Using The Fresh Yeast Rich Krausen To Start A New Batch

[Nick JD]

I've never top cropped, but I have often "bottom cropped" from an active fermenter.

I just give the fermenter a bit of a swirl and a jiggle - and then pour a cup 'o sludge from the tap.

Whack this cup into the other fermenter. Works a treat and there's no opening the lid.

 

[bullsneck]

Anyone ever top cropped using 1272 (American Ale II)? I know it similar to 1056, but according to Wyeast, it is more flocculent. Does that make it better for top cropping?

 

[Pete2501]

I like it. I just read this post and will have to give this a go for sure.

 

[phinnsfotos]

I like it. I just read this post and will have to give this a go for sure.

I was just thinking the same thing. Except I've got a wheat beer yeast (WB-06) going right now and my LHBS guy said not to re-pitch wheat yeasts. Something about loosing out on esters. Not to mention I'll have two wheaties conditioning and it's probably time for something else.

 

[Pete2501]

Sounds like a yeast health thing to me. Esters are made when yeast eats sugars no?

Top cropping after reading this post seems to be the best way to farm healthy yeast.

edit: spelking

 

[manticle]

I've top cropped 3068 before. Yet to use it again but I have the slurry in my brew fridge. I'd be surprised if the above were the case.

 

[avaneyk]

I've top cropped 3068 before. Yet to use it again but I have the slurry in my brew fridge. I'd be surprised if the above were the case.

Hi Manticle - when you top cropped the 3068 did you just store it under water or did you make a starter with it and store that. Also, any recommendations about the best time to crop it. I've got a batch of dunkel weizen fermenting with 3068 that I put down on Saturday - first time using a liquid yeast so I pitched straight from the pack (to see how it goes before going to the effort of cultivating it). But after seeing this thread I'm thinking about skimming it to store some of this yeast for later.

Cheers,
Andrew

 

[manticle]

When I top crop I store in sanitised longnecks and fill about halfway with cooled boiled water. Sealed and in the fridge till ready to use then out of the fridge to warm to room temperature and make a starter with some DME. The great thing about top cropping is that the yeast is very fresh and healthy. I don't want to exhaust it by making it 2nd gen and feeding it malt just to store it (also using water and forgetting is way easier than buggering around with a starter only to have to make another starter later).

Unless I need to step up or have a very high gravity wort, I normally pitch my whole starter as soon as krausen appears. The ones I've made from top cropped yeast have always kicked off like a crazy scuba diver.

Best time to top crop is high krausen - I've read you should avoid the scungy bits and go for the white creamy stuff - myself I don't get too concerned - just scoop out as much as I need. However I do get concerned about sanitation - your cropping utensil should be well cleaned and sanitised as should your storing vessel and plastic funnel (that and pouring the boiled water are best things for getting the yeast in the longneck).

Not saying the above is the only way or even the best way - just the way I've done it several times and it's worked very well for me.

I'm keeping the 3068 for a planned dunkelweizen.

 

[benno1973]

I've top cropped 3068 before. Yet to use it again but I have the slurry in my brew fridge. I'd be surprised if the above were the case.

Maybe the LHBS guy was referring to pitching a new brew straight onto the yeast cake of the old brew? Too much yeast and you'd lose out on esters, but if you just top crop I'm sure it would be fine,

 

[Pete2501]

Maybe the LHBS guy was referring to pitching a new brew straight onto the yeast cake of the old brew? Too much yeast and you'd lose out on esters, but if you just top crop I'm sure it would be fine,

Some people suggest under pitching to achieve flavour. <_<

 

[manticle]

Some people suggest under pitching to achieve flavour.

I don't subscribe to that. I think treat a wheat as I'd treat any other brew except ferment slightly cooler (around 17) and let the yeast do its thing. I'm no expert on weizens, having only done one AG wheat and a couple of extract wheats before that but what I've read about traditional German methods suggests the same.

 

[benno1973]

I'd never suggest underpitching, but overpitching can be just as bad. Correct pitching rates (as the name would imply) would be the 'correct' option.

 

[manticle]

Agreed. Pitch the right amount not the wrong amount.

 

[Effect]

In BLAM the author talks with several microbrewers about pitching rates. A lot of them choose to underpitch...

 

[manticle]

Are they the brewers who make the original brews that the other brewers base their beers on (trappists) or the 'let's throw everything we have at a brew' brewers inspired by them?

My copy of BLAM is currently on loan so I can't see for myself.

 

[bullsneck]

Anyone ever top cropped using 1272 (American Ale II)? I know it similar to 1056, but according to Wyeast, it is more flocculent. Does that make it better for top cropping?

bump

 

[goomboogo]

In BLAM the author talks with several microbrewers about pitching rates. A lot of them choose to underpitch...

A lot of people talk about under-pitching when they really mean pitching on the low end of the acceptable range.

 

[rendo]

anyone want to give me the short and dirty on what happens if you over pitch??

Agreed. Pitch the right amount not the wrong amount.

 

[simon.sillitoe]

anyone want to give me the short and dirty on what happens if you over pitch??

I can't say much as to what happens to the beer, haven't gotten that far yet. But I assure you overpitching is "dirty". lol.

Well... I dunno if it actually counts as overpitching, but with my latest batch I decided to reuse yeast for the first time. Easiest method - straight onto the yeast cake of the previous batch. Within 8 hours krausen was spewing out the airlock. This is all at reasonable temperatures too (19C). For 3 days this continued...

In a way the system is self-regulating, as I estimate half of the yeast ended up outside the fermenter.

US05 btw.

Next time I think I'll scoop away at least half of the yeast cake.

 

[eamonnfoley]

I've never top cropped, but I have often "bottom cropped" from an active fermenter.

I just give the fermenter a bit of a swirl and a jiggle - and then pour a cup 'o sludge from the tap.

Whack this cup into the other fermenter. Works a treat and there's no opening the lid.

Are you collecting yeast that has already flocced while yeast is still in suspension fermenting the beer out? Probably not the best practice because its not a representative sample - you could possibly end up with your repitch not reaching FG because you have selected the most flocculant cells in the population. Try and collect a good cross section of your yeast cake after it has settled out. Unless you are top cropping - that yeast is the best of the best!