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American Grown Euro Hops

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Tony

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Hey folks.

I was wondering if anyone has tried the american grown Hallertau and Tettnanger hop pellets?

I figure they will be a bit different, but are they any good?

cheers
 

Tony

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no-one?

Maybe i should do some do some pioneering :)
 

Goldenchild

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Not really much help to your question but I used the hop 'crystal' which is a U.S noble style hop similar to halletau in a dunkelweizen. It tasted awesome coming out of the fermenter but unfortunately picked up an infection when I racked it. So now I have a 2 month old sour dunkelweizen
 

Tony

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Well seems i am trying something new.

Order placed, will inform when i brew with it :)
 

Bribie G

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I'd guess American grown varieties of Euro Hops would be in the same catagory of New Zealand grown varieties of American and Euro hops - good in their own right but grown in a different climate with different soils. Not a bad thing but you'd expect some differences. I really like NZ Cascade and prefer it to the US, as with the Fuggles - however some varieties such as NZ Hallertau Aroma are very nice in their own right, but not Quite Germanic, and thank goodness they stopped calling varieties BSaaz, DSaaz etc and gave them distinctive Kiwi names.

Now on the subject of Chinese Saaz B) B) B)
 

Tony

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Chinese...........NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I expect them to be different, and am keen to see how the pan out.

I agree with loving NZ Cascade, and B Saaz..... whatever they call it now :p

Gunna give this Mt hood stuff a run too.... 2011 crop :)
 

Bribie G

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US hops are cheaper because the farms can sell direct to you, e.g. Hopsdirect. The entire NZ crop (well almost the entire crop I guess :ph34r:) is handled by a "single desk" like wheat used to be here, so prices controlled. That's why you can't just hop online and order them.
 

Hargie

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Gunna give this Mt hood stuff a run too.... 2011 crop :)

...heya Tony...Liberty is a fantastic American grown Hallertau Mittlefrue....absolutely love it, always have some on hand.. its said to be the closest to German Hall MF of all
the US Hallertau clones....it starts out a little course in young beers , but mellows beautifully into lovely soft ,spicy notes...

...have used US tett in the past ...not bad...as far as i know it is actually a Fuggles pedigree , not Tett at all...
 

Nick JD

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...have used US tett in the past ...not bad...as far as i know it is actually a Fuggles pedigree , not Tett at all...
Isn't fuggles UK-grown Tettnang?

The whole tettnang/fuggles/williamette kaboodle?
 

Tony

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I always thought willamette was US grown fuggle, but not sure on the Tetnanger thing
 

freezkat

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Now on the subject of Chinese Saaz B) B) B)
they taste like oppression.


I just got some American Saaz and Hallertau. When I get an open fermenter I'll let you know
 

Hargie

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I always thought willamette was US grown fuggle, but not sure on the Tetnanger thing

"American hops sold as Tettnanger hops often claim to be the same cultivar as the famous German aroma hop Tettnang Tettnanger. However, in recent years, it has been discovered that these hops are genetically distinct from the German landrace and in fact are most likely Fuggle or a closely related hop. The most likely explanation is that American hop growers imported the so-called Swiss Tettnanger hops, which may also have been Fuggle hops misrepresented as Tettnanger for marketing purposes.

In recent years, a few growers have tried growing true Tettnanger hops in the United States, but because of the confusion of names, these are almost impossible to find or identify."

...this is from home brew wiki....not where i originally read about it a few years ago , but essentially the same info.....and yeah , willamette is know to be a fuggles cultivar also...and styrian goldings....they all have that same kind of earthy, marmalade character to my palette...
 

