Fermenting Kit Beer At Around 25 Degrees

[Nick JD]

no...but you can roll it in glitter

I like mine with sprinkles.

 

[beerbog]

I like mine with sprinkles.

I was wondering where I left that. Thanks. :beerbang:

 

[manticle]

Not necessarily. Sorry for interrupting your little bitch fight, which is very entertaining so please continue, but commercial brewers also look for ways to maximise efficiency in the brew house and I think it's a valid question.
If you pitched an active starter at 18C you could get to high krausen in 24 hours, then increase to 20 for a day, then 22 then 24 and I reckon you could probably bottle on day 5. If you did the same recipe a few times and kept good notes you could even bottle on day 3 or 4 with a few gravity points left to carbonate instead of priming, thus saving a few more days. Kegs would save you some time of course, force carbonate in a day instead of waiting 2 weeks in bottles. Now if you looked at improving the starting ingredients you could actually have much better beer and have it faster too.

Not a bitch fight chief. It's based on a little bit of history of trying to help and feeling like I'd make better friends using my head and a brick wall. It's pretty rare that I'm anything but patient with basic questions from kit brewers.

I'm still not sure that the commercials that push their brews forward in the minimum timeframe are the ones I want to emulate with my homebrewing. No doubt it can be done (and is done) but not something I would suggest is a great method to making good beer. If in doubt, sample one of the said commercial breweries offerings above say 5 degrees and tell me it doesn't have off flavours. Add to that big commercial brewing plant =/= homebrewing - they have access to a lot of equipment etc that Monsieur tooheys + BEII does not.

I know some belgian breweries push higher temps but they still allow time in secondary and cold conditioning so they don't really count.

 

[mwd]

Why would you be posting this in 'The Pub' section ?? It is :icon_offtopic:

 

[DU99]

suggest you look at the tooheys..hope that helps

http://www.tooheyshomebrewing.com.au/instructions.html

 

[boobiedazzler]

Tough crowd.

It wasnt worth a new thread to be started though, that's for sure. The information you seek would be one of the easiest topics to find all over the beer-web.

Keep in mind that if you pitch at 25, you may anticipate a temperature spike that puts you over what you thought. If you really want to make it fast, then go with Jakub's suggestion.

Im not condoning it though. But then, I have not had the need nor wish to 'get a beer out' in a tight timeframe. Grain to Brain for me is about three months.

Does anybody else think that the turd is shaped like a 'meat & potatos' package? Someone has to say it.

 

[jakub76]

I'm still not sure that the commercials that push their brews forward in the minimum timeframe are the ones I want to emulate

I'm not talking about the giants, lots of the craftbrewers you hear interviewed on the BN ferment their ales out in 4-5 days. I understand that fermenting under pressure (like in a big fermenter) does retard ester formation but my point is that every brewer that's trying to make a living from it wants to maximise efficiency...not just the 'evil' ones

It's pretty rare that I'm anything but patient with basic questions from kit brewers.

I have to agree with you there, I have read a lot of your posts and I do consider your comments useful, considered and far less biting than a lot of other members..but that's part of the fun isn't it

 

[manticle]

I'm not talking about the giants, lots of the craftbrewers you hear interviewed on the BN ferment their ales out in 4-5 days. I understand that fermenting under pressure (like in a big fermenter) does retard ester formation but my point is that every brewer that's trying to make a living from it wants to maximise efficiency...not just the 'evil' ones

Ferment out possibly but do they bottle immediately or allow conditioning time?

genuine question - I'm curious as to me, ferment is one thing, maturation another.

 

[bum]

Jakub, your whole premise relies on someone making a starter for a straight kit...

Does this not sit right with anyone else? Just me then?

 

[boobiedazzler]

Good point. There's a few days gone already until the starter's good to use, and you havent even pitched.

For the speed-racer mindset like the OP wants to race with on his next beer, a better option would be three packets of coopers yeast in 1/2 litre of warm-to-the-touch water, swished around for an hour to hydrate, then into the pot she goes. Cuddle that bitch closely for a few days and she'll be right.

jamieh I think there's a bit of negativity towards your question because high temperatures such as the 25 you propose it's not something many brewers aim for with their favourite beer styles. Temperature control is a hot topic on this and other forums, if you do a bit of browsing from time to time, and take in bits of info as you go along, it will serve you well in your brewing future. Pay close attention to the finished beer, particularly the first one and the last one of the batch. Also, while youre drinking a high temp fermented beer, see if you notice a headache worse than if you drink a 'good' commercial beer or six. For all we know you might be as happy as Larry making & drinking tooheys kits, so go for it. I have regrettably fermented a few beers at that temperature in the early days, and still enjoyed them to a point. Although they did always have some extras, I dont know what your recipe is, and I darent publicly assume. However I would never hit that high again by choice. Better temp control really does add to the making of a good beer. Even without a fridge, you can still keep things coolish, and almost constant, depending on your definition of almost.

