Need help in getting more hop aroma

[kunfaced]

Is it alright to keg hop when bulk priming? I've never left dry hops in that long at room temp before.

 

[Danscraftbeer]

Locked in the keg is my thought. Maybe I've just gotten desensitized to the smell but I don't think so. When its the first green beers from the keg its grassy taste but aromatic is great. Then it conditions (over a week) to nice looking but the smell dissipates. Where does it go?

This just makes me plan better for my home grown hops actually. I'm going to dedicate all my home grown hops for wet hopping only. (as substitute for dry hopping).

 

[Danscraftbeer]

Is it alright to keg hop when bulk priming? I've never left dry hops in that long at room temp before.

I would try that experiment if I had another keg to play with. I'm sure its been done before.

 

[Killer Brew]

https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/attachments/0000/1249/MJzym06_LateHops.pdf

Link to an article on late hopping from Jamil Zanisheff of the Brewing Network.

 

[Ciderman]

+1 for late hopping. One 100g addition in the 5-10minute spectrum will give a nice hoppy beer around 30-40ibu depending on varieties used.

 

[Yob]

I've never left dry hops in that long at room temp before.

Try it.

Wouldn't do it at bulk priming stage

 

[Ben1]

Great feedback guys. Unfortunately because I no chill I'm limited from doing 10, 5, 0 min additions etc. I'll ditch the horizon @ 40 and do all cube hops. I'll keep the same amount of fermenter dry hops but move them a bit later and put in one addition. I'll then add some more to the keg and see how it goes.

Cheers guys

 

[WitWonder]

Aroma isn't correlated to AA%

Really? So a high AA hop adds the same aroma as a lower AA hop?? Who knew I've been doing it all wrong all these years!! I should be using tonnes of saaz late in the boil to get the aroma I want!! :unsure:

 

[Yob]

Oil content isn't necessarily related to %AA and certainly isn't linear

 

[Bribie G]

Originally all hops were low AA. Then when the big brewers started swallowing up the locals after the Second WW the accountants took over the show and huge breeding programs developed high alpha hops such as Target and POR.

Alongside these were new Dual Purpose hops that are both high alpha and high aroma such as Challenger.
Then the Yankees got in on the act with Cascadia grown varieties for the new pale ales.

So it's a smorgasbord nowadays but no correlation between AA and aroma. Good example is German Magnum that is the second highest tonnage grown in Germany but going on the aromas of most German mainstreams you wouldn't pick it.

 

[S.E]

Great feedback guys. Unfortunately because I no chill I'm limited from doing 10, 5, 0 min additions etc. I'll ditch the horizon @ 40 and do all cube hops. I'll keep the same amount of fermenter dry hops but move them a bit later and put in one addition. I'll then add some more to the keg and see how it goes.

Cheers guys

You could also try fermenting, carbing and conditioning in a cube to keep the hop aroma from dissipating into the headspace of your fermenter and out through the air lock or gladwrap while you are cold crashing.

I have had great results splitting batches and fermenting half in an un sealed fermenter and the other half in a cube and sealing it after 3 or 4 days as soon as fermentation is finished or near enough finished.

Your beer will also clear and condition faster under pressure and be pre carbed before kegging so ready for consumption sooner.

If you put your dry hops in all in one go rather than a second addition a few days later I think it should help preserve more aroma from your late hops and first dry hop addition. When you add dry hops they throw co2 out of solution carrying some hop aroma from the earlier additions with it.

I posted pictures of cube fermenting, carbing and conditioning in post #52 in this thread http://aussiehomebrewer.com/topic/70056-carbingconditioning-in-a-cube-before-keg/page-3 .

The first time I tried I wasn’t sure if the noticeable difference was because I may have chilled the cube before the rest of the batch but have tried since by chilling the whole batch in to the fermenter first the drawing off a cube to ferment separately and seal asap.

 

[Blind Dog]

When you cube hop, fill up with wort first then add the hops and seal it up tight. It might just all be in my mind, but the last few I've done that way seem to have improved hop aroma over previous iterations of the same beer. Idea is shamelessly stolen (maybe from Technobabble?)

