Cm2, Fourstar, Brendo, Maple Mega Barleywine Brewday

[Fourstar]

Ok ive just done a few numbers (will probabaly have to adjust for losses in kettle etc) but so far the guesstimate is a follows:

for a 160L final volume (two batches, BW and PG) we will require a starting gravity of 1.075~

Then, we split the total pre boil liquor in 1/2 (190 odd L~) and end up with the following.

1st batch sparge (barley wine) will end up with a final volume figure of 1.116
2nd batch (partigyle) will end up with a final volume figure of 1.040

Note: the 2nd batch sparge is not including any specialties we can add to the second sparge, this can be used to help push up the starting gravity.

The 1st batch sparge includes its mash-in water so you add less water to the tun for the 1st sparge, the second sparge for the partigyle is equal to the total water used for the 1st sparge+ dough in.


Sounds simple? im kinda dizzy but i get it.

 

[Maple]

Ok ive just done a few numbers (will probabaly have to adjust for losses in kettle etc) but so far the guesstimate is a follows:

for a 160L final volume (two batches, BW and PG) we will require a starting gravity of 1.075~

Then, we split the total pre boil liquor in 1/2 (190 odd L~) and end up with the following.

1st batch sparge (barley wine) will end up with a final volume figure of 1.116
2nd batch (partigyle) will end up with a final volume figure of 1.040

Note: the 2nd batch sparge is not including any specialties we can add to the second sparge, this can be used to help push up the starting gravity.

The 1st batch sparge includes its mash-in water so you add less water to the tun for the 1st sparge, the second sparge for the partigyle is equal to the total water used for the 1st sparge+ dough in.


Sounds simple? im kinda dizzy but i get it.

Which gives each of us 20L of each of the PG and BW, if I follow you? To my thinking we need the 110L pot for the BW and split the PG over another 2 kettles?

 

[Fourstar]

Which gives each of us 20L of each of the PG and BW, if I follow you? To my thinking we need the 110L pot for the BW and split the PG over another 2 kettles?

yeah or we can boil the BW in two pots, while another pot can be used for bringing mash/sparge water up to temp for the partigyle batch. We will have to go through some kind of infusion period for any specialties we add to the remaining grist so by the time this is all done and have been filled with their sparge water, the other two kettles should be empty and ready for more wort to be boiled in them!

So, what are we going to make for the partigyle?! ive reserved enough gravity of fermetnables there to knock out someting big enough (4.5%~)

Any styles people want to test/play with?

 

[brettprevans]

im coming tomorrow. wild horses oculdnt stop me!

cool re dates. were getting there


edit:

well partigyles traditionally are lighter in alc so i dont think ther'es any need to be pushing for 4.5%. I'd be happy with a 3.5%.


oh and rooky - bjcp tomorrow night is belgian strongs! :icon_drool2:

 

[therook]

im coming tomorrow. wild horses oculdnt stop me!

cool re dates. were getting there

Maybe you guys could put a float in next years Mardi Gra :icon_chickcheers:

Rook

 

[Fourstar]

im coming tomorrow. wild horses oculdnt stop me!
edit: well partigyles traditionally are lighter in alc so i dont think ther'es any need to be pushing for 4.5%. I'd be happy with a 3.5%.

Well do we want a traditional partigyle @ 3.5% and skimp on the grain or a slightly higher OG? I guess it really comes down to our mash tun capacities.

Oh, BTW can you bring my Rye tomorrow?!?

 

[Maple]

I'm happy enough with a sub 2%, let get the goodies into the bw and hop the mild to iipa levels. Adding a bit of crystal might just give it a bit more
Colour and residual sweetness, that's cool with me

 

[brendo]

I'm happy enough with a sub 2%, let get the goodies into the bw and hop the mild to iipa levels. Adding a bit of crystal might just give it a bit more
Colour and residual sweetness, that's cool with me

what he said...

And I have been given the all clear for April 3 so lock it in!!

 

[Fourstar]

I'm happy enough with a sub 2%, let get the goodies into the bw and hop the mild to iipa levels. Adding a bit of crystal might just give it a bit more
Colour and residual sweetness, that's cool with me

hmm following that idea we then scrap the standard partigyle idea altogether and moreso scavange the leftovers? Partigyle is equated out as per your two required batches its either a 1:3 split by wort volume or 50:50 split. Upon furhter investigation, ive noticed what i worked out earlier is incorrect and only works for the 1:3 split of volume.

If we try a 50:50 split partigyle (of total wort) we are looking at 1.110 and a 1.055 worts, this will require a buttload of grain @ 58 Kilos. (compared to 40)

This idea seems to scrape the botom of the barrel so to speak. Sounds ok to me. crapload cheaper too! (or not on the hop side fo things). Its also less likly to test the volume limits of our equiptment too. 18KG of extra grain takes up alot of space.

Being optomistic and we get 70% efficiency on the 1st batch and we scrape 10% efficiency on the 2nd (possible) we are looking at around 1.025~

We also might want to treat the sparge water with CaCl or lactic acid for the second batch to ensure we reduce tannin extraction as the pH might start to clim fairly rapidly at that stage.

 

[Fourstar]

I have his grain mate. It'll be coming, unless he's not.

Does that mean i require my scales and a bag?

 

[Maple]

Gents (term used v. loosely) - it seems I have screwed up the date, and assumed Easter was on the 2nd weekend. Turns out it's on the 2nd - 4th (or so google tells me). I have conflicting calanders on when it shows. Either way, the 3rd still works for me, but you guys make the call.

4*, bring scales/bag tonight.

 

[Fourstar]

yep thats the saturday before easter sunday the date we have selected.

See link: http://www.vic.gov.au/Victorian-Public-Holiday-Dates.html

Im happy with that date, SWMBO is working that weekend so im free as a bird.

