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andy@67

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G'day All,

Great forum you have here.

Just laid down my first brew, a Lager, and I have a few questions (please forgive me if they have been asked before). I used a Black Rock Lager kit + 500g Light DME + 1kg Brew Enhancer #60 with saflager S-23 yeast.

I really struggled to get the temp of the wort down to pitching temp, the best I could do was 28C after an hour (next time I will pre cool some water), so I pitched my rehydrated S-23 yeast at that. The brew is now in a temperature controlled freezer at 11C (it took about 7 hours to get down to 11C). While the airlock is not bubbling very much there is some krausen forming on top of the wort after 20 odd hours (I can see this through the lid of the fermenter).

My first question is how long can I leave the yeast, after rehydrating, it before it starts to die? (I got a little worried about mine after about 30 minutes, so I threw 1/4 cup of the cooling wort into the rehydrating mixture).

My second question is how long can I spend cooling the wort down before the risks start to become unacceptable?

My third question is because I have pitched at 28C will I have to do a diacetyl rest, and if I do what temp (I was thinking 14-15C)?

Thanks for your help.

Regards,

Andrew.

Edited to correct my poor spelling!!
 

Logman

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Hey Andy. Good to see you've got temp control on your first brew - was a long while before I knew about that BITD :unsure:

Here's the S23 blurb, you're not far off -
Re-hydrate the dry yeast into yeast cream in a stirred vessel prior to pitching. Sprinkle the dry yeast in 10 times its own weight of sterile water or wort at 23C ± 3C. Once the expected weight of dry yeast is reconstituted into cream by this method (this takes about 15 to 30 minutes), maintain a gentle stirring for another 30 minutes. Then pitch the resultant cream into the fermentation vessel.

Recommended fermentation temperature: 9C – 15C, ideally 12C.
When I did K&K I used to keep a small cleaned and sanitized Tupperware of frozen boiled water in the freezer to throw into the wort if it was too hot, not a bad idea. Throw a cup of boiling water in it to loosen it from the container and get it thawing out. From what you said there it sounds like your beer will be fine.
 

dicko

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With krausen forming it indicates all is going well.

With dried yeast you didnt need to rehydrate it until your wort was at pitching temp, about 30 minutes is what is recommended for hydration to take place. I don't know what damage, if any will occur to rehydrated yeast if it is left for an extended period. I would assume that if all is sanitised during preparation then you may get away with a few hours.

Lots of brewers cool the wort overnite to lager pitching temps without problems, again the factor is sanitation.

Pitching at a high temp then cooling is OK although most recommend that the wort and the yeast are at the same temps for optimum yeast health.
With s23 it will depend on a lot of factors as to wether you will do a diacetyl rest. This yeast can create a rotten egg gas smell during fermentation, especially if the pitching rate is low.
If this is the case I would rack the beer to a secondary container at the completion of fermentation and do the diacetyl rest and then lager it for an extended time to let the smells dissapate.

There are so many variables with lager brewing to quote exact procedures with what you are doing.

There is one other thing I may mention is that many on here will chastise you severley for calling a Lager a "Larger" :lol: ;)

Welcome to the forum and good luck with your brew,
 

andy@67

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G'day,

Thanks for the quick replies.

I actually found that blurb on the S-23 website as well, although I missed the ideal temp of 12C. I got worried it might die after about 30 minutes past the one hour in the instructions (I rehydrated it too early), and that is when I threw some wort in.

The temp controller is a plug and play one from my LHBS cost $69 and does both cooling and heating (switches automatically)

My bad on the Lager/ Larger thing, I did know that so it might just be my typing skills. Although now that I reread my post I see that I made that mistake repeatedly. I have edited it to be correct now.



Thanks again.

Regards,

Andrew.
 

andy@67

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Hey All,

Day 4 and SG is at 1.032, OG was 1.044 so 12 points in 4 days. Had a taste tasted like slightly sweet flat beer, with maybe a hint of ginger, no sulphur or apple notes at all, and the finish is quite bitter. The sample I took had quite a lot of gas in it, I had to wait a good few minutes for the head to dissipate so I could read the hydrometer.

I assume that both the sweetness and the bitterness will retreat as the brew progresses (I also guess the sweetness comes from the unfermented sugars).

Cheers,

Andrew.
 

jaypes

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Sweetness yes
Bitterness possibly, dependant on the kit

Let the brew finish fermenting before you test/sample. I dont even look at my brews before 10 days (all right I admit to a bit of airlock sniffing - but thats it!)

IMHO Black Rock Kits are pretty good and benefit when used with LME. You seem to have a good grasp of it anyway.

If it tastes good out of the fermenter then you can be pretty safe you have made a good beer that will get better with correct storing/ageing
 

andy@67

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Thanks jaypes,

I just wanted to know where it was up to. Prolly a week or so to go before FG is reached. I was a little worried about getting sulphur smells as I've heard S23 can give those, and I pitched hot at 28C. But those notes have not happened as of yet.


Cheers,

Andrew
 

Thefatdoghead

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Some Lager yeast give off a sulphur aroma so no need to worry about that. It is better to start fermentation with lager yeast at around 7-10 degrees so the yeast doesn't throw out to many volatiles. Pitching at 28 degrees isn't ideal but you'll end up with beer. At the end of the day beer is the same as food., The fresher the ingredients the better the beer.
 

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