Where do you buy LOW quality ingredients?

[megabyte]

So I've heard it everywhere - recipe guides, forum posts, brewing texts...
"only use the best quality ingredients you can source"

What does this actually mean? Are they stating the obvious - that you should avoid that bag of hops you found behind the fridge and your left over grain from bulk buy 1999, or is there actually some grey market of B grade malts and counterfeit hops that I'm missing out on?

 

[Bribie G]

Marco Polo

do a search

 

[sp0rk]

Joe White, the cheapest most average malt IMHO
I get huge variances between batches, to the point where I won't buy it anymore once I've finished my current sack (now I can afford not to be a cheap prick)
Even Barrett Burston (which I've only used a few times in small amounts) is the same price and performs far better.
Like Bribie mentioned, the Chinese hop sage produced some average products
But I'm sort of tempted to actually organise another chinese bulk buy to see if they've improved any...

 

[good4whatAlesU]

Guessing it means - fresh, within use by date etc. . less scrupulous shops may have some old stock they try and get out the door.

Also 'best' might refer to correct type for the application. i.e. don't try and make one of those new fangled "hoppy beers" with 5 grams of East Kent Goldings.

 

[peteru]

It's not that hard to find a dusty can of Woolies "Homebrand Lager" that has about 3 months left on the use by date. I guess that would have to be in the low quality and low cost (at $6.95) category.

 

[megabyte]

Marco Polo

Ahh yes, I did go in on that Chinese hop bulk buy way back. We knew what we were getting into and it was a fun ride, but that's a perfect answer to my question!

It's not that hard to find a dusty can of Woolies "Homebrand Lager" that has about 3 months left on the use by date. I guess that would have to be in the low quality and low cost (at $6.95) category.

I do have an old can of Homebrand Lager sitting in my cupboard. I pray that I will never find a use for it.

Joe White, the cheapest most average malt IMHO
I get huge variances between batches, to the point where I won't buy it anymore once I've finished my current sack (now I can afford not to be a cheap prick)
Even Barrett Burston (which I've only used a few times in small amounts) is the same price and performs far better.

This info is very useful to me and makes perfect sense. I thought JW malts were just cheaper because they're locally produced, but now that you mention it I notice there was a lot of bad publicity about their quality in the past. Thanks for the tip, you may have improved my next batch!

 

[goatus]

I do have an old can of Homebrand Lager sitting in my cupboard. I pray that I will never find a use for it.

I cracked a really old one to make up some wort for a yeast starter when i ran out of dme and couldnt be assed going to the LHBS.. worked a charm =)

 

[megabyte]

I cracked a really old one to make up some wort for a yeast starter when i ran out of dme and couldnt be assed going to the LHBS.. worked a charm =)

Genius! - I tend to cool and decant my starters so I might try this one day.

 

[Lord Raja Goomba I]

A few years ago, I received a can of coopers dark ale for free that was several years out of date. No bitterness and I didn't adjust for it. It was average at best, but definitely cheap.

 

[Bribie G]

I once made an Aldi brown ale using Aldi oats, brown sugar and Aldi weetbix as adjuncts.

 

[good4whatAlesU]

At the other extreme .. I've freighted into Australia malts from overseas that aren't available here.

About $20 worth of Malt, freight was $40 freight.

Could fit into the term "only use the best quality ingredients you can source" .. "Others might term it "that's over the top, your'e an *****" . .

 

[Dave70]

Once made a Haan Lite clone by using 90% Home Brand rice, 10% cornmeal and bread yeast.
Subbed Sarachi Ace with some squeeze bottle lemon juice.

 

[dannymars]

I'm doing a double IPA this weekend,

I've had to go to three different shops to make sure I'm getting fresh examples of all the hops I need. One shop had all the varieties, although only one was 2015, the rest 2014... probably doesn't matter, but I want this IIPA to pop hard... can't cut corners when you are putting almost $200 worth in... (1KG!! into 50L)

blimey

 

[clickeral]

I do have an old can of Homebrand Lager sitting in my cupboard. I pray that I will never find a use for it.

