March Pumps - The Situation

[browndog]

Well said Chappo, they deserve our patronage and respect!

-BD

 

[Leigh]

What some, not all ok so no need to go to town on me, do need to understand is profit is not a dirty little word. If I only made 8% profit in my business I would be broke and handing the keys to my house to the bank manager, 10 blokes would be unemployed, it's that bloody simple. Without profit where would the money come from to pay wages, rent, electricity, site sponsorship, new product lines, service, support etc?

Not wanting to be a pedant or anything (oh hang on a minute, I am going to be ), that 8% would be a MARK UP, profit is what is left AFTER paying all of those bills...

I hear what people are saying regarding BULK BUYS versus BULK ORDERS...you'd expect the latter to be slightly more expensive, but as long as the person quoting knows what they are quoting for, I see no issue with doing it either way...those that have done the latter without extra margin are doing an amazing service!

Anyways, better get back on topic lest this thread also be locked

'Tis great for suppliers to get on here and clear the air.

 

[chappo1970]

Not wanting to be a pedant or anything (oh hang on a minute, I am going to be ), that 8% would be a MARK UP, profit is what is left AFTER paying all of those bills...

Ed Zarachy Leigh!

IIRC my accountant once told me "my take" of the gross profit from the business was in the order of 1.5%. So say $20 gross profit, grossed me personally $0.30, which then I had to pay 45% income tax on. You risked all you have for 13.5c? Times that by 1000 widgets and that's a whooping $135. BTW he also told me I was mad and maybe driving buses would be more profitable :lol:

 

[Offline]

.... If Ross didn't have such a tight strangle hold on my wallet :lol: (and the misses and the kids <_< )....

i'm interested to know what type of a hold does Ross have on your wife and kids

 

[Supra-Jim]

i'm interested to know what type of a hold does Ross have on your wife and kids

I believe he traded them for part of his AG setup. Seemed simpler than asking the wife for permission!

:icon_cheers: SJ

 

[chappo1970]

I believe he traded them for part of his AG setup. Seemed simpler than asking the wife for permission!

:icon_cheers: SJ

Tis true! t'was a fair swap.

If she ever escapes I'm a dead man! h34r:

 

[grainandgrape]

Thanks to everyone for their kind words re the business today.

Life has been much more enjoyable since mid morning today.

Just to clarify, I am not claiming that I am making 8% or 14% on all products. Our average margin is a little under 30%. Generally, the more expensive the product, the lower the margin. The more handling, such as grain, especially when weighed & crushed, the higher the margin we have to build in.

For those who are interested, I calculate Margin (or more accurately Gross Profit Margin) as follows:

If I buy an item for $8 and sell it for $10 plus GST, that is a Gross Profit Margin of 20%. ie. 20% of the GST exclusive price is profit. The product would actually retail for $11 and $1 would go to the government. In reality I buy it for $8 plus GST of $0.80c. When I do my BAS at the end of the Quarter I have to send the difference between GST collected and GST paid. In this case I would be sending $0.20c. It really means something as I know that $2 is mine.

Exciting life I have isn't it.

Thanks for brightening up a dull boys day.

Cheers

John

 

[Supra-Jim]

Probably time we turned our attention back to our mash tuns, kettles and fermenters, and got back to the real reason we're all here, brewing the best beer we can!

:icon_cheers: SJ

 

[seravitae]

* i did not have any issues negociating with Karl or PP at all, my dealings with this were all of a professional nature, what jeddog said about me having difficulty was not the case. I issued reasons for all delays as Karl informed me in order to maintain professionality for the bulk buy.
* on that note, please note that many things occured "behind my back" during this bulk buy. It wasn't until proverbial sh*t hit the fan that I discovered other people were calling PP and getting quotes and all sorts of things. This didn't really help.


John, dispite your justifications unfortunately I feel the same about the sitatuion. Weeks ago i wanted a pump. I spent weeks arranging a pump. You (and possibly others) intercepted that deal and now I have wasted weeks of communication and organisation, and, i still don't have a pump, now it will take me even longer to get a pump and i will have to pay more than I was originally going to.

Please understand that business in a capitalistic environment doesn't run on hand holding and rainbows. It runs on different rules. Even the best of mates have to put their friendship aside when one steps behind the till and the other behind the counter. The buying power of many people in bulk was substantial enough to swamp the quantity of your business as you indicated by your usual stock. The force was actually larger than what your current capacity was, so really, you didn't muscle out one customer, or 10, you muscled out a "pseudo-business" that was in competition with large discounts for quantity, much greater than yours.

