Pilsner - Hop Schedule

[matti]

+1

more than 90% of my beers are Pilseners and all the time I do only two additions: right after the hotbreak Im adding the bittering hops (just take the hops with its highest alpha acid) and 15min. before flameout Im adding the aromatic hops. Thats all.

Cheers :icon_cheers:

Sounds Like top advice to me.
Just ensure you have a nice smooth rolling boil
If it show a good cold break it is time for aroma hops.

Duff,

I've heard that Pilsner Urquell hasn't been brewed with all Saaz for a while now.
....+ I'd be totally amazed if Urquell gets its aroma from a physical hop addition, I strongly suspect the use of hop oil.


cheers Ross

Right on Ross.
Most commercial breweries use hop oils.

 

[gap]

Right on Ross.
Most commercial breweries use hop oils.

Please educate us further.

How do you know that most commercial breweries use hop oil. And please do not quote CUB or Lion Nathan.
They are only 2 of a large number of commercial breweries throughout the world.

Regards

Graeme

 

[bconnery]

Please educate us further.

How do you know that most commercial breweries use hop oil. And please do not quote CUB or Lion Nathan.
They are only 2 of a large number of commercial breweries throughout the world.

Regards

Graeme

Most is a bit of a stretch, but the numbers are far higher than you'd imagine.
I don't pretend to have all the facts on worldwide usage but I do know that Chimay is one, Paulaner I believe is another, and that's just two that someone who doesn't know a lot about the issue knows about.
Most of the big boys, your AB, Millers, Lion Nathan etc definitely do but their use is becoming more common amongst other breweries as well especially in light of recent issues with hop yields and shortages over recent years.

 

[hewy]

Guys,

I was lucky enough to do a brewery tour of urquell earlier this year. The tour guide reckons that the recipe is still the same, pils malt and saaz hops only. Drinking the beer fresh in CZ I noticed that it is a lot maltier than I remembered it being here - I havent bought any since I got back so can't confirm. I do rememebr there wasnt a great deal of hop aroma mainly malt.

Anyway not sure what chance you have of replicating PU as they malt their own grain and triple decoct...

I reckon for the above recipe use high % aa hops for bittering, doesnt really matter which - I have had good results from POR (not super alpha). Then add 30g (for 23l) 15min from flameout. That should produce a good beer.

Cheers
Hewy

 

[SJW]

I have been through a few micro brewery's and a few bigger ones both here and O/S and they all used real hops. I would not doubt that CUB and Lion Nathan would use hop oils but what they makew only just classes as Beer!

 

[Frank]

Another option would be to bitter with something else, if you have it, and save the B-Saaz for another pilsner.
B-Saaz makes a very nice pilsner on its own...

I have quite a few other hops in the freezer also. Might bitter with some Target, would like to be able to compare the different Saaz in different batches.

 

[drtomc]

I've just finished reading Brew Like a Monk, and it looks like more than one of the Trappist breweries use hop oils rather than fresh/pellets/etc. But then, their beers are not hop driven, so it seems to work for them.

T.

 

[gap]

I've just finished reading Brew Like a Monk, and it looks like more than one of the Trappist breweries use hop oils rather than fresh/pellets/etc. But then, their beers are not hop driven, so it seems to work for them.

T.

I also have just read Brew Like a Monk.
Can you name one , who admits in tne book, that they use hop oils.

Regards

Graeme

 

[drtomc]

I also have just read Brew Like a Monk.
Can you name one , who admits in tne book, that they use hop oils.

Certainly not without the book in front of me. I'll have to check when I get home. I could be wrong, but I was pretty sure that at least one of them changed a few years ago and no longer use whole hops.

T.

 

[THE DRUNK ARAB]

I have quite a few other hops in the freezer also. Might bitter with some Target, would like to be able to compare the different Saaz in different batches.

Boston, what other high alpha hops do you have aside from Target? It is a great hop in English Ales and the like but I would think it too aggresive in a Pils.

C&B
TDA

 

[Frank]

Boston, what other high alpha hops do you have aside from Target? It is a great hop in English Ales and the like but I would think it too aggresive in a Pils.
C&B
TDA

Other hops in the freezer are:
Cascade, Amarillo, Chinook, Nelson Sauvin, and Southern Cross.