Sorry for swaying away a bit. You want beer quick right now. That sounds like your goal. Im going with the Nike slogan. JUST DO IT !

 

[jakub76]

your whole premise relies on someone making a starter for a straight kit...

Not quite, I'm trying to engender discussion and take a topic forward so we all might get something from it.

 

[scotteth]

I can understand Manticle's annoyance but...

Guys it's Tooheys kit beer that's probably spent 2 years on a Coles shelf- surely your not so concerned he's going to "ruin" it?


My 2 cents for Quality vs time -- I'd also be going with the more yeast.

a better option would be three packets of coopers yeast in 1/2 litre of warm-to-the-touch water, swished around for an hour to hydrate, then into the pot she goes.

 

[bum]

Not quite, I'm trying to engender discussion and take a topic forward so we all might get something from it.

What? Working out how to make poor practice tolerable?

I'll wag this masterclass if no one minds.

 

[DU99]

people have to learn somewhere,i bet all of you at one stage used kits to start with..so why be so baised..i would quit this site if i got an series of replies like that..we should be encourging people,not throwing rocks at them because they use a kit and remember there's some good ones..not all can afford the equipment and the time it takes,and i know of several brew shop owners that use kits and extra's..sorry to divert the topic..a better quality yeast will help..

 

[bum]

You don't know what you're talking about. You're pointing the snobbery bone at the last people on this board who deserve it. Jamieh is a moron. Jamieh has been told these things many before. And, if I remember correctly, manticle might have even told me to be more accepting of jamieh's stupidity in the past - thought he'd learn his way out of it or some such fanciful nonsense.

I have no problem with people making kit beers. Not even as a stepping stone. I fully intended to never go AG. Until I realised that it is harder to make a kit beer without twang (which I know some lucky folks don't taste too much, me - I can smell the stuff at 100 paces) than it is to make a decent extract beer, and once you're making extracts it really is bugger all difference to go AG.

 

[Bribie G]

Some yeasts actually go quite well at higher temperatures, but it's not worth buying a pack and wasting them on kit beers. However if you can get a free sample from someone, a good example is Wyeast Irish Ale yeast that runs nicely at 22 - 24 degrees, my recent minicomp winning stout was done at around 23 then dropped to 20 simply because that was the ambient in the garage. Commercial Dublin brewed Guinness is allowed to rise to 24 / 25 degrees and I have a hunch that the Wyeast is maybe a cousin of that yeast. So the "all ales must be done at less than 20" mantra is not really universal. Just did a Ringwood - Powered ale for another comp, 22 degrees. Lets see how it goes.

However the original post re doing a kit with kit yeast at 25, definitely iffy. But maybe try something like the Irish, keep it going for a few generations so it doesn't cost an arm and a leg, and see if it provides a river of quickly fermenting beer for you.

 

[Metal_Gman]

Well, I can understand the OPs question. Although granted manticle is right, OP ought to have gone badass on google trawling for all available info and soaked it up like a freakin' sponge.
Higher temp brewing results in funky flavours, there're several routes to offset this as manticle explained. But it does not achieve what the OP is after, fast brewed tasty beer. Because waiting for beer to condition in a bottle in the cupboard is a bitch (I've only been brewing for 6 months, but damn i've learnt fast to leave that beer alone in the cupboard for AT LEAST 2 weeks)
Take it on the Chin OP, every n00b brewer has odd/funky ideas, there's nothing wrong with that, sometimes it results in discovering something new and useful. Thinking outside the square/trying to be different isn't wrong. But you've got to take the baby steps along the road already followed before trying weird/whacky ideas really.
The advise here though is brewing @ 25c won't help you achieve a good beer faster, in fact it will probably hinder (Because you will have to leave it condition for some time for it to be drinkable) Your best option is a rotational brewing system i'd suggest, making sure you always have some almost finished conditioning.
If all your really after is some mega-swill to tide you over, suggest you get a cornelius keg, brew an OK beer with say Notto yeast (It'll ferment out entirely pretty fast and neutrally) then force carb. Maybe 10days total time and you'll have 19L of something to tide you over till you have something really decent to drink? I might be wrong, the boys here who've been around for far longer know far more.

 

[DU99]

"the snobbery bone"...people dont have to rude about it..and calling people moron's is not good way to give a website a good name..we all should giving assistance where needed not bagging them...My 2Cents

 

[Cocko]

I find pitching on a full yeast cake. it is all done and dusted pretty quickly..

Bit hard with a K&K I guess but if you could premix in another fermenter or something similar..

2c.

 

[bum]

"the snobbery bone"...people dont have to rude about it..and calling people moron's is not good way to give a website a good name..we all should giving assistance where needed not bagging them...My 2Cents

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum//ind...p;hl=&st=25

Start at the bottom and work your way up and onto the more recent page. See if you still wanna be this dude's champion.