MHB

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We grow true to type Hallertau, Tetnanger and Saaz here in Australia naturally they taste very different to the same stock grown in Germany or the US for that matter, as do the Kiwi true to type versions. Used to annoy the bejesus out of me that hops with 1/8 - 1/16 Saaz in their ancestry were marketed as D Saaz and the like glad thats been put behind us.
The thing with Tetnang being called Fuggle in the US is fairly old news and shouldnt have much impact on us here unless you are importing your own in which case you might need to exercise some care, Im pretty sure the brokers that import the hops have their heads around this and dont bring in the questionable varieties.
Willamette is a Triploid of Fuggle, same gens just more copies, breeders do this to get more abundant flowering and often bigger more robust plants, case in point being the NZ Hallertau Aroma breed from an Hallertau triploid.
As a retailer I have to choose what to stock and can only stock a limited range of about 40 hops so I choose the ones that made the hop famous, Hallertau from Hallertau, Hersbrucker from Hersbrusk and so on, which is sometimes a bit of a shame got some NZ Fuggle a while ago and it was truly magnificent just wish I had more storage room.
What I suppose the point is, is that if you want the typical characteristics of a hop like Saaz in a Pilsner choose the one that made the style what it is, the difference in price is minimal, if you just want to experiment go to town just dont be surprised if US Saaz isnt quite what you were expecting.
Mark
 

geoffd

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As a general rule hops grown in new world climate tend to be fruity/piney/woody whereas old world tend to be floral, spicy, herbal, earthy, & a few other descriptors.

a good case being Saaz (floral spicy), Lublin (saaz in poland) very similar, & B Saaz, a totally different beast, particularly in a dark beer it has a massive blackberry flavour, different again in ligthter beers, but definitely a completely different hop to the original

The main difference old world to new; is the need to use fungicides, in Eu they use copper sulphide to conain the more rampant bacterias & fungi in the damper climate, this has a massive impact on flavour. God knows what the Chinese might use on their soil, it would be regional I guess, I have no idea & it's a big country with a broader climate variance even than our big piece of turf.
 

MHB

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As FJ said, another big difference is in the processing, the Germans tend to air dry quite thoroughly before bailing; the Americans press a lot greener which emphasises the traits mentioned. When hops started travelling from the US to Europe there were howls of protest from many brewers until the Americans changed the way they processed their hops for the European market.
If you want real horror stories have a look at the pesticide levels in hops from Eastern Europe from before the fall of communism pretty scary levels of DDT.
Mark
 

Tony

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We grow true to type Hallertau, Tetnanger and Saaz here in Australia naturally they taste very different to the same stock grown in Germany or the US for that matter, as do the Kiwi true to type versions. Used to annoy the bejesus out of me that hops with 1/8 - 1/16 Saaz in their ancestry were marketed as D Saaz and the like glad thats been put behind us.
The thing with Tetnang being called Fuggle in the US is fairly old news and shouldnt have much impact on us here unless you are importing your own in which case you might need to exercise some care, Im pretty sure the brokers that import the hops have their heads around this and dont bring in the questionable varieties.
Willamette is a Triploid of Fuggle, same gens just more copies, breeders do this to get more abundant flowering and often bigger more robust plants, case in point being the NZ Hallertau Aroma breed from an Hallertau triploid.
As a retailer I have to choose what to stock and can only stock a limited range of about 40 hops so I choose the ones that made the hop famous, Hallertau from Hallertau, Hersbrucker from Hersbrusk and so on, which is sometimes a bit of a shame got some NZ Fuggle a while ago and it was truly magnificent just wish I had more storage room.
What I suppose the point is, is that if you want the typical characteristics of a hop like Saaz in a Pilsner choose the one that made the style what it is, the difference in price is minimal, if you just want to experiment go to town just dont be surprised if US Saaz isnt quite what you were expecting.
Mark
Good info as always Mark.

Yourself and other retailers can only keep so many types of hops in stock, and people will usually use the true strain varieries. Keeping US grown Hallertau in stock for a retailer is only going to be a cost fail.

I have tried all these true strain hops to death, and love them to bits, but want to see what characters some of these varieties grown in different areas can bring to my beers. I really love the NZ hops and also agree that name changes were needed.... they are nothing like the 1/16th blood heritage manes given to them origionally, they are their own thing for sure.

PS.

Im not trying to spark a "lets buy cheap hops from the USA" here...... yes its cheaper, but i wanted to try something not available to me here and only ordered a small amount. Id rather support Aussie retailers, and local ones if they let me :p
 

geoffd

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I agree Mark, I believe it is commonly used in China too, without being crop or regien specific. But that is just hearsay on my part. I havent any proof at hand to substantiate it, kinda why I was a bit vague on Chinese soil in my first post.
 
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