Wort Chiller

[yardy]

gday brewers,

just a question on a counterflow chiller made from 12mm OD (8mm ID) stainless tube inside 25mm OD stainless tube (rolled), which diameter tube would be ideal to run the wort through, the 25mm or the 12mm ?

pics available if it helps

cheers

Dave

 

[yardy]

 

[Doogiechap]

Bloke I would opt for the 12mm wort path as it's 'surrounded' by the cooling effect as opposed to having a far smaller percentage of it's contact area in touch with the cooler inner tube if you get my drift.
That is a seriously nice piece of kit BTW :kooi:
Cheers
Doug

 

[Synthetase]

Yep, run it through the inner tube. The surface area to volume ratio will be much higher giving you more efficient heat exchange.

 

[yardy]

yeah thanks fellas, i had a look at the chillzilla which is similar, a guy on another forum has good results with a pre chiller also, seen here http://www.homebrewdownunder.com/index.php?topic=689.0

next step is to get some valves, fittings, hose etc and do some trials, don't know if it's been done before but I was thinking of some rolled copper permanently fitted to a pot as a pre chiller, filling the pot with water and freezing o'nite as opposed to just chucking the pre chiller in a bucket of ice water..

cheers

 

[Sammus]

I think a bucket of crushed ice or just ice cubes then topped up with water is better for a prechiller, if you freeze the whole pot, you tend to form a thin layer of water around the coil that heats up more quickly than the ice around it melts and cools it.

 

[Synthetase]

Agreed Sammus. I use a few old juice/soda bottles of frozen water in a bucket of water for that. It's a lot easier than dealing with cubes. Although with weather like this, I haven't needed to

 

[yardy]

I think a bucket of crushed ice or just ice cubes then topped up with water is better for a prechiller, if you freeze the whole pot, you tend to form a thin layer of water around the coil that heats up more quickly than the ice around it melts and cools it.

Agreed Sammus. I use a few old juice/soda bottles of frozen water in a bucket of water for that. It's a lot easier than dealing with cubes. Although with weather like this, I haven't needed to

thanks, what's the opinion on when to use the pre chiller ?

all the way through the chilling process, continuously topping up with ice, or hook it up once the wort is down to say 50*C ?

Dave

 

[Offline]

Nice looking bit of gear there Yardy

The contact area between the 2 liquids will be the same no matter which way you go, ie the surface area of the inner tube. however the volumes will be vastly different.

which one will be easier to clean?

another option would be to use the outer tube for wort, then place the whole thing in a bucket of ice water. effectively using both tubes surface areas.

as far as when to use a prechiller, or chucking it in a bucket of ice water, it depends on your tap water temp, your desired final temp and how much ice you have/want to make.

if you have heaps of ice you can use it the whole time.

if you have a limited amount of ice and your tap water temp close to or higher than your final desired wort temp you'll need to have ice left at the end. so best to wait before starting it

 

[dmac80]

Is that a water sample chiller from a wet rack Yardy?
I've been looking at those and thinking they would be perfect for this purpose.

 

[Synthetase]

thanks, what's the opinion on when to use the pre chiller ?

all the way through the chilling process, continuously topping up with ice, or hook it up once the wort is down to say 50*C ?

Dave

I would use it all the way through. You certainly wont run out of ice in the ~10 min or so it takes to cool the wort (ymmv, I gravity feed mine, takes 11 min for 24L) and if you do get a bit below your pitching temp, you can always let it sit for a short stint before pitching - or just pitch anyway and warm it up to fermentation temp over an hour or two.

 

[yardy]

Nice looking bit of gear there Yardy

The contact area between the 2 liquids will be the same no matter which way you go, ie the surface area of the inner tube. however the volumes will be vastly different.

which one will be easier to clean?

another option would be to use the outer tube for wort, then place the whole thing in a bucket of ice water. effectively using both tubes surface areas.

as far as when to use a prechiller, or chucking it in a bucket of ice water, it depends on your tap water temp, your desired final temp and how much ice you have/want to make.

if you have heaps of ice you can use it the whole time.

if you have a limited amount of ice and your tap water temp close to or higher than your final desired wort temp you'll need to have ice left at the end. so best to wait before starting it

thanks mate but i can't take the credit for making it

i think the idea of using the 25mm X 2mm for the wort and sinking the whole chiller in an ice bath is the first trial i will go with, thanks again.

cheers

I would use it all the way through. You certainly wont run out of ice in the ~10 min or so it takes to cool the wort (ymmv, I gravity feed mine, takes 11 min for 24L) and if you do get a bit below your pitching temp, you can always let it sit for a short stint before pitching - or just pitch anyway and warm it up to fermentation temp over an hour or two.

thanks for the reply mate, if the above trial doesn't work i'll give it a go, our bore water is between 23 and 24 degrees btw.

cheers

Dave

 

[yardy]

I'm looking for a temp probe/thermo to screw into the chiller, not the large thread shown at the bottom of the pic, the 8mm hole at the top with bolt in it.

anyone have a link ?

cheers

Dave

 

[schooey]

That'd be ideal to put a probe in near the end for a PLC to control a variable flow valve on the beer out line... even better with a 200L glycol unit running through the cooling side... but how far do we need to go? Nice to dream though...

 

[yardy]

That'd be ideal to put a probe in near the end for a PLC to control a variable flow valve on the beer out line... even better with a 200L glycol unit running through the cooling side... but how far do we need to go? Nice to dream though...

even better as a CFC if I can find a probe :icon_cheers:

i suppose i could fit a MM Therm to the kettle at a push, but it would be nice to know the temp of the wort in the CFC, I've decided to run the wort through the 25mm pipe with coolant running through the 12mm with the whole unit fixed into a stainless pot filled with ice.

 

[schooey]

I meant as a CFC!

You measure the temp of the wort going out and the PLC adjusts the flow of wort through the coil via the adustable flow valve to maintain the temp you set the PLC at. The glycol unit could be pushing ~-20C glycol mix through the cooling side of the CFC to reduce the time.

Hate to be paying for it all though...

Edit: As for a probe, start here or here

 

[yardy]

I meant as a CFC!

well why didn't you say so

thanks for the links Schoo, think I'll run with a MM therm in the Kettle.

cheers

 

[schooey]

think I'll run with a MM therm in the Kettle.

I wouldn't.... spend the little bit extra and buy yourself a Tel-tru, you won't regret it

 

[yardy]

an update on this here http://www.homebrewdownunder.com/index.php...40.msg23354#new

cheers

 

[Tony]

awsome piece of kit!

One thing im wondering...... would have been better to run the inner coil as copper to get better heat transfer from the wort to the water?