Arduino Development Thread

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I have done a bit of looking around at the Arduino as I am part-way through hacking a digital scale system to tell me how much weight is left in the keg. Will be very rudimentary as I will h ave to minus off the weight of the keg in my head, and that will give me the weight of beer left, which I can approximate to how many litres of beer left. Now that is only a stop-gap measure as I want to display how many beers are left.

Given that I am very comfortable sitting in my MS sandbox and don't particularly have the time or inclination to learn how to develop Nix software I have found the NetDuino very interesting. Uses MS Micro framework and you can use the free C# express IDE or full-blown Visual Studio. It is compatible with all the Arduino shields. Sounds like a winner to me. Bit more expensive than the Arduino though. I'll wait until next month and then plonk some cash down and start playing with it.

I'll post up some thoughts once I've had a play with it into a separate thread.

Cheers,
Angus.
 
I have done a bit of looking around at the Arduino as I am part-way through hacking a digital scale system to tell me how much weight is left in the keg. Will be very rudimentary as I will h ave to minus off the weight of the keg in my head, and that will give me the weight of beer left, which I can approximate to how many litres of beer left. Now that is only a stop-gap measure as I want to display how many beers are left.

Given that I am very comfortable sitting in my MS sandbox and don't particularly have the time or inclination to learn how to develop Nix software I have found the NetDuino very interesting. Uses MS Micro framework and you can use the free C# express IDE or full-blown Visual Studio. It is compatible with all the Arduino shields. Sounds like a winner to me. Bit more expensive than the Arduino though. I'll wait until next month and then plonk some cash down and start playing with it.

I'll post up some thoughts once I've had a play with it into a separate thread.

Cheers,
Angus.
Netduino looks like a great alternative on the same form factor if you're that way inclined. There' s no need to run any 'nix' to do arduino as there is an IDE for Windows and MacOS too.

A flow sensor/meter would integrate well with your beer keg system, as you can use it to measure the volume of the liquid coming out of the keg
 
Netduino looks like a great alternative on the same form factor if you're that way inclined. There' s no need to run any 'nix' to do arduino as there is an IDE for Windows and MacOS too.

A flow sensor/meter would integrate well with your beer keg system, as you can use it to measure the volume of the liquid coming out of the keg

I more meant developing for Nix/using C and the development environment. I don't have the spare time to learn a new IDE, a new language (albeit somewhat similar to C#), its constructs, how to do things in it, and then also learn how to programme micro-controllers.

I have Visual Studio, know it fairly well, know C# fairly well so I only have to learn how to programme micro-controllers. Easy... :)

Maybe back when I didn't have a pregnant wife, moving back into our unit which needs some repairs, preparations for the baby, blah, blah, blah.....

You are right in recommending a flow meter as it would be easier to programme than a force resistor. I don't really care about the weight, it is more about calculating how much precious beer is left in the keg.

- 19L in keg minus logged total of liquid poured = (L's total beer left / 0.285ml) = pots of beer left.
- Display on LCD.
- ...
- profit!

Anyways, I had a few beers last night from the keg fridge and ended going on the Internet. Bad move: I ended up buying a Netduino with on-board ethernet and SD module. he he I should have it Tuesday or Wednesday so I'll play around with it next week, and post up some results.
 
I have done a bit of looking around at the Arduino as I am part-way through hacking a digital scale system to tell me how much weight is left in the keg. Will be very rudimentary as I will h ave to minus off the weight of the keg in my head, and that will give me the weight of beer left, which I can approximate to how many litres of beer left. Now that is only a stop-gap measure as I want to display how many beers are left.

Given that I am very comfortable sitting in my MS sandbox and don't particularly have the time or inclination to learn how to develop Nix software I have found the NetDuino very interesting. Uses MS Micro framework and you can use the free C# express IDE or full-blown Visual Studio. It is compatible with all the Arduino shields. Sounds like a winner to me. Bit more expensive than the Arduino though. I'll wait until next month and then plonk some cash down and start playing with it.

I'll post up some thoughts once I've had a play with it into a separate thread.

Cheers,
Angus.

Arduino has become very popular with hobbists as the main aim seems to be spending time on the building - rather than just using something that already works.

If you want to look at something that the professionals use - plus it is Australian designed and built -> see http://www.splatco.com/

You can see How it works or why it is so easy to program.

Interested in what you guys think ?
 
Can you please list or link to some 'professionals' that use it?

