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Coodgee

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Just wondering the difference is if cascade hops are boiled for 80-90 minutes rather than 60 minutes? Is there a difference to the bitterness and/or taste of the beer?
 

warrenlw63

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Coodgee said:
Just wondering the difference is if cascade hops are boiled for 80-90 minutes rather than 60 minutes? Is there a difference to the bitterness and/or taste of the beer?
Coodgee,

In all reality you'll just wind up with (slightly) more bitterness. That said 20 minutes longer the excess bitterness shouldn't be all that noticeable.



My experience with Cascade as as bittering hop is that it's not all that great (to my own tastes). If you're making an American PA style. Cascade serves you better in late additions. Example, no more than 15-20 minutes from strikeout.

When I'm making APAs I find that Perle or Northern Brewer work better as bittering hops and Cascade as a finishing and/or dry hop.

Warren -
 

Coodgee

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wow! awesome quick response dude. that really puts my mind at rest. I did my first partial mash last night, took about 6 hours from cleaning up the kitchen to pitching the yeast... man there were piles of grain everywhere! I'll tell everyone about it soon.. right now I was just stressing cos I gave my hops an extra boil!

when you say you think cascade doesn't really work for you as a bittering hop, do you mean that it doesn't actually impart enough bitterness for your liking, or just that the all-cascade flavour is not for you?

interested to learn a bit more about this...
 

warrenlw63

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Coodgee said:
man there were piles of grain everywhere! I'll tell everyone about it soon.. right now I was just stressing cos I gave my hops an extra boil!
Sign of a job well done and congrats. It won't be your last! ;)

Using Cascade as a boiling hop is no sin. Don't get me wrong. Just find that it doesn't seem to give a very firm bitterness which can be obtained by the more dedicated varieties like Northern Brewer, Perle, Target is also a good one. Yet as a late hop in the right styles Cascade has to have the most noticeable aroma of any hop you'll ever try. Just think Little Creatures.

If I were to use Cascade as a bittering hop I'd probably combine it with high alpha hops or larger amounts of Goldings.

All that said you can be rest assured that the beer is going to be pretty awesome. :chug:

Warren -
 

neonmeate

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i also find that with a 100% cascade beer it gets a bit acidic and rough. the catpiss flavour really starts to stack up. also dryhopping with it can go grassy quick. better kept just for aroma.

try amarillo instead for a more mellow and friendly citrussy yankhop.
 

warrenlw63

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Yep, you're right Neonmeate. Catpiss is a very apt description. :D I've tried Cascade dry-hopped and late-hopped. Definitely prefer late-hopping.

Dry hopping with Cascade is OK. Just needs to be moderated. Any of the residual "cat-piss" generally ages out though. In fact any "Cascaded" beer shouldn't really be consumed young.

Must try Amarillo haven't managed to get my hands on it yet though.

Warren -
 

Coodgee

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just on this topic, when I poured my wort into the fermenter, I stopped pouring with about 3-4cm of the soupy mix of cold rest and bits of hops in the bottom. should I have thrown that stuff in? or has all the flavour/aroma been removed from those hops?
 

Gulf Brewery

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Hi coodgee

All of the flavour / bitterness from the hops is already in the wort. A little bit of the break material (technical name for the crap at the bottom of the kettle) is beneficial for fermenting, but generally you try and leave it behind.

Relax and it will be fine.
Cheers
Pedro
 

sosman

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Coodgee,

Well done mate. For your original question, there is a graph over at Glenn Tinseth's Hop page which looks like
.

The graph speaks for itself.

I can't say I disagree with the comments of the other posters. I would just like to add, when you are new to brewing, sometimes using the same hop right through the boil helps you get familiar with the characteristics of that particular hop.

I have had good success with cascade all the way through.
 

chiller

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neonmeate said:
i also find that with a 100% cascade beer it gets a bit acidic and rough. the catpiss flavour really starts to stack up. also dryhopping with it can go grassy quick. better kept just for aroma.

try amarillo instead for a more mellow and friendly citrussy yankhop.
The reason Cascade is such a poor bittering hop is the cohumulone % . It is not all that different to the famed PoR.

It is a very rough hop and you definately get a nasty aftertaste with it if you overdo it in the 60 minute boil.

As stated Amarillo is a much more civilised hop and has a nice flavour and aroma for an american hop. You still get the grapefruit taste but it doesn't taste offensive.

Used correctly Cascade can give a nice beer, incorrectly it is very ordinary.

Steve
 

Coodgee

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well we have lager1001 to blame should the hops schedule result in a poor beer. ( I have full confidence in you mate).

for interests sake, teh hopping shedule was as follows:

65 grams 5.7% AA cascade at 0 min
15 grams at 75min
15 grams at 88 min
5 grams at 90 min

oh and while we are at it...

2kg ale malt
750 grams light munich
300 grams wheat
2kg coopers light liquid malt extract.

safale yeast (to keep cost and hassle down)

hope I get something resembling little creatures...
 

sosman

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65 grams 5.7% AA cascade at 0 min
15 grams at 75min
15 grams at 88 min
5 grams at 90 min
Did you add the hops in the order you listed them? If so it is conventional to give the time wrt the end of the boil, like a rocket launch. The beer police are on their way this very minute to arrest you.

Also, if you want people to take a closer look at your recipe, you need to state the volume of the batch and the boil.

To me it looks like it is going to come out something like you wished for. It will be interesting to see how the hop aroma and flavour turn out - that can be a bit of a black art and something you just have to nail yourself.
 

Coodgee

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well I made the total volume up to 22.5 litres with an og of 1.043 but I Think this is wrong because I didn't clear the bubbles on the surface from around the hydorometer when I took the reading
 

TidalPete

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Pedro said:
All of the flavour / bitterness from the hops is already in the wort. A little bit of the break material (technical name for the crap at the bottom of the kettle) is beneficial for fermenting, but generally you try and leave it behind.
I always use a pantyhose (fart-free) with the legs cut off. These pantyhose are not my own (No smart-arse replies please), but create an effective filter if sterilised & held in place over the fermenter mouth using a bit of bicycle tube as a big rubber band. A little hot water added afterwards helps to get all the bitterness out. Squeeze the last of the liquid out of the pantyhose with tongs or something else out of the kitchen draw.
 

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