Coffee Stout

[dr K]

Oysters and a big stout are a remarkable combination, washed down together not brewed together.
I have never drunk a short black alongside a stout but I figure it would be a nice combination.
The chocolate, sometimes even roast coffee aromas (as pointed out above) come from a carefull use of grains. Adding coffee is, frankly, faking it.

K

 

[Sammus]

Oyesters IN a big stout are also a remarkable combination. Potters had an oyster stout on for a while, probably one of the best beers I've tasted to date.

 

[PostModern]

None of those will give you caffeine though!

And 40g of coffee in a 20L batch gives you bugger all anyway.

 

[kook]

And 40g of coffee in a 20L batch gives you bugger all anyway.

I remember working it out when I did my batch, and 80g ended up being about 1/3 shot per pint. I wouldn't call that bugger all!

The chocolate, sometimes even roast coffee aromas (as pointed out above) come from a carefull use of grains. Adding coffee is, frankly, faking it.

Is adding coriander to a witbier faking spice and fruit character that could come from a yeast? How is adding coffee to a coffee stout "faking" anything?

 

[PostModern]

Meh. What if you want a pint late in the evening without caffeine? If you make fresh coffee you can add it, but once it's in the batch, you can't take it back out.

These are just my reasons for not doing it. Each to their own.

 

[kook]

Meh. What if you want a pint late in the evening without caffeine? If you make fresh coffee you can add it, but once it's in the batch, you can't take it back out.

These are just my reasons for not doing it. Each to their own.

Then you don't brew a coffee stout Totally agree - but you could say the same with any ingredients.

Fair enough

 

[Adamt]

If it's caffeine you want... get out the mortar and pestle and No-Doz. h34r:

 

[RdeVjun]

Yep, "Each to their own." My sentiments precisely.
Not many folks really go wild for the star anise- laced irish stout I brew, but I do sure as heck do and will continue to make it. So, whatever floats your boat!
I'll not get hung up on whether someone is faking flavours or if its artificial, or if a particular ingredient is or isn't in a style or rather, a recipe. It doesn't really matter how you achieve the end result if you're happy with the flavour, the process and the ingredients you use don't threaten the planet's or a species' survival. (Hmm, perhaps not quite the best argument with coffee in mind, but there you go!) Anyway, a diversity in methods and techniques for achieving a similar end result are kind of good, it means we're using our scones a bit rather than just being compliant little sheepies. Be different, think outside the box and bring out the goat in you. In particular, the giddy goat!

 

[manticle]

I've done it twice with some extract brews. I just added about 200g of ground espresso at the end of the boil (also some organic cocoa). Both turned out beautifully although the second also has a honey flavour (yes I added honey) that seems unnecessary now as I drink it.

That said, the nicest coffee flavours I've come across in commercial stouts do come from the malts used and they are much better integrated than my versions so that's what I'll head for next time. Holgate springs to mind.

I second the who gives a shit thing though. If it's your brew put in what you want and leave out what you want.

If it's someone else's beer why are you making it?

 

[Effect]

for the people that think that putting coffee into the beer is cheating or is really beer + x...that is all well and good, I am of the opinion as well.

But I still hold the same opinion for gelatine, polyclar and other adjuncts and fining agents. Its just not right in my books (sort of like the german purity law - but even that is a bit anal).

I don't at all discourage the use of any of these though...just think that if adding coffee to get a coffee flavour is thought by some as 'cheating' because it can be achieved by other means (i.e. the grain) - then so should the use of fining agents, where time and temperature can achieve the same result.

Cheers
Phil

 

[manticle]

Who exactly are you cheating?

 

[Muggus]

Bit OT, but isn't the flavour we call "coffee" a mix complex of flavours within itself anyway?
You get coffee buffs who give you big old run down of how there's notes of vanilla, spice, wood...etc.
Seems to me you could actually control these subtleties of the coffee flavour by adding specific beans/coffee, rather than depending on malt to give you some that tastes like coffee. No doubt the you'll loose a bit of it during the brewing process, but if it's well made and is a strong coffee, I could imagine you could really get a more authentic coffee flavour.

Anyway, i've tried to make a couple of coffee stouts in my time.
Brewed one with a few cups of freshly brewed coffee in the primary...MISTAKE!
Second I put beans in the mash and secondary. The nose is coffeeish, and there's a bit on the finish, but its lacking in the body.

The info in this thread has got me pondering one more...

 

[manticle]

I just brewed a chocolate stout using chocolate malt grains rather than organic cocoa and roasted barley rather than coffee (both latter ingredients I've used before). It's just started fermenting but the initial flavour was strongly reminiscent of coffee and chocolate and I added neither.

I'm still not sure who I'd be cheating if I did though.

 

[bradsbrew]

for the people that think that putting coffee into the beer is cheating or is really beer + x...that is all well and good, I am of the opinion as well.

But I still hold the same opinion for gelatine, polyclar and other adjuncts and fining agents. Its just not right in my books (sort of like the german purity law - but even that is a bit anal).

I don't at all discourage the use of any of these though...just think that if adding coffee to get a coffee flavour is thought by some as 'cheating' because it can be achieved by other means (i.e. the grain) - then so should the use of fining agents, where time and temperature can achieve the same result.

Cheers
Phil

Just like those cheating bastards at Youngs add oats and chocolate essence to thier Double Chocolate Stout. I dont know how they live with themselves.

Brad

 

[chappo1970]

Has PoMo seen this yet? h34r:
I feel a rant coming on.
Yep tooooo late!

 

[manticle]

Just like those cheating bastards at Youngs add oats and chocolate essence to thier Double Chocolate Stout. I dont know how they live with themselves.

Brad

Not to mention those ******* belgians throwing fruit and sucrose and florally things in, all willy nilly and without a care.

Won't someone please think of the Germans?

 

[Effect]

Youngs double chocolate stout and kreik - two of my favourite beers!

 

[PostModern]

Bit OT, but isn't the flavour we call "coffee" a mix complex of flavours within itself anyway?
You get coffee buffs who give you big old run down of how there's notes of vanilla, spice, wood...etc.
Seems to me you could actually control these subtleties of the coffee flavour by adding specific beans/coffee, rather than depending on malt to give you some that tastes like coffee. No doubt the you'll loose a bit of it during the brewing process, but if it's well made and is a strong coffee, I could imagine you could really get a more authentic coffee flavour.

I love coffee. I'm a stovetop guy myself coz I know if I had an espresso machine, I'd be wired on caffeine 24x7. You know how to get those really great bitter, spicy, tart, roasty flavours like you taste in a great espresso?? You drink a cup of freaking coffee...

Just like those cheating bastards at Youngs add oats and chocolate essence to thier Double Chocolate Stout. I dont know how they live with themselves.

I could only taste essence. Far from my favourite stout, and I was really looking forward to it.

Has PoMo seen this yet? h34r:
I feel a rant coming on.
Yep tooooo late!

Yeah yeah. How'd you like those raisins and chocolate flavours in my porter?

Hehe. Enjoy guys. Just espressing my view

 

[sinkas]

chekc out AleSmith Speedway stout recipe, wicked RIS with coffee

 

[bradsbrew]

Pomo whats ya favourite Stout then. I'm always open to get myself a new favourite.

Brad