Proprietry language/bus/communications....... hmmm


Hi Kirem,

It is all on the Splat website at the link that I provided.

Sample applications.

What sure what you mean by "Proprietry language/bus/communications" but You can use C if you want to 'do it the hard way' or the VB like scripting language.

Protocols supported include Modbus, plus serial, network etc.

Customers include most of the appliances with embedded control such as CPAP respirators, industrial dishwashers etc.

You can see from the list of some of the peripherals that there is a lot of brewery related options;

Dual K-type thermocouple board

Ultrasonic distance measurement + Non-Contact Temperature Measurement (Optional)

On board Temperature and Humidity Measurement + Non-Contact Temperature Measurement (Optional)

Water Level Detector + Analog I/O

RS485 adaptor

Onboard Quadrature Counter

4 analog out

Pressure Sensor

pH Measurement

SD Logger

Ethernet/Internet "SPLat Call Home"


Anything else that you would need for your brewery automation ?
 
Is Xwire and SPice not proprietry?

You list a number of applications, but I asked for a list of 'professionals' that are using it. You state that a number of professionals are using it, who are they?

automated sales? :D
 
Untitled.jpg

by the looks of it the arduino has more program space, RAM , IO and analog channels and costs less that $40
I'm sure they are good units but the arduino has the sheer weight of numbers as in users and freely available information for hacks like me

cheers matho
 
Is Xwire and SPice not proprietry?

You list a number of applications, but I asked for a list of 'professionals' that are using it. You state that a number of professionals are using it, who are they?

automated sales? :D

As they are mainly used by equipment manufacturers as part of their overall control systems they do not make a lot of noise about it - there is no 'Splat Inside' stickers that I have seen.

If you need a detailed reference list then you would need to speak to the company or one of their distributors eg Dontronics or Ocean Controls

I don't know why you are trying to argue with me about "Is Xwire and SPice not proprietry?" - I am not trying to sell you anything, just save you some time and money based on my experience from the past 5 years.

At least with the Arduino there is no concerns with 'proprietary protocols' as from what I see there are none - you have to build everything yourself.

Perhaps an example will help. I have recently included a quadrature encoder to provide a simple menu navigation. The Arduino code seems to be:

[codebox]/*

RotaryInterrupts - a port-read and interrupt based rotary encoder sketch

Created by Joshua Layne (w15p), January 4, 2011.

based largely on: http://www.circuitsathome.com/mcu/reading-...oder-on-arduino

Released into the public domain.

*/



#define ENC_A 2

#define ENC_B 3

#define ENC_PORT PIND

uint8_t bitShift = 2; // change to suit your pins (offset from 0,1 per port)

// Note: You need to choose pins that have Interrupt capability.



int counter;

boolean ticToc;



void setup()

{

pinMode(ENC_A, INPUT);

digitalWrite(ENC_A, HIGH);

pinMode(ENC_B, INPUT);

digitalWrite(ENC_B, HIGH);

Serial.begin (115200);

Serial.println("Start");

counter = 0;

ticToc = false;

// Attach ISR to both interrupts

attachInterrupt(0, read_encoder, CHANGE);

attachInterrupt(1, read_encoder, CHANGE);

}



void loop()

{

// do some stuff here - the joy of interrupts is that they take care of themselves

}



void read_encoder()

{

int8_t enc_states[] = {0,-1,1,0,1,0,0,-1,-1,0,0,1,0,1,-1,0};

static uint8_t encoderState = 0;

static uint8_t stateIndex = 0;

static uint8_t filteredPort = 0;

uint8_t filter = 0x03; // base filter: 0b00000011

filter <<= bitShift;



Serial.print("raw port value: ");

Serial.println(ENC_PORT, BIN);



Serial.print("filter bitmask: ");

Serial.println(filter, BIN);



filteredPort = ENC_PORT & filter;

Serial.print("filtered port state: ");

Serial.println(filteredPort, BIN);



Serial.print("old encoder state: ");

Serial.println(encoderState, BIN);



encoderState &= filter; // filter out everything except the rotary encoder pins

Serial.print("filtered old encoder state: ");

Serial.println(encoderState, BIN);

encoderState <<= 2; // shift existing value two bits to the left
Serial.print("filtered and shifted (<<2) old encoder state: ");
Serial.println(encoderState, BIN);

encoderState |= filteredPort; // add filteredport value
Serial.print("old encoder state + port state: ");
Serial.println(encoderState, BIN);

stateIndex = encoderState >> bitShift;
Serial.print("encoder state index: ");
Serial.println(stateIndex, DEC);

if (ticToc) {
Serial.print("counter tic: ");
Serial.println(enc_states[stateIndex], DEC);
counter += enc_states[stateIndex];
Serial.print("counter: ");
Serial.println(counter, DEC);
}
ticToc = !ticToc;

