Counter Flow v Plate Chiller?

[wes1977]

Hi Everyone?

What's the best, are plate chillers worth the risk?

Cheers Wes

 

[mstrelan]

To each, his or her own.

 

[MichaelM]

I've used both a counterflow and plate chiller and decided to stick with the plate chiller.

Reasons for sticking with the plate chiller are:

I haven't had an infection in my beer from using a plate chiller
More compact and larger heat exchange surface area:size compare to a counterflow heat exchanger
More efficient heat exchange in my experience- ripples in plate chiller create turbulence which aids in heat exchange

But it all depends on your preference.

If you do go for a plate chiller get one with sanitary fittings - barbed as the threaded fittings can harbour contaminants.


Its all up to personal choice

 

[wes1977]

I really like the idea of a plate chiller but worry about it blocking during the transfer and not knowing its cleaned ok.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

Hi Everyone?

What's the best, are plate chillers worth the risk?

Cheers Wes

Flog ....dead....horse....

 

[SBOB]

I really like the idea of a plate chiller but worry about it blocking during the transfer and not knowing its cleaned ok.

1) use a hop sock, that will solve blocking issues
2) just dont look, that will solve the knowing its clean issue

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

1) use a hop sock, that will solve blocking issues
2) just dont look, that will solve the knowing its clean issue

Yes. What you cant see wont kill you

 

[Moad]

use search mate, there are a few threads already. this is a tough one, many opinions

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

use search mate, there are a few threads already. this is a tough one, many opinions

Yep

Been done to many times

Ask 10 different brewers if they would use a counter-flow or plate chiller and you will get 17 1/2 different answers

 

[spog]

I use an immersion chiller, 20- 15 mins from the end of boil in it goes.
What type you use is your choice what best appeals to you and your brew rig as far as I'm concerned the less places for nasties to hide and the less fuss/ cleaning the better.
The more joints etc = more cleaning .

My 2 cents worth.

 

[Ducatiboy stu]

I have seen pics of plate chillers pulled apart that where supposed to be clean and sanitised regularly

 

[Batz]

I have seen pics of plate chillers pulled apart that where supposed to be clean and sanitised regularly

Yep, plate chillers are an infection waiting to happen. You may get away with it for a while but it will happen.
They were never intended for food stuffs.


http://www.brewboard.com/index.php?showtopic=68822

 

[Lyrebird_Cycles]

Plate chillers are bog standard equipment for wort cooling in commercial breweries. They are routinely CIPed, they have to be kept clean so you don't lose cooling efficiency.

They are not routinely disassembled for cleaning*, in fact I've only ever seen them disassembled for maintenance (leaky gaskets etc)**.

The key difference here is that in commercial world the wort put through them has been adequately clarified (via whirlpool), avoiding problems with protein precipitation. It is much, much easier to get a decent whirlpool action when there's ten tonnes of wort spinning around in it.

*Think about the mechanics of doing this: if you are on a four hour brew cycle and it takes 15 minutes to sanitise the chiller, 45 - 60 minutes to transfer the wort and another 15 minutes to rinse the chiller, you'd have to disassemble it, clean it and reassemble it in under two and a half hours. I know exactly what reaction I'd get from the maintenance people asking for that at 3 AM.

** The glue used on the gaskets is insanely effing strong and of course you have to remove every scrap of the old gasket before fitting a new one or it won't seat properly. The maintenance guy in Perth had a great trick for this: he made a wooden bath large enough to fit the plate in, lined it with polythene and filled it with liquid nitrogen. He'd immerse the plate into the LN2, wait until it stopped boiling then pull the plate out and throw it on the ground. The rubber gasket would shatter into a million bits on impact (it's well below its Tg so it was effectively glass)

 

[Batz]

The fact that they can be broken down for cleaning makes a huge difference. The ones home brewers use have a tiny gap between the plates, the thickness of a paper clip. Wort travels up and down 20 plus plates all which have small ripples up and down each plate to assist cooling, if you believe no hop or grain will ever lodge in here well and good.
I have owned a plate chiller and yes they do work well, I'm just a little worried about sanitation. Each to there own.

 

[droid]

Hi Everyone?

What's the best, are plate chillers worth the risk?

Cheers Wes

I have a plate chiller, it's small and compact but difficult to clean. I'll clean it at the end of a brew day then soak it, then run cleaner through it again on the next brew day and gunk will come out again! Caustic has not been used ... yet. It is two years old now and I have not had an infection.

The only downside for me is when there is alot of hop matter from doing a big hoppy beer and the whirlpool cannot keep the hops out of the tap and subsequently the chiller.

A hop spider will help, currently here all late addition hops are put in the hop spider. If you have a concave kettle then you can get away with more hops in the bottom, I wish my kettle was slightly concave like my old keggle.

A scavenger pipe connected into the back of the tap is the other thing I use. It is an elbow of stainless tube and it sits in a fitting allowing it to be turned so you can alter the height of the pick-up to suit.

My understanding with counter-flow is that you can run your hot wort through it with hops and pump back into your kettle and whirlpool at the same time allowing immediate chilliing. I can't do that with the plate chiller - I have to whirlpool first to keep the hops away from the chiller as best as possible - which is the annoying part.

Not sure what happens to all the proteins if they are pumped and whirlpooled, I think they stick to the hops but I am guessing.

 

[Adr_0]

Filters upstream are critical. I use a false bottom as a primary, and 40# mesh below this.

Cleaning is best done with vinegar soak at 70-80°C, and a backflush, then stored upside down with glad wrap.

On flushing... Once everything has been softened, only ever back-flush. Thin is best done by pressuring up with water from the hose, then suddenly releasing pressure. The shock/shock wave concept gives the greatest chance of dislodging material out of the normal flowpath - normal continuous flushing tends to following the path of least resistance (clean already) rather than the path of most resistance.

Having said all that, the very nature of a sealed unit like these is that your infection risk will always be a sliding scale, not an absolute. You can only try to be on the right end of the scale.

 

[dicko]

Plate chiller...had one far to much work in cleaning.

Counterflow Chiller...had a couple of these, first a homemade one and then the neat and tidy one from the USA. (Thanks Batz)
These are much easier to clean and work well.

Immersion chiller....got one of these at the moment, made of Stainless, very easy to clean and sanitise.
Pretty much hose it off and dump it into boiling wort to sanitise.

Current method, some may have guessed it..."no chill"
Quicker brew day, provides time for yeast management IE starters, soak the no chill cube with PBW and sanitise on brew day and maybe even saves a bit of water.

Your choice Wes 1977
You have heard it all in this topic..

 

[Bribie G]

Cube.

 

[mikec]

Mate I'm no expert but I don't think that's the right way to open it up for cleaning...

 

[Batz]

Mate I'm no expert but I don't think that's the right way to open it up for cleaning...

Works very well the first time only, can be problematic for leaks there after.