malt kits (ESB 3KG and CB WetPak) - The fresh wort kits seem to be better, but this could also be the styles I have done with Fresh Wort Kits.

Entering in a comp with good feedback is a good idea if they are available, I have been given the same advice to try and get reasonable feedback on brews. I would not worry too much if you are doing K&K, from the smaller show comps I have seen, they are very common.

 

[vlbaby]

PP,
why dont you give AG a try. I must admit i have never done extract ,as i jumped to AG straight from kits, but I was never happy with the results that kits provided even the expensive ones.
If you got all the extract gear, your only an esky and a copper manifold away from AG anyway. I definately recommend you give it a try to compare at least.

Sorry if you've heard this rant before, and no offence to kits brewers or extract intended.

VL.

 

[Trent]

PP
I agree with VL and maybe you should give AG a crack. I have found, in my experience only, that extract and kits leave a real "home brew" taste, that I personally dont like. I must admit though, my first attempt at AG was also my first attempt at using liquid yeast, and now the "homebrew" taste is long gone. I have only used safale once, S33, and I found it left so much residual sweetness in my AG brew, that it has a faint tang of being an extract. One experience only, that is, so maybe I could be wrong. I would suggest then that you try using liquid yeast for a few brews, it could make all the difference in the world.
All the best
Trent

 

[Jagungal]

Another thing to do if you don't have the time or $$ to get into AG right now is to try some of the Fresh Wort Kits. It would be interesting to see the difference you might get from them. I do a few Fresh Wort Kits as well as the full malt kits and they all seem to come out quite good.

Fresh yeast is good as well and if you split it right, it is not that costly.

 

[Hopeye]

What I'm getting is that Aagh! taste on the first half a middy. After that, the beer is drinkable but I assure you, we are not talking Pilsner Urquell. In fact, I only drink it when I have to. At least I am consistent!

Have been doing various Kit with Kilo of quality ingredients
Have been hopping (maybe too much?)
Have been boiling
Have been aerating
Fermentations done consistently at 18, 20 or 22 degrees
Have tried Safale
Have done 1 wk primary, 1 wk secondary, and anywhere from 2-9 wks CC

[post="112574"][/post]​

PP,

I noticed that your ferment temp is consistent 18-22 degrees, you also mentioned Pilsner Urquell. Are you brewing lagers at this temp ??? That could be your problem.

Cheers,

 

[vlbaby]

PP
I agree with VL and maybe you should give AG a crack. I have found, in my experience only, that extract and kits leave a real "home brew" taste, that I personally dont like. I must admit though, my first attempt at AG was also my first attempt at using liquid yeast, and now the "homebrew" taste is long gone. I have only used safale once, S33, and I found it left so much residual sweetness in my AG brew, that it has a faint tang of being an extract. One experience only, that is, so maybe I could be wrong. I would suggest then that you try using liquid yeast for a few brews, it could make all the difference in the world.
All the best
Trent

[post="112654"][/post]​

Dry yeast dont produce that "homebrew" taste trent. I still use dry yeast with great results ( mainly saflager w34/70 ).

VL.

 

[JSB]

PP,

I note serving temps can vary with my beers...to cold and they seem to be more bitter at the front end....and sightly warmer ales more balanced...just my 2c....

Cheers
JSB

 

[Batz]

Could it be yeast bite?

You maybe leaving the wort to long in the fermenter after fermentation is finished.
Try racking

Batz

PS. You can smell yeast bite as well,smells same as the ARR! taste

 

[stephen]

PP,
why dont you give AG a try. I must admit i have never done extract ,as i jumped to AG straight from kits, but I was never happy with the results that kits provided even the expensive ones.
If you got all the extract gear, your only an esky and a copper manifold away from AG anyway. I definately recommend you give it a try to compare at least.

So if you've heard this rant before, and no offence to kits brewers or extract intended.

VL.

[post="112649"][/post]​

I totally concur with this. Go down the AG path - you know want to!!! The worst you can do is make good beer - the best is great beer.

As for your "Aagh" taste, I've found that kit beers do that. I do both AG and kits (occasionally) and find that the kits will leave you with that taste. I also keg and bottle (does this make me bisexual in the brewing world?) and have found that even after leaving a kit beer in the bottle for several months, it still has that "taste."

Listen to your inner self "Do the all grain..."

Steve

 

[PistolPatch]

Thanks everyone for the above and PM's. Have to go out for most of the day so will reply to the above (briefly!) and the PM's later today. Thanks again.