Serial.println("----------");
}
[/codebox]


A Splat controller reads the ODBC with the commands:
[codebox]

OBQC_Clr ;Reset count to zero
OBQC_fGet ;Copy the onboard quadrature count to W register

; Do whatever with read value

; If you want to display it on the LCD
OBLCD_fDispW[/codebox]

As I said, No axe to grind or Product to sell - just trying to help show that the Arduino wheel has already been invented, built, improved and used by many.
 
View attachment 51636

by the looks of it the arduino has more program space, RAM , IO and analog channels and costs less that $40
I'm sure they are good units but the arduino has the sheer weight of numbers as in users and freely available information for hacks like me

cheers matho

Not sure what you get for $40, but I was under the impression that you had to add all sorts of shields, interface boards, interupt controllers etc ie it was a very low level approach. Much like programming in assembler 40 years ago.

Program size and RAM requirements depend on how efficient your language is - much better to ask "what can you do with it?"

The IO and Analogue channels are plenty and come 'ready to use' ie already have debounce (or raw values can be read) and pull-down resistors built in. The analogue can read voltages or thermistors directly, the Digital inputs can be used as latched inputs (ie on or off) or high speed counters (to read flow meters).

If you are not interested then things like shadow RAM for automatic recovery after a power failure, battery backed real time clock, built in multi-tasking are probably not much use to you.

It just seems to be all there for what I need to control a brewery.

The controller inside a Braumeister is probably a version of the Splat controller ...

... or at least it could be. ;-)
 
As I said, No axe to grind or Product to sell - just trying to help show that the Arduino wheel has already been invented, built, improved and used by many.

I really like the Arduino, as I like to understand everything that goes on underneath. Same reason I got into brewing I guess - I like to know exactly what raw ingredients make up my beer, and exactly what these ingredients do. Same with making cheese, sausages, pancetta, etc etc. True, there are more worked up versions that might save me time, I could even go along the path of brewtroller, but where does it stop? Maybe I could just buy a Brewmeister system and be done with it?

I get what you're saying, but some people like to tinker and find the journey as pleasurable as the destination. Saving time isn't of great importance to me. In fact, ultimately using this technology in brewing isn't *that* important to me, I really just want to understand electronics. And if anything eventuates from that, I can say that I built it. And when it breaks (I know it will, because I built it!), there's the possibility that I might be able to fix it, because I built each component.

And it's cheaper :D
 
As they are mainly used by equipment manufacturers as part of their overall control systems they do not make a lot of noise about it - there is no 'Splat Inside' stickers that I have seen.

If you need a detailed reference list then you would need to speak to the company or one of their distributors eg Dontronics or Ocean Controls

I don't know why you are trying to argue with me about "Is Xwire and SPice not proprietry?" - I am not trying to sell you anything, just save you some time and money based on my experience from the past 5 years.

As I said, No axe to grind or Product to sell - just trying to help show that the Arduino wheel has already been invented, built, improved and used by many.

Listing applications that the controllers can be used in has some credibility, listing manufacturers that have included their controls in their design has lots of credibilty. YOU wrote
If you want to look at something that the professionals use
so who are these professionals (not applications)?

I'm not trying to argue with you, I just asked you to back up what you wrote with solid information and pointed out that they do indeed use proprietry language/bus/communications.

They look like good controllers, but I believe the arduino/sanguino is just as, if not more capable, it's open source and the list of add on boards to add capablity is more extensive than the splat expansion boards list you posted. Shit loads of code has already been written for it, most of the time it is a case of cut and paste, a few mods and upload it.

I'm not arguing, but you can't come in here and write the things you did and not back it up.
 
They look like good controllers, but I believe the arduino/sanguino is just as, if not more capable, it's open source and the list of add on boards to add capablity is more extensive than the splat expansion boards list you posted. Shit loads of code has already been written for it, most of the time it is a case of cut and paste, a few mods and upload it.

Well, this is excellent news - sounds like we are both very happy.

Can't hope for anything better than that !
 
Well, this is excellent news - sounds like we are both very happy.

Can't hope for anything better than that !

David, have you ever thought of taking up politics? Your ability to skirt around straight forward questions would be a skill useful in politics.

