Washing New Pet Bottles

[mwd]

Coopers bottles come in a box caps in a plastic bag.

For the sake of two minutes and a splash of non rinse why risk wasting a brew.

Makes no sense at all to me.

Its your brew do as you like you will be drinking it.

 

[thylacine]

Re: bottling time

I fill two 7 litre buckets. One with 'pink' detergent / or unscented napisan (cleaning) ; the second with idophor solution (sanitising).

I re-clean & sanitise (from the last time I used/cleaned them) the surfaces on/near which the fermenter, bottles and caps will sit. (the latter two with glad wrap as well). The bottling wand, my hands, wrists & forearms, the fermenter tap surfaces, my hands, the carbonation drops bag & the knife used to open them, my hands, AND the bottles/caps (new or old). Oh, and my hands.
I actually do the bottles/caps first while the cleaning/sanitation solutions are 'purest'.
REASONS: good cleaning/sanitation, established temperature control are prerequisites to successful recipes.

 

[Nick JD]

Re: bottling time

I fill two 7 litre buckets. One with 'pink' detergent / or unscented napisan (cleaning) ; the second with idophor solution (sanitising).

I re-clean & sanitise (from the last time I used/cleaned them) the surfaces on/near which the fermenter, bottles and caps will sit. (the latter two with glad wrap as well). The bottling wand, my hands, wrists & forearms, the fermenter tap surfaces, my hands, the carbonation drops bag & the knife used to open them, my hands, AND the bottles/caps (new or old). Oh, and my hands.
I actually do the bottles/caps first while the cleaning/sanitation solutions are 'purest'.
REASONS: good cleaning/sanitation, established temperature control are prerequisites to successful recipes.

What about all the microbes carried in on the air. How do you kill them? I'd be worried. I'd also be wearing a mask, or simply not breathing.

 

[thylacine]

What about all the microbes carried in on the air. How do you kill them? I'd be worried. I'd also be wearing a mask, or simply not breathing.

"...or simply not breathing..." Yes, certainly a good strategy where verbal diarrhea is prevalent...


xxoo

 

[ianh]

What about all the microbes carried in on the air. How do you kill them? I'd be worried. I'd also be wearing a mask, or simply not breathing.

I with you Nick JD, the guys make me laugh with their fixation about sanitation.

I have about 250 PET bottles and all the see is beer and water

 

[Nick JD]

I with you Nick JD, the guys make me laugh with their fixation about sanitation.

I have about 250 PET bottles and all the see is beer and water

Same. Hot tap water ... priming sugar ... beer ... cap. Drink ... rinse out sediment ... dry. Repeat.

And now we'll get the tirade of "your beer would taste better if it were bottled with more sanitation, like mine" - and to that I say, meh. I had an infected bottle a few years back - probably from a lump of crud that wouldn't have been got rid of if I did use sanitizer and an ebola biohazard suit.

I still morn that lost bottle. Haunts me ... the waste.

 

[bum]

I'd think a tirade of "who are you to laugh at other people's processes?" was more in order. If anyone wants to go OTT on positive procedures why should you guys care if they "waste" their time?

 

[ianh]

I don't even use hot water. They get rinsed 3 times with cold water the morning after then tipped upside down to drain.

 

[ianh]

I'd think a tirade of "who are you to laugh at other people's processes?" was more in order. If anyone wants to go OTT on positive procedures why should you guys care if they "waste" their time?

Happen laugh is the wrong word but I can't understand what seems an obsession with sanitising things on AHB.

It may depend partly on where you live, I think sanitising things may be more important in say tropical QLD rather than down here in Tasmania.

It could also be influenced by your background in brewing. I used to brew in plastic dustbins rather than fermenters, still never had a problem. If I had a problem then I will probably change my ways.

 

[mattbrewer]

I don't really care what people do, but try a little experiment. Use a good cleaner and rinse glass, plastic and stainless that has been in contact with sugar/hops/beer. Have a look at the shit and dis-coloured liquid that comes off especially if they haven't been cleaned for a while.

Good brewing, Matt.

 

[Fourstar]

Happen laugh is the wrong word but I can't understand what seems an obsession with sanitising things on AHB.

If i can avoid having off flavours in my beer and having to tip 20 odd L of beer down the drain i will.

Fermentation happens on a microbiological level so i will do everything i can to ensure by little yeast buddies can do their job without having to battle a war with brett and wild yeasts.

For the sake of saving 20 bucks on Starsan every year and a few extra minutes in your process to sanitise everything, its well worth the effort. Whats the use of having car insurance if you never use it? I'll keep my sanitation safety blanket thankyou very much.

Post fermentation, its easy to get away without a sanitisation step due to beer pH, anerobic conditions and other variables but in the long run your beer will loose the battle in the bottle if nasties are lurking (which they are in your tap water).

