Victory Substitute

[SG9090]

Hi all,

I was reading older messages about a substitute of Victory, and did not see anyone mention Dingemans Biscuit Malt from Grape and Grain im quite new to the AG brewing and from what i understand it sounds as if it would be quite a good substitute though have not seen it mentioned.
Have i over looked something?

Regards,

Shane

 

[bum]

I've read a few people mention it is a decent sub but there seems to be more recommendations for amber malt. Dunno how many of those recommending it have used Victory but I was personally swayed enough by sheer weight of numbers to order some amber as a sub myself today.

Looking forward to replies that make me regret not asking for myself.

 

[manticle]

Pretty sure victory = biscuit. Whether belgian biscuit = english biscuit is another story but that's where I would start. Not experienced with victory malt but I can state with certainty that dingeman's biscuit is fantastic.

 

[bum]

Pretty sure victory = biscuit.

GAH!

I can state with certainty that dingeman's biscuit is fantastic.

Seconded.

 

[Wolfy]

In the front of my Brewing Classic Styles I have the following condensed summery of most similar threads on these and other forums:
Victory = biscuit / amber / (melanoidan)

 

[RobB]

.....and did not see anyone mention Dingemans Biscuit Malt .......

I'm pretty sure that Dingeman's malts have only been readily available on these shores for the last year or two, which might explain why it wasn't mentioned.

Palmer's How To Brew gives the same description to Biscuit and Victory, which he lists under Amber Malt 25 Lovibond. Sounds like Biscuit is what you're after.

 

[Fourstar]

for the record, biscuit and amber, regardless of the EBC are DIFFERENT malts. the reason why is one is partially converted in the husk and then kilned, the other is kinled green.

from memory, amber is kilned dry until it reaches it requied EBC, biscuit is kilned wet unitil it reaces its required EBC. victory is closest to biscuit because of this. atleast thats what i remember.

melanoiden is more like munich or biscuit than amber due to it being kilened wet.

 

[bum]

for the record, biscuit and amber, regardless of the EBC are DIFFERENT malts. the reason why is one is partially converted in the husk and then kilned, the other is kinled green.

from memory, amber is kilned dry until it reaches it requied EBC, biscuit is kilned wet unitil it reaces its required EBC. victory is closest to biscuit because of this. atleast thats what i remember.

melanoiden is more like munich or biscuit than amber due to it being kilened wet.

GAH! again after Wolfy's PHEW!

Fourstar, my understanding of malt processing methods is not the best, would you say that choosing amber over biscuit would leave me overshooting the mark or under?

 

[Fourstar]

GAH! again after Wolfy's PHEW!

Fourstar, my understanding of malt processing methods is not the best, would you say that choosing amber over biscuit would leave me overshooting the mark or under?

it would be like choosing caraaroma instead of brown/chocolate malt.

gest the gist? DIFFERENT. just because the EBC is in the same range, its still different because of the way its converted/produced.

To me, amber is astringent whereas biscuit is more v/dark breadcust/digestive biscuit like.

EDIT: basically if you cannot get biscuit use munich or melanoiden before you use amber.

 

[bum]

To me, amber is astringent whereas biscuit is more v/dark breadcust/digestive biscuit like.

Shiiiiiiit...it is going in a beer with a fair whack of roast barley and black patent! Although I don't get much (any) biscuity/breadcrusty goodness from the beer I'm copying (an American RIS) so I'll go with my gut and vague impressions from US brewers who might (I bloody hope so) have used Victory themselves.

Sorry for the derail, SG9090, and thanks for the info, Fourstar.

[EDIT: Don't want to give the impression I'm deliberately ignoring you, Fourstar. I do appreciate your well reasoned suggestions. I've never used Amber yet and in this instance we're talking 2.something% of the grist so I'm happy to suck it and see. Thanks again, I do appreciate it.]

 

[manticle]

EDIT: basically if you cannot get biscuit use munich or melanoiden before you use amber.

I find weyermans vienna has some similar qualities to dingemans biscuit- toasty, biscuity, nutty etc. Less so JW vienna.

 

[Fourstar]

[EDIT: Don't want to give the impression I'm deliberately ignoring you, Fourstar. I do appreciate your well reasoned suggestions. I've never used Amber yet and in this instance we're talking 2.something% of the grist so I'm happy to suck it and see. Thanks again, I do appreciate it.]

Hey, no issues here. I didnt think you where ignoring me. after all, you where addressing my posts. After a LONG night at the fox lastnight, apologies for the capslock.

there has been some long drawn out debate about a local sub victory. at thsi point im pretty much at the point of using brown/

and just to throw another spanner in the works, here is another post ive made after doing some investigation into the matter.

Yes, i say to use amber, but there is a reason why

http://www.aussiehomebrewer.com/forum//ind...&pid=622614

 

[SG9090]

Many thanks to everyones comments, they are appreciated.
For the record im going to give the Dingemans Biscuit.
Once again thanks all!!!

 

[sipourit]

If I were you I would also do the same. Though Dingemans Biscuit is really great. I've still search for another good sub for victory but I haven't found one.