 

[THE DRUNK ARAB]

If it were me I would use the Southern Cross as your bittering hop and one of your Saaz varieties for flavour and aroma.
I used Southern Cross in a CAP earlier this year and bittered to 28IBU, it certainly isn't harsh for a hop so high in AA.
That would be what I would do anyway. Good luck.

C&B
TDA

 

[moetman]

hmmm.... the final taste of a good Pilsener does not only depends on the hops flavours, it depends also on the mash schedule.

let me say it in short words: if youre going to produce a dry and crispy Pilsener, the hops flavours should not be masked by an overly malty wort.

Hi Zwickel, Could you tell me 'how' you achieve a wort that is not overly malty? Is it only through the hop schedule ? What kind of mash schedule do you need for a good crispy Pilsener?


Have been following this thread on the production of melanoidins:
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...showtopic=25554

Could an overly strong boil lead to an overly malty wort?

Regards

 

[Frank]

The final Hop Schedule was:
Southern Cross 15.9% AA, 60min, 20.1 IBU
Czech Saaz '07 4.0% AA, 20min, 11.0 IBU
Total 31.1 IBU

Fermenting for a week now, looking forward to the first taste.
Thanks for the advice.

 

[Zwickel]

Hi Zwickel, Could you tell me 'how' you achieve a wort that is not overly malty? Is it only through the hop schedule ? What kind of mash schedule do you need for a good crispy Pilsener?

sure I can tellya: as you know, the most of fermentable sugar is built by the beta amylase that has its peak at around 63C.
the more starch is converted by the beta amylase, the drier your beer becomes.

My mash schedule is as follows:
doing a protein rest for around 15 to 20min. at 52C, just to produce amino acids that is necessary for a healthy yeast grow
rest for 40 to 45min at 63C (beta amylase rest)
rest for 20 to 30min at 72C (alpha amylase rest)
rise the temp to 78C and mashout.

Could an overly strong boil lead to an overly malty wort?

No



Cheers :icon_cheers:

 

[stieger]

Hi,

Zwickel, curious about your mashing schedule? Is that a decoction or an infusion mash?

Also, what fermentation temps and times do you follow? Primary Fermentaion>Secondary Fermentation>Racking>Lagering.

The reason why i am asking is i am after a schedule that results in the least amount of esters as i am doing pilsners.

Cheers mate,

Ryan

 

[Hogan]

+1

more than 90% of my beers are Pilseners and all the time I do only two additions: right after the hotbreak Im adding the bittering hops (just take the hops with its highest alpha acid) and 15min. before flameout Im adding the aromatic hops. Thats all.

Cheers :icon_cheers:

Hi Zwickel - are you doing a 90 or 60 minute boil?

Cheers, Hoges.

 

[Zwickel]

gday mates,

Zwickel, curious about your mashing schedule? Is that a decoction or an infusion mash?

thats an infusion mash, you may have a look into the blog section, there you can see my equipment.

Also, what fermentation temps and times do you follow? Primary Fermentaion>Secondary Fermentation>Racking>Lagering

Im pitching the yeast at around 8 to 10C, leave it fermenting for 6 days at around 8C, then racking into kegs, leave it for another 3 days at 8C, then successive lower the temp until 0C is reached. Lagering for at least 4 weeks.

Hi Zwickel - are you doing a 90 or 60 minute boil?

Cheers, Hoges.

I do 90min boil all the time and all of my beers

Cheers :icon_cheers:

 

[Hogan]

Im pitching the yeast at around 8 to 10C, leave it fermenting for 6 days at around 8C, then racking into kegs, leave it for another 3 days at 8C, then successive lower the temp until 0C is reached. Lagering for at least 4 weeks.


I do 90min boil all the time and all of my beers

Cheers :icon_cheers:

Two queries here thanks Zwickel.


What yeast are you using that you can pitch at 8-10c and gets a final gravity of 1008 ?


So you are boiling your bittering hops for around 80 minutes.


Cheers, Hoges.

 

[kook]

What yeast are you using that you can pitch at 8-10c and gets a final gravity of 1008 ?

Although I can't speak for Zwickel, i'd suspect that this has more to do with pitching rates than the strain itself. Zwickel has posted pictures of huge yeast slurries in the past (Link).