 

[Nick JD]

... in the long run your beer will loose the battle in the bottle if nasties are lurking (which they are in your tap water).

I strongly disagree. Microbes in tap water are not even capable of overpowering a small amount of yeast pre-fermentation. I know this because I make beer from tap water (from an unchlorinated source too) - often, for the last 20 years. So I'm just gonna have to call a big horsehockey on that one.

But sanitizing your hands? Are we scooping beer out with our fingers? To someone who doesn't sanitize the bottles, I'm gonna have a little chuckle. Are these microbes able to walk? Going to those lengths of sanitization worried about contact contamination and doing nothing to purify the air circulating the operation is like washing your hands when using a public toilet and then opening the door on your way out, getting 100 other guy's dick cheese on your fingers.

 

[bum]

Wouldn't happen if everyone washed their hands.

But honestly, you do know you did kinda gave a valid argument for his behaviour with that bit at the end that you think is damning him, right?

Regardless, I don't scrub up like a doctor when I put down a brew but the incidental hand-wetting during the sanitation process probably goes some way to knocking off the worst of any bugs so it's not worth worrying about IMO but, again, why should any of us give a shit if someone else does? How is it going to impact on me? How is it going to ruin their beer? None of us should care if someone else wants to take 30 seconds to do something that might stop the dick cheese of 100 men getting into their beer.

 

[Fourstar]

None of us should care if someone else wants to take 30 seconds to do something that might stop the dick cheese of 100 men getting into their beer.

And that is the reason why we sanitise. :beerbang:

I dont know what kind of magic wand you wave over your bottles Nick JD without sanitising but if it works, im glad it does for you. When i was bottling (which now only happens for transportation/comps), even with sanitising and a rigourous cleaning regieme i still ended up with a few bottles that where gushers after 6months~ in the bottle. Another reason why i moved to kegging. If you are only sanitising one vessel, the chances are you will get it right and can spend more time on preparing that one vessel.

On the other hand if you are sanitising 30 longnecks or 60 stubbies, surely you will have a higher chance of having one bad apple in the bunch. It brings me back to my insurance policy. I'm happy to invest in insurance for my beer, but if you want to go commando, you run those risks on your own.

Beers! :icon_cheers:

 

[raven19]

If i can avoid having off flavours in my beer and having to tip 20 odd L of beer down the drain i will.

Fermentation happens on a microbiological level so i will do everything i can to ensure by little yeast buddies can do their job without having to battle a war with brett and wild yeasts.

For the sake of saving 20 bucks on Starsan every year and a few extra minutes in your process to sanitise everything, its well worth the effort. Whats the use of having car insurance if you never use it? I'll keep my sanitation safety blanket thankyou very much.

Post fermentation, its easy to get away without a sanitisation step due to beer pH, anerobic conditions and other variables but in the long run your beer will loose the battle in the bottle if nasties are lurking (which they are in your tap water).

+1 mate, right on imo.

 

[Nick JD]

...why should any of us give a shit if someone else does? How is it going to impact on me?

I've met so, so many brewers who "brew by rote" rather than taking the time to understand the process.

People come on these sites to learn - it doesn't matter to me what other brewers do either ... but it's nice to have people see there's two sides to the story isn't it?

Otherwise we'd all believe that we needed what Carlton have, to make good beer (and that's clearly the opposite).

So if someone who is wondering if they really need to go to such huge lengths to kill bacteria in an environment they are just about to introduce a healthy gram-positive fungi into + alcohol and acid ... well, it might help if they have some understanding of how few microbes can prosper in the bottle.

Next you'll be telling no chill brewers they'll all get botulism.

 

[bum]

What a strange leap to be making. I'm going to go immediately from saying you have no right to tell people that they are being too clean in their brewing to telling others that their process is wrong?

You are a very smart gentleman. I am impressed at your mastery of rhetoric.

 

[Bribie G]

Came late to this thread: I was of the mindset "the bottles are brand new in a box, what could possibly be wrong with them" and bottled a batch of SuperLandlord using new BrewCraft PETs. I entered two in the QLD State comp and sent two down to Butters for tasting with Dr Smurto and Muckey. Their first bottle was pronounced good, but the second bottle was cloudy with a twang and not up to scratch. The bottles that went into the state comp got a silver.

I arsed that one, but won't be doing that again, for the sake of a few furious minutes of Starsan. I haven't actually picked up any bad bottles with the rest of the batch yet, but from now on I'm not taking chances.

 

[Fourstar]

I arsed that one, but won't be doing that again, for the sake of a few furious minutes of Starsan. I haven't actually picked up any bad bottles with the rest of the batch yet, but from now on I'm not taking chances.

Good Insurance Policy Bribie! B)

 

[Eyelusion]

When it comes to brewing, you can't be clean enough.
Well that what I think.