I don't mean any disrespect to you as a person, i'm sure you're a great guy, however this scenario as stated before, as a customer, *which is all I am*, has left me with a massive waste of time while you make profits. My time is currently worth approximately $60/hr, so instead of refunding a phone call to you, how about refunding the cumulative loss of time occured! I am sure had I wasted your equivilant time you would have a lot more to say.

In the *least*, since it was evident that a big deal was going down, you should have at *within reason* matched the price offered by PP for the bulk buy (excluding postage) as a favour to sealing the deal - and then used that to leverage extra sales, at least to support the "last private bulk buy on AHB", as its now obvious that this notion is practically destroyed, (at least for pumps). This is what i would have done as a business. Not because I'm being "nice", but because it preserves happiness for customers at negligable loss (and usually even profit) on your end.

So this is my last post on this topic unless someone starts paying me because I can't afford to discuss this anymore. I won't be answering any more comments for that reason, also because frankly, I still don't have a pump.
Maybe i'm being selfish. However, business is selfish too.

Fin.

 

[reg]

Perhaps the mods should lock this topic now.
All parties have had a say no need to leave it open any more..

:icon_cheers:

 

[MarkBastard]

No reason to close it either... It's the open nature of the way this has been handled that has made it a decent resolution.

sera, if your time is worth $60 an hour why be such a tight arse in the first place? Why not 'specialise' in your day job and leave brewing gear distribution to the 'experts' and walk into a shop and buy something at retail price. I've never really understood the need to spend hours of time to save $50, when that $50 you supposedly saved is a false economy when you look at advice / warranty / time involved, and you've taken that $50 out of the hands of the local home brew store that gives so much back.

Don't get me wrong I love bulk buys, mainly because they allow me to buy things I probably wouldn't consider buying usually.

 

[samhighley]

I spent weeks arranging a pump ... My time is currently worth approximately $60/hr

So, conservatively, at say 1 hour a day over 2 weeks, it cost you $840 worth of time to organise this bulk buy, to save yourself maybe $30.

Makes one wonder why you bothered in the first place?

 

[samhighley]

I guess the best thing to come of all of this is that we now have another retailer selling March pumps in Australia.

For the purposes of commerce, I think that makes the list (in alphabetical order):

• Beerbelly (linky)
• Craftbrewer (not yet available)
• Grain and Grape (linky)
• iBrew (linky)

Any i've missed?

 

[peas_and_corn]

When my check comes in I think I'll be paying a visit to Beerbelly!

 

[Paul H]

I wanna hear what Darren has to say about this.

 

[bugwan]

It's a worry that an internet forum can get so powerful. John has built a reputation over nearly 20 years in the industry (I've only been buying from him for 4 of those), so to see his reputation potentially damaged because of a few wayward posts is a shame.
Let's hope those with loose lips pick up their game before posting in the future...

 

[samhighley]

It's a worry that an internet forum can get so powerful.

No it's not. Some people expressed their opinions, and others were able to counter those opinions. In the end it seems that everyone has had an opportunity to air their views, and most people have formed an opinion based on a decent amount of fact. That is a good outcome in my opinion.

John has built a reputation over nearly 20 years in the industry (I've only been buying from him for 4 of those), so to see his reputation potentially damaged because of a few wayward posts is a shame.

I think John did an admirable job of defending his reputation.

Let's hope those with loose lips pick up their game before posting in the future...

Nah, i'd prefer the forum remains a free and frank exchange of views and opinions.

 

[bugwan]

Nah, i'd prefer the forum remains a free and frank exchange of views and opinions.

I appreciate freedom of speech etc, but when those views are ill-founded and potentially damaging to someone's reputation (business or otherwise) it starts getting dangerous.

That is a good outcome in my opinion.

The fact that the mud slingers get to slink back to Internet anonymity and the retailer has to wear it very publicly isn't a great outcome in my opinion!

 

[warrenlw63]

I think John did an admirable job of defending his reputation.

See that's just the thing that's probably peeving Bugwan, others and myself Sammy. I've known John for 12 years and he shouldn't have to defend himself to anybody on this forum. It pisses me off that it had to come to this because some would sell their arse to save five cents. Don't get me wrong I support a civilised bulk buy like the next person but some people just take it to a new low. <_<

Warren -

 

[technocat]

No it's not. Some people expressed their opinions, and others were able to counter those opinions. In the end it seems that everyone has had an opportunity to air their views, and most people have formed an opinion based on a decent amount of fact. That is a good outcome in my opinion.


I think John did an admirable job of defending his reputation.


Nah, i'd prefer the forum remains a free and frank exchange of views and opinions.

Won't argue with that