Happy to take it of your hands for experimentation processes in fact if anyone has anything they don't want to use feel free to send it my way

 

[Bribie G]

Once made a Haan Lite clone by using 90% Home Brand rice, 10% cornmeal and bread yeast.
Subbed Sarachi Ace with some squeeze bottle lemon juice.

You could have made Corona by subbing lime for the lemon.. why didn't you think of that at the time?

 

[megabyte]

I'm doing a double IPA this weekend,

I've had to go to three different shops to make sure I'm getting fresh examples of all the hops I need. One shop had all the varieties, although only one was 2015, the rest 2014... probably doesn't matter, but I want this IIPA to pop hard... can't cut corners when you are putting almost $200 worth in... (1KG!! into 50L)

blimey

Amen. Often the one store selling the fresh hops you need is missing the yeast or specialty malts. I often order from more than one store, but the postage sure adds up when you're brewing single batches.

 

[mckenry]

Joe White, the cheapest most average malt IMHO
I get huge variances between batches, to the point where I won't buy it anymore once I've finished my current sack (now I can afford not to be a cheap prick)
Even Barrett Burston (which I've only used a few times in small amounts) is the same price and performs far better.
Like Bribie mentioned, the Chinese hop sage produced some average products
But I'm sort of tempted to actually organise another chinese bulk buy to see if they've improved any...

This info is very useful to me and makes perfect sense. I thought JW malts were just cheaper because they're locally produced, but now that you mention it I notice there was a lot of bad publicity about their quality in the past. Thanks for the tip, you may have improved my next batch!

This is not 'very useful'. That was sp0rk's own opinion. He says so.
Joe White is a good malt. Anyone wants to offload their JW to me, shoot me a pm.

 

[sp0rk]

This is not 'very useful'. That was sp0rk's own opinion. He says so.
Joe White is a good malt. Anyone wants to offload their JW to me, shoot me a pm.

I know it was a few years ago now but
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/substandard-malt-by-joe-white-leaves-brewers-bitter/news-story/d872f5ec946a0511744cd61dbd47b2a5

This isn't just an opinion, it's an observation of quality via comparison over multiple batches of beer (and mutliple batches of malt) with other brand malts, I know certain vendors who don't stock JW now because of dissatisfaction with their malts.
If it works fine for you, that's cool, but I haven't been happy with it

 

[mckenry]

I know it was a few years ago now but
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/substandard-malt-by-joe-white-leaves-brewers-bitter/news-story/d872f5ec946a0511744cd61dbd47b2a5

This isn't just an opinion, it's an observation of quality via comparison over multiple batches of beer (and mutliple batches of malt) with other brand malts, I know certain vendors who don't stock JW now because of dissatisfaction with their malts.
If it works fine for you, that's cool, but I haven't been happy with it

Yep, I've read all that before. I Remember the hoo-ha well. I'm not having a go at you, just stating that it was your humble opinion, as you wrote IMHO.
And yeah, I've never had variances between batches.
I always take homebrewers slagging off at the biggest (brewers, maltsters, yeast manufactures etc) with a pinch of salt.
You might be right though.

 

[klangers]

Joe White are objectively worse than their (EDIT: international) competitors. They provide significant amounts of malt to the big brewers for a low prices. These breweries have the ability to test the malt themselves and internally adjust their process to compensate for lower quality malt.

Malting is an incredibly energy and water intensive process. All the water run off (talking millions of litres per day) needs to go through a waste water treatment plant prior to discharging to sewer - more electricity used. Therefore, there is a natural tendency to reduce the duration and increase the temperature of germination (for example) in order to save money. A good malt needs a slow and cool (<16 degC) germination - obviously in Western NSW (Where JW are) it's very hot and hence the warmer the germination, the less money they spend on electricity.