Good luck
 
David, have you ever thought of taking up politics? Your ability to skirt around straight forward questions would be a skill useful in politics.

Good luck
No, I am not skirting around the questions - I am just unable to do any more research for you.

I provided some information, links to all the resources, technical support and application notes, as well as stating my experience. Unfortunately you appeared to be unhappy with this and demanded that I provided some sort of 'justification' for my experience and opinion.



kirem said:
so who are these professionals (not applications)?

I'm not trying to argue with you, I just asked you to back up what you wrote with solid information and pointed out that they do indeed use proprietry language/bus/communications.
Dontronics and Oean Controls supply professional engineers and a quick read of the Splat website and the newsletters and blogs describe dozens of real world uses. If it helps you feel better, I am a professional application developer aand process engineer and I use one.

Don't believe I said anything protocols - except to provide additional information on the support for RS485, HTTP and Modbus. Again this is all dealt with on the Splat site if you search for the terms that interest you.

kirem said:
They look like good controllers, but I believe the arduino/sanguino is just as, if not more capable, it's open source and the list of add on boards to add capablity is more extensive than the splat expansion boards list you posted. Shit loads of code has already been written for it, most of the time it is a case of cut and paste, a few mods and upload it.

Do you have any references or other justification for these sweeping statements ?

kirem said:
I'm not arguing, but you can't come in here and write the things you did and not back it up.

Ah, I see that we have reached agreement again about something :icon_cheers:

Good luck
 
Big Fridge
Great to see you firing on both cylinders!
Mayhaps the Triiffids are rising again....there truly is hope for 2012 !!

Kurtz
 
Do you have any references or other justification for these sweeping statements ?
http://www.arduino.cc/
http://sanguino.cc/
it's all there, links to all the resources, technical support and application notes ;)

Is this what you used your "professional application developer and process engineering" to develop?
View attachment 51660
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...st&p=157149
http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...st&p=661979
I am really quite interested in what you have done/doing/plan to do with a splat and brewing, but getting more than just vague comments or links to websites is like extracting teeth from you.

There is also this interesting reference http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum/inde...p?showuser=1492
No longer participating on AHB so please contact me via the NNL Brewery Services webpage:
http://nnlbrewery.com.au
 
I am really quite interested in what you have done/doing/plan to do with a splat and brewing, but getting more than just vague comments or links to websites is like extracting teeth from you.

I am not meaning to be vague - I was only suggesting that some of you may benefit from looking at an alternative technology as much of what you are trying to 'invent' has already been done.

I have never offered to discuss my projects. As a professional developer much of what I do is covered by confidentiality agreements with my clients.

The image that you referenced is an early prototype/test rig. I have now added a Quadrature counter to provide the menu navigation, selection and activation of the n-channel process control system. All in a few hundred lines of code.

My current rig uses a real time clock to fire up the HLT heater, pressure transducer for level control, flow meter and high-low float switch to automate the sparge and controlled kettle fill, boil and whirlpool.

Think how you dial in your cycle times into an automatic washing machine and it fills, washes, spins and beeps that the load is done.


Ah, that's right - I had found that the 'signal to noise ratio' had become unpleasant. Thanks for reminding me.

Over and out.
 
Matho (and perhaps others)

I received my NetDuino last night and after quickly doing the "Hello World" equivalent of flashing the onboard LED, and listening for the button push to flash the led, I wanted to quickly move onto something a bit more substantial. I have a spare temp sensor (I bought the stainless steel one for immersing in my fermenter) from my Fridgemate and thought I would hook that up. I couldn't really find any info on what requirements it needed: voltage, etc, etc. I have done some reading on NTC temp sensors and none of them really mention voltage requirements, more on current.

Or do I just ignore the Fridgemate sensor as I can't find technical data and purchase a temp sensor designed for the Arduino/Netduino?

Thanks,
Angus.
 
OK, so I have completed my brewing controller and it is testing wonderfully.

I thought you might like to see a few photos of the set up.

I am really looking forward to starting my first brew in there, currently it's testing with water...

A little unassuming....
IMG_20120120_203146.jpg


A nice bright and large display so I can see it from anywhere
IMG_20120120_203200.jpg


A tidy rear-panel, with two outputs and Ethernet
IMG_20120120_203407.jpg


A look inside the box, where the magic happens
IMG_20120120_203231.jpg


Doors open
IMG_20120120_204256.jpg



Interface
sshot.png

Tell me your thoughts...
 
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