Full Boil Brewing

[dicko]

About that glad wrap...

http://homebrewandbeer.com/forum/viewtopic...f=2&t=10869

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[stux]

About that glad wrap...

http://homebrewandbeer.com/forum/viewtopic...f=2&t=10869
Ah yes, the ole use-atmospheric-pressure-and-boiling-water-to-crush-steel-drum trick.

One problem is the cooling wort is going to draw air in which could bring in airborne
bacteria/mould to your wort so maybe rig up an airlock that will let air come in
after being filtered by the water/sanitiser in the airlock (if you don't want to use
the standard cube nochill method).

So, I guess the solution to the above brewers issue is to make sure that you evacuate most of the steam before sealing?

 

[MaltyHops]

So, I guess the solution to the above brewers issue is to make sure that you evacuate most of the steam before sealing?

No - the problem is steam or hot air contracts when it cools
and the pressure drops so if there is no way for outside air to
enter the container to equalise pressure, the force of the
pressure difference between the outside atmosphere and inside
the container is enough to crush the vessel.

If there's not much empty space in the container this would be
less of a problem.

 

[carniebrew]

So Palmer is your God and How to Brew is your bible. Fair enough, but do you own the latest edition or quoting from the 90's edition in the website you have in your signature?

Palmer also tell us to "proof" yeast with table sugar or wort when re-hydrating (in the online, outdated book), yet the manufacturers and current consensus tells us that is a big NO NO.

Ummm, no, I don't have a God nor a bible. And (I hope) nowhere did I say "You're wrong 'coz Palmer the messiah said otherwise". I simply did what I was told when I first started brewing by reading the available material. Now i'm asking advice of brewers with expertise that in some cases contradicts that material. And by the way I am really impressed at the way this thread has evolved, plenty of vigorous debate without anyone getting snarky. I'm very much hoping it can continue.

I am quite happy to admit that until last night, I had never heard of anyone letting their full boil brews cool in the pot. And am bloody impressed that it can even be done, in contradiction to what i've read (from old literature as you say). I have never tried it myself, but now know that I can. Which is a lot more than I knew at this time yesterday!

Oh and I have the 3rd edition of Palmer's book, dated June 25, 2006. But I can't link to it online 'coz it only seems he has the 1st edition on the web (which is fair enough). I first read that quote in my 3rd edition, and it's only 'coz I realised that quote is completely unchanged from his online edition that I linked to it in my sig.

Probably a topic for another thread but I also hadn't heard of this change to proofing the yeast, although admittedly I have only used dry yeast to date and pitch it dry as per the instructions (which say you can either pitch dry or re-hydrate with warm water).

 

[slash22000]

Probably a topic for another thread but I also hadn't heard of this change to proofing the yeast, although admittedly I have only used dry yeast to date and pitch it dry as per the instructions (which say you can either pitch dry or re-hydrate with warm water).

Basically, don't "proof" dry yeast. Ever.

 

[carniebrew]

Basically, don't "proof" dry yeast. Ever.

I'm hesitant to again quote something I read on the web in case I get accused of worshipping false idols :icon_cheers: , but this is from the US-05 instructions on Fermentis' website:

Re-hydrate the dry yeast into yeast cream in a stirred vessel prior to pitching. Sprinkle the dry yeast in 10 times its own weight of sterile water or wort at 27C 3C (80F 6F). Once the expected weight of dry yeast is reconstituted into cream by this method (this takes about 15 to 30 minutes), maintain a gentle stirring for another 30 minutes. Then pitch the resultant cream into the fermentation vessel.

Alternatively, pitch dry yeast directly in the fermentation vessel providing the temperature of the wort is above 20C (68F). Progressively sprinkle the dry yeast into the wort ensuring the yeast covers all the surface of wort available in order to void clumps. Leave for 30 minutes and then mix the wort e.g. using aeration.

I've been doing the latter and pitching dry (mostly 'coz i'm lazy and figured if the manufacturer's own instructions tell me it's ok who am I to argue?]. But the first sentence talks about using "sterile water or wort". Wouldn't using wort be considered 'proofing' the yeast?

 

[stux]

I'm hesitant to again quote something I read on the web in case I get accused of worshipping false idols :icon_cheers: , but this is from the US-05 instructions on Fermentis' website:



I've been doing the latter and pitching dry (mostly 'coz i'm lazy and figured if the manufacturer's own instructions tell me it's ok who am I to argue?]. But the first sentence talks about using "sterile water or wort". Wouldn't using wort be considered 'proofing' the yeast?

The problem with "proofing" yeast is when you use sugar water to check if the yeast is alive. yes they're alive... but now they've developped a sweet tooth.

When you use wort, you don't have that problem. Might still be a good idea to proof bakers yeast, but even baking manuals now recommend a floury mixture

I rehydrate my yeast with warm water on a stirplate... because I can

But actually, I don't generally re-hydrate yeast, and instead I use my stirplate and real wort to prograte and build up a large yeast volume (generally .5 to 1.3 trillion)

 

[evildrakey]

I thought the whole reason you did the quick wort chill was to avoid DMS in malt's prone to it, like ****** American 6-row barley...

I'm using mainly Weyermanns Pilsner malt and Thomas Fawcett Marris Otter as my base malt and have never noticed a DMS issue with no-cubing...

In medieval times, they wort chilled my pouring the hot wort along long wooden troughs before dumping the cooled wort into barrels for fermentation. Then loosely applying the bung...

 

[carniebrew]

Cheers Stux, so what the guys perhaps mean above is never to proof yeast with sugar, rather than never proof yeast.

I checked Danstar's site for their dry yeast, and they specifically say never to proof at all (they say in wort, distilled or RO water) as it "may reduce viability". They suggest only to re-hydrate their dry yeast using cooled boiled water.

So the obvious lesson here is to follow the manufacturer's instructions for whatever yeast you're using....not some generic statement from a book or web forum.

 

[stux]

Cheers Stux, so what the guys perhaps mean above is never to proof yeast with sugar, rather than never proof yeast.

I checked Danstar's site for their dry yeast, and they specifically say never to proof at all (they say in wort, distilled or RO water) as it "may reduce viability". They suggest only to re-hydrate their dry yeast using cooled boiled water.

So the obvious lesson here is to follow the manufacturer's instructions for whatever yeast you're using....not some generic statement from a book or web forum.

Yerp, some of the dry yeast manufacturers say that they specially prepare their yeasts "glycogen reserves", and if you proof/rehydrate, you'll be undoing all that good work... I think that basically means they give them a good feed before desiccating