 

[WitWonder]

Oil content isn't necessarily related to %AA and certainly isn't linear

I'd suggest it's pretty well correlated. Not that it's an exact science or anything; just saying based on personal experience. :drinks:
Maybe it's just me but if the hop smells pretty strongly, you can be fairly sure it's good for putting aroma in your beer. As it happens, those hops often are often also high AA hops and the hops people naturally associate with strong flavour/aroma.

 

[Yob]

warrior is a high AA hop... wouldnt use it for aroma though, all Im saying is one does not equal the other

 

[Dae Tripper]

I am not sure why some think the are limited to flameout additions with no chill. Many of my beers have -5 or -10min additions to the cube or left in the kettle to cool. I am planning a 10min IPA shortly which will be approx 200 grams into the cube at -10min. Great now my mouth is watering.

 

[mofox1]

I am not sure why some think the are limited to flameout additions with no chill. Many of my beers have -5 or -10min additions to the cube or left in the kettle to cool. I am planning a 10min IPA shortly which will be approx 200 grams into the cube at -10min. Great now my mouth is watering.

Aye.

I base it on kettle temp for repeatable results (batch size is anywhere between 16 to 70L). Let kettle cool to 80 - 85deg, add hops to cube and fill.

Big additions of heavy hitters like Simcoe, Topaz, etc will contribute huge flavour/aroma but not much in the way of bitterness because you are almost below isomerisation temps.

 

[Spiesy]

13% Munich 2 AND 13% Victory may also be obscuring your hops. That's a fair wack of malty malt malt.

 

[Jazzafish]

Hi everyone,

Apologies for the late chime in and few/far between posts on this forum...
Just confirming a couple of things that I have had general wins with (not scientific/triangle test) on my quest for more aroma when going into the cube over the years:

How old are your hops? Are they still good quality? I usually break up a pellet by rubbing in my hands. If my hands aren't sticky with resin and smelling close to how I want the beer, I question their purpose.

Are you adding any finnings after you dry hop? On a few batches where I had been happy with the aroma but wanted a bit more clarity in the presentation, I've added gelatine to the keg. Fixed the clarity but killed the hop aroma.

I'm not sure what the water profile of the brisbane water is, but I go for a 1 part chloride to 3 parts sulphates.

Ive also noticed following the mr malty pitching rate calculator has helped. I used to over pitch and I suspect the extra yeast scrubbed a bit out in both a faster/more active ferment via off gassing and also absorbing oils and floccing out? Side note... When the pitching rate was more aligned to the calculators specification, combined with the right water chemestry I havent needed to add finings so prob a combination of things.

Lastly, the faster I've chlled a cube, the better aroma I get. EG: I know a few people that seal the cubes and chuck them into their pools. Wish I had a pool.

All the other points previously mentioned of moving hops later also do the job.

Cheers and good luck

 

[Dae Tripper]

I forgot to mention my other trick is 4 grams of gypsum per 20 odd litre in the boil.

 

[Killer Brew]

Hi everyone,

Apologies for the late chime in and few/far between posts on this forum...
Just confirming a couple of things that I have had general wins with (not scientific/triangle test) on my quest for more aroma when going into the cube over the years:

How old are your hops? Are they still good quality? I usually break up a pellet by rubbing in my hands. If my hands aren't sticky with resin and smelling close to how I want the beer, I question their purpose.

Are you adding any finnings after you dry hop? On a few batches where I had been happy with the aroma but wanted a bit more clarity in the presentation, I've added gelatine to the keg. Fixed the clarity but killed the hop aroma.

I'm not sure what the water profile of the brisbane water is, but I go for a 1 part chloride to 3 parts sulphates.

Ive also noticed following the mr malty pitching rate calculator has helped. I used to over pitch and I suspect the extra yeast scrubbed a bit out in both a faster/more active ferment via off gassing and also absorbing oils and floccing out? Side note... When the pitching rate was more aligned to the calculators specification, combined with the right water chemestry I havent needed to add finings so prob a combination of things.

Lastly, the faster I've chlled a cube, the better aroma I get. EG: I know a few people that seal the cubes and chuck them into their pools. Wish I had a pool.

All the other points previously mentioned of moving hops later also do the job.

Cheers and good luck

Interesting point on the gelatine. Is there another fining that will clear the beer but not detract from the hoppy flavour or is it just a matter of using a longer cold crash instead?