So, are we in agreeance for the recipe and scavanging the remainder + crystal/specialtiess on second batch?!? works well for me!

 

[brettprevans]

yep thats the saturday before easter sunday the date we have selected.

See link: http://www.vic.gov.au/Victorian-Public-Holiday-Dates.html

Im happy with that date, SWMBO is working that weekend so im free as a bird.

So, are we in agreeance for the recipe and scavanging the remainder + crystal/specialtiess on second batch?!? works well for me!

yup works for me. will confrim tonight.

and +1 for adding a few bits and peices for partigyle.

my last (and only partigyle) I added:
Use 3rd runnings from pliney clone,
100g carared,
100g carapils,
100g wheat,
POR @ 60min
Recultered coopers yeast

cant say if it tasted good as it got infected (all brews from that brewday got infected).

long story short - yes for crystal/specialtiess

 

[Fourstar]

long story short - yes for crystal/specialtiess

Cool bananas, well once we dicide what style we want for the final runnings i can put something together based on the original grain bill in beersmith.

What hops are we going for in the BW? just so i can assemble the recipes.

 

[brettprevans]

how about we decide on hops tonight at bjcp?

Brendo as I am collecting grain from Dave, I'll drive. want a lift?

 

[Maple]

What hops are we going for in the BW? just so i can assemble the recipes.

I've got heaps of Chinese hops to unload but in all seriousness, I've got Amarillo, cent, Columbus in fair amounts, and chinook and other assorted c'hops in some lesser quantities.

 

[brendo]

Well it look like my infallible wife farked up - April 3 is no good for me. Let's sort out a date tonight - sorry guys.

Hops - I have plenty of Amarillo, cascade, chinook and centennial so no dramas with any of those being in the hop schedule.

Bretto - a lift would be awesome.

Fourstar - if you are bringing scales with you i will make use of them to check the caraRye - my scales packed it in yesterday so I had to use bathroom scales which are not exactly accurate given they are in 100g increments.

Brendo

 

[Fourstar]

Well it look like my infallible wife farked up - April 3 is no good for me. Let's sort out a date tonight - sorry guys.

Hops - I have plenty of Amarillo, cascade, chinook and centennial so no dramas with any of those being in the hop schedule.

Bretto - a lift would be awesome.

Fourstar - if you are bringing scales with you i will make use of them to check the caraRye - my scales packed it in yesterday so I had to use bathroom scales which are not exactly accurate given they are in 100g increments.

Brendo

no worries cheif. My major hops on hand are Magnum and Centennial, everything else is around 100g as i buy hops in this increment. As for specialty grain we may not have (biscuit/aromatic/roasts etc) i can always get em from greensy at a decent price.

Maple, when i went to get the roast barley and biscuit malt (ended up getting aromatic) i saved 5 bucks from the two kilos comparitvly to G&G. pretty decent saving i recon in the grand scheme of things. :beerbang: If there is a 1 off hop we want, i can always get 100g of something. usually circa 10-13 bucks from dave in that value.

Hop schedule, i assume we are following CM2s schedule of:
60min/fwh
20
10
0

Also, i assume we are no chilling yes? From experience, can i suggest we shift the 20 10 and 0 min additions to being 10 min and 0 min and 5 mins after falmeout (whirlpool addition)?

The reason for this is to compensate for the extended high temp contact time isomerisation. If we add it all in the 20/10/0 as a no chill we will end up with a buttload of hop flavour/extra bitterness and low amounts of aroma. Atleast thats the results i get when NC (which is all the time). Thats generally why my recipes are FWH (to try and get more hop aroma), 20-10min and a knockout/whirlpool addition to reduce the isomerisation time.

If you give the wort 5 mins after knockout before whirlpooling you are looking at contact temps of 90-80 deg for your "flameout" addition and by the time you end up cubing it, they are around 75-70 where the isomerisation process is signifigantly slower. If we add them at 20 10 0, it will be more like 40,30 15 additions. Kinda make sense?

 

[brettprevans]

dave, brendan and me all have coil chillers. no need to no-chill

i have some buscuit and a range of hops

 

[Maple]

As for specialty grain we may not have (biscuit/aromatic/roasts etc) i can always get em from greensy at a decent price.


Hop schedule, i assume we are following CM2s schedule of:
60min/fwh
20
10
0

Also, i assume we are no chilling yes? From experience, can i suggest we shift the 20 10 and 0 min additions to being 10 min and 0 min and 5 mins after falmeout (whirlpool addition)?

The reason for this is to compensate for the extended high temp contact time isomerisation. If we add it all in the 20/10/0 as a no chill we will end up with a buttload of hop flavour/extra bitterness and low amounts of aroma. Atleast thats the results i get when NC (which is all the time). Thats generally why my recipes are FWH (to try and get more hop aroma), 20-10min and a knockout/whirlpool addition to reduce the isomerisation time.

If you give the wort 5 mins after knockout before whirlpooling you are looking at contact temps of 90-80 deg for your "flameout" addition and by the time you end up cubing it, they are around 75-70 where the isomerisation process is signifigantly slower. If we add them at 20 10 0, it will be more like 40,30 15 additions. Kinda make sense?

Firstly, I have these grains (off the top of my head) - Ale, Pils, Munich I and II, CaraAroma, Special B, Biscuit, Vienna, Wheat and of course Rye. not sure how much of what, but have a few kg of each at the bare minimum.

Secondly - Aroma hops in a BW - does it really matter - really just the BU's and the flavour i thought we'd be after, thereby negating the no-chill corrections to accomodate. Could be wrong, just my 2c.

Thirdly, Ch 7 could film the day, i'm sure my missus will be looking for